1. #5721
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    No aspects. Democratize power. The Aspects were objectively a failure. Why should so much power be concentrated on one person? Keep an Aspect as a leader of the flight but spread the power around to the entire flight, empowering them all (and perhaps that way fixing their sterility?)
    But then what of all the whole narrative of the expansion to reinstaure the Aspects power? That would have been all for nothing? Should the same thing happened to other flights as well? I get your point, it it was shared with other dragons, it would make sense.

    I was lowkey hoping for a triumvirat with Ebyssian, Sabellian and Wrathion sharing the power, but I couldn't imagine it would last forever either

  2. #5722
    Quote Originally Posted by Fahrad Wagner View Post
    But then what of all the whole narrative of the expansion to reinstaure the Aspects power? That would have been all for nothing? Should the same thing happened to other flights as well? I get your point, it it was shared with other dragons, it would make sense.

    I was lowkey hoping for a triumvirat with Ebyssian, Sabellian and Wrathion sharing the power, but I couldn't imagine it would last forever either
    All the story about reinstating the Aspects is because they are needed to defeat the Primals. But . . . are they? We got Raszageth down and none of them showed up. Maybe Kalecgos fought in canon but again, that's a maybe. Tyr is going to wake up and find that of the five people he chose, two went mad and tried to destroy the world (and Neltharion got real close) before being killed, another got corrupted pretty easily and had to be put down, the fourth is predetermined to go against his duty in the future (and corrupt Tyr himself). So . .. maybe he needs to try it a different way. It's very much a classic "The Aspect power we sought was the friends we made along the way"

  3. #5723
    Seeing how we don’t fight Murozond in the mega dungeon and instead fight Iridikron, then I’m going to pivot and go back to my original prediction that next expansion will indeed be Ancient Kalimdor, with Murozond being the final boss of this expansion and the lead in to getting us to an Ancient Kalimdor expansion.

    Iridikron I imagine is another set up to be an overarching villain spanning several expansions and stories of Warcraft, similar to what they’re doing with Azshara, Denathrius and Xal’atath.

    The mega dungeon focusing mostly on past Eastern Kingdoms as opposed to past Kalimdor based segments seems quite telling. Also, I may be looking into this too much but the Kalimdor Grand Prix seems indicative of something. Having us spend some time in the current Kalimdor seems like it could be a precursor to something new regarding the continent at some point.

    Predictions are as it stands:

    The Dream sees an all out invasion by both the Primalists, decay forces and Murozond with the infinites. Murozond wishes to access the original blueprints of Azeroth to remake Azeroth into a world of his own desire by going back to a fresh slate of “where it all began” so to speak. Iridikron wishes to continue his path of devouring more essences and cosmic powers. He devours Gakakrond’s essence in the dungeon, absorbing his decay. He now wants to devour the essence of the Dream and absorb the power of life. Vyranoth realises he’s gone too far and defects over to the side of the heroes. Fyrakk’s exposure to shadow flame continues to drive him mad and mimics Deathwings descent into the void and madness.

    Status of the Primal Aspects after DF:

    Iridikron - overarching villain who wishes to devour the essence of all the cosmic forces. Will likely have the power of Decay and Life after Dragonflighg is over. Could be our link to future cosmic expansions as he looks to devour the Light, Order, Fel and Void cosmic powers.

    Fyrakk - links with the void and Old Gods. Could end up being a lieutenant of Xal’atath in a void focused expansion.

    Vyranoth - could go either way. Could become a new ally of the aspects and heroes. Could end up leading what remains of the Primalists as she genuinely does believe in the Primalists vision.

    I do genuinely see an Ancient Kalimdor expansion coming. Azshara would likely be the main antagonist here and we see a pre-sundered Kalimdor with Zin-Ashari in all its glory. Xal’atath, the Black Empire and Fyrakk could also play a part. Azshara could be trying to prevent the War of the Ancients to stop the downfall of her Empire.

    Going off what we’ve learned in Dragonflight, as well as previous expansions this leaves us with a potential list of upcoming expansion storylines and focus:

    Avaloren
    South Seas (Undermine, Plunder Isle, Hiji, Ogrezonia)
    Tel’abim
    Admiral Nightsquall
    Khaz Algar/Underground Azeroth
    Yrel and the Lightbound
    Void
    Denathrius and the Nathrezim
    Iridikron and his quest for ultimate power over the cosmic powers.

    The future is looking bright.

  4. #5724
    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Man View Post
    If we face iridikron from the past there's no way we are fighting current iridikron until like 11.0
    I thought that was current Iridikron, given he is already empowered by Earth. Might be wrong though.
    I do also think that this means we won't fight him again this xpac.

    Never done a mega-dungeon before, hopefully my casual ass can get into one as this one looks interesting.

  5. #5725
    Unsurprisingly, Iridrikon is an ally of Murozond and Galakrond and is just yet another puppet of the Old Gods. Just as I predicted.

  6. #5726
    Quote Originally Posted by Wangming View Post
    Well, this patch update certainly confirmed a whole bunch of stuff we have been speculating. Poor demon hunter is back to being the only class with just two specs.
    I hope they fix that in the future...

  7. #5727
    Btw is one of the three drakes we fight in the Blight of Galakrond encounter Alex and Ysera's brother?

  8. #5728
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    All the story about reinstating the Aspects is because they are needed to defeat the Primals. But . . . are they? We got Raszageth down and none of them showed up. Maybe Kalecgos fought in canon but again, that's a maybe. Tyr is going to wake up and find that of the five people he chose, two went mad and tried to destroy the world (and Neltharion got real close) before being killed, another got corrupted pretty easily and had to be put down, the fourth is predetermined to go against his duty in the future (and corrupt Tyr himself). So . .. maybe he needs to try it a different way. It's very much a classic "The Aspect power we sought was the friends we made along the way"
    Fair point indeed!

  9. #5729
    Quote Originally Posted by Fahrad Wagner View Post
    Fair point indeed!
    I just want Odyn to meet Tyr simply so grandpa firebeard can go "I told you so"

  10. #5730
    Quote Originally Posted by Fahrad Wagner View Post
    Sabellian and Wrathion are as entitled and immature as one can be... I see no alternative?
    The main issue is that their entitlement and immaturity, although present, was exaggerated to a remarkably intense degree through most of Dragonflight and especially throughout 10.1. Ebyssian has done nothing to really earn the position other than be portrayed normally among two others whose flaws were exaggerated beyond the threshold of what is reasonable.

  11. #5731
    Quote Originally Posted by Scyth View Post
    I thought that was current Iridikron, given he is already empowered by Earth. Might be wrong though.
    I do also think that this means we won't fight him again this xpac.

    Never done a mega-dungeon before, hopefully my casual ass can get into one as this one looks interesting.
    The hardest part of Megadungeons is always to find a group that wants to do it, without it just being a pug that gets annoyed if you don't know every strat immediately.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  12. #5732
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I just want Odyn to meet Tyr simply so grandpa firebeard can go "I told you so"
    With every step and every attempt to slander him, Odyn becomes more and more correct. The Dragons he refused to empower almost destroyed the world multiple times while failing to prevent a single threat not caused by other dragons. He chained Helya sure, but she literally signed on to work for the Turbo-Devil.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  13. #5733
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    The main issue is that their entitlement and immaturity, although present, was exaggerated to a remarkably intense degree through most of Dragonflight and especially throughout 10.1. Ebyssian has done nothing to really earn the position other than be portrayed normally among two others whose flaws were exaggerated beyond the threshold of what is reasonable.
    Ebyssian has done nothing to really be a leader for the black dragons except not being Sabellian or Wrathion. Emberthal is by far the better choice. It would work narratively, it would tie the Dracthyr to the Black Dragons, and it would show that we have actually had some forward momentum with the whole casually racist dragons angle we saw in Valdrakken.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  14. #5734
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    With every step and every attempt to slander him, Odyn becomes more and more correct. The Dragons he refused to empower almost destroyed the world multiple times while failing to prevent a single threat not caused by other dragons. He chained Helya sure, but she literally signed on to work for the Turbo-Devil.
    Eh, I'd say Helya was a bit of an overreach, provided that she only ended up in Turbo-Devil territory precisely because of her condition. Certainly still her bad decision,—one for which she is culpable,—but one that obviously has roots in Odyn's mistreatment of her. Conversely, it is noteworthy how fucking incompetent Tyr's Dragonflights turned out and how effective just letting Azeroth semi-autonomously expunge threats has been.

  15. #5735
    On to something different for a change though? What are peoples opinion on the whole Vortex Pinnacle redesign? It definitely suffers a bad case of overthinking mechanics, but as an experiment in remaking old dungeons I think it's quite interesting. It's not as great as remaking a dungeon completely like what we had in MoP and what not, but it's interesting nonetheless.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  16. #5736
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Ebyssian has done nothing to really be a leader for the black dragons except not being Sabellian or Wrathion. Emberthal is by far the better choice. It would work narratively, it would tie the Dracthyr to the Black Dragons, and it would show that we have actually had some forward momentum with the whole casually racist dragons angle we saw in Valdrakken.
    I still find Emberthal to be the worst possible choice on effectively every other level than tying in a race that nobody really wanted into the lore. I think that she simply lacks much gravitas as a Dragon Aspect, too, provided that her whole shtick is more as a soldier and leader than a guardian of some kind of lofty concept and the world as a whole. I figure Wrathion has made himself out to be the better guardian of Azeroth, whereas Sabellian has historically seemed the more responsible and sensible, as well as being a leader specifically among Dragons. That, and it would really just be insufferable to have to be exposed to the writers' newest Mary Sue they introduced out of nowhere and have her swoop in just to snatch such a relevant position from under the noses of better characters.

  17. #5737
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    I still find Emberthal to be the worst possible choice on effectively every other level than tying in a race that nobody really wanted into the lore. I think that she simply lacks much gravitas as a Dragon Aspect, too, provided that her whole shtick is more as a soldier and leader than a guardian of some kind of lofty concept and the world as a whole. I figure Wrathion has made himself out to be the better guardian of Azeroth, whereas Sabellian has historically seemed the more responsible and sensible, as well as being a leader specifically among Dragons. That, and it would really just be insufferable to have to be exposed to the writers' newest Mary Sue they introduced out of nowhere and have her swoop in just to snatch such a relevant position from under the noses of better characters.
    Regardless I would say Emberthal is a better choice than Ebyssian. At least she actually has a reluctant leader plotline going.
    Maybe Adamanthia can be the new aspect. Just cut the knot on the whole issue altogether.

    On a sidenote. Please don't refer to Emberthal as a Mary Sue. That massively cheapens the term. She is a a character with little depth, not a character with no flaws. There is a difference.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  18. #5738
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Ebyssian has done nothing to really be a leader for the black dragons except not being Sabellian or Wrathion. Emberthal is by far the better choice. It would work narratively, it would tie the Dracthyr to the Black Dragons, and it would show that we have actually had some forward momentum with the whole casually racist dragons angle we saw in Valdrakken.
    If anything, Emberthal should sign up with Ebyssian long-term, akin to the original dracthyr and Neltharion, with the caveat that it's a more productive relationship rather than a master-slave one. Ebyssian's biggest problem is that he's just kind of a nice dude, which isn't very interesting. Black Dragons need an edge. Sabellian and Wrathion have it, Ebyssian doesn't.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  19. #5739
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    I still find Emberthal to be the worst possible choice on effectively every other level than tying in a race that nobody really wanted into the lore
    I get that but we got it anyway. So it should stay relevant (it's not true for so many other races but just cause they fuck up with others doesn't mean they should keep at it). Dracthyr won't be afforded multiple important NPCs, they pretty much will get Emberthal and that's it. So they need to give her an important role in the story. The Dracthyr don't really control any important lands like other racial leaders so she needs some buy in for the rest of the story of Warcraft. Making her Aspect keeps her relevant for a long time and with her, the Dracthyr.

  20. #5740
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    Eh, I'd say Helya was a bit of an overreach, provided that she only ended up in Turbo-Devil territory precisely because of her condition. Certainly still her bad decision,—one for which she is culpable,—but one that obviously has roots in Odyn's mistreatment of her. Conversely, it is noteworthy how fucking incompetent Tyr's Dragonflights turned out and how effective just letting Azeroth semi-autonomously expunge threats has been.
    I'm being partly facetious re: Helya. I'm not being facetious at all re: the dragons though.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

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