1. #6241
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxan View Post
    I think they will probably try to do both, what you're referring to with the scarlet crusade: a cosmic light vs void expansion using forces on azeroth. Was there a hint that iridikron is making a deal with the light? I heard that somewhere, can't remember though. Void seems to make more sense but idk.
    People were basing that on a cinematic. Iridikron is just using typical earth magic, not light magic.

    That said, yes I do see the next major enemy in WoW being light-based. The void as an enemy is rather tired, and having a light based enemy would push the point that there are no “good” or “evil” cosmic forces.

    The avatar of this cosmic force?



    EDIT: There is also talk that Yrel’s army is the new Burning Legion, only light-based instead of demon-Fel based, since both were created to defeat the void.

    Interestingly, both are largely commanded by Draenei twisted by cosmic forces.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2023-05-21 at 03:58 PM.

  2. #6242
    Scarab Lord MCMLXXXII's Avatar
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    He maybe right once in a while just like a broken clock is right twice a day. It's just annoying because every time he enters a thread It's only to promote his fanfic and always ends up in endless discussions why his fanfic is really going to happen and every one else is just wrong. His constant promoting isn't just annoying, it takes the life out of every single thread he enters.

  3. #6243
    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    He maybe right once in a while just like a broken clock is right twice a day. It's just annoying because every time he enters a thread It's only to promote his fanfic and always ends up in endless discussions why his fanfic is really going to happen and every one else is just wrong. His constant promoting isn't just annoying, it takes the life out of every single thread he enters.
    While dismissing any other suggested options based on grounds his own fanfic would be subject to as well, no less.

  4. #6244
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    He maybe right once in a while just like a broken clock is right twice a day. It's just annoying because every time he enters a thread It's only to promote his fanfic and always ends up in endless discussions why his fanfic is really going to happen and every one else is just wrong. His constant promoting isn't just annoying, it takes the life out of every single thread he enters.
    Promoting fanfic is kinda the whole point of speculation, this posting style might be annoying but it’s fully on topic and people just need to not reply to him if they don’t want to speculation on his specific topic.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  5. #6245
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    While dismissing any other suggested options based on grounds his own fanfic would be subject to as well, no less.
    Sorry, but ETC fighting Murmur shouldn’t be held to the same level of possible expansion legitimacy as a Yrel/Lightbound invasion, or an Undermine expansion.

  6. #6246
    Anyone else find it strange they brought back Salandria at the end of Shadowlands but her and Lornaa are seemingly absent from Dragonflight so far?

    Maybe they will pop up in 10.1.5 but I really want to finally know why the bronze dragons perceived them as being so dangerous.

  7. #6247
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    I do think that another ground to earth “return to home” expansion would be really nice for a 20th anniversary expansion. Then they could revamp the old world for max level content, while keeping the cata zones around using Zidormi/Chromie time.
    Will it happen? Probably not.

    Unfortunately I’m expecting it to be another huge cosmic “light vs void” expansion involving races like the Ethereals, mainly because of Ion’s hints to them and their history with the void… and all the new stuff with the “cosmic void”

    Though if blizzard wanted they COULD still make an expansion like that a little more “grounded”
    It could have reformed scarlet crusade could definitely happen on the “light” side of that expansion.
    With one of the factions of Ethereals being on the “Void” side.
    I feel like current writers are better at creating more "simple" stories, than something crazy and big like the cosmic VoidvsLight stuff, we might end up with another "wait and see" fiasco because they won't even bother explaining most of it, like SL.

    There's a lot of things that they could create in some revamped old world zones.
    Maybe create something like "race campaigns" similar to Class halls, that would as introduction for new players and also as end game content plus new customization options, armor sets etc that come with it.

    I would love to do some world quests in Dun Morogh or Elwynn forest for example, let me beat up some new kobold gang.

    It's that one thing that i wish wow had - content in older zones, like in other MMO's like GW2 or ESO, i don't know how it is done in FFXIV so i can't say anything about that one.

    But probably we will never see that.
    Last edited by ImTheMizAwesome; 2023-05-21 at 05:13 PM.

  8. #6248
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImTheMizAwesome View Post
    I feel like current writers are better at creating more "simple" stories, than something crazy and big like the cosmic Void, light stuff, we might end up with another "wait and see" fiasco because they won't even bother explaining most of it, like SL.

    There's a lot of things that they could create in some revamped old world zones.
    Maybe create something like "race campaigns" similar to Class halls, that would as introduction for new players and also as end game content plus new customization options, armor sets etc that come with it.

    I would love to do some world quests in Dun Morogh or Elwynn forest.
    It was less that they couldn't handle it, more like having to deal with the aftermath of a decision they weren't entirely on board and out of the loop of(Teldrassil burning) and well what we learned behind the scenes.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance #TeamNoBlueHorde

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  9. #6249
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    Promoting fanfic is kinda the whole point of speculation, this posting style might be annoying but it’s fully on topic and people just need to not reply to him if they don’t want to speculation on his specific topic.
    Exactly, you can always ignore, heck add the code on your adblock addon and you don't even see the posts.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ImTheMizAwesome View Post
    I feel like current writers are better at creating more "simple" stories, than something crazy and big like the cosmic VoidvsLight stuff, we might end up with another "wait and see" fiasco because they won't even bother explaining most of it, like SL.
    I think what you are seeing is simply division of labour. Level design and stories that occur at that level are down the hierarchy. The overarching narrative is probably the job of the people at the top; main storylines and cinematics. So the devs are still relatively good it's just their bosses that are poor at mediocre.

  10. #6250
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    It was less that they couldn't handle it, more like having to deal with the aftermath of a decision they weren't entirely on board and out of the loop of(Teldrassil burning) and well what we learned behind the scenes.
    Yet we are seeing them continue to make the same mistakes as BfA and Shadowlands with the whole "wait and see" approach to the Primalist's motivations.

    Sometimes inept writers are just inept.

  11. #6251
    Herald of the Titans Nightshade711's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxan View Post
    I think they will probably try to do both, what you're referring to with the scarlet crusade: a cosmic light vs void expansion using forces on azeroth. Was there a hint that iridikron is making a deal with the light? I heard that somewhere, can't remember though. Void seems to make more sense but idk.

    I’d love to see the return of classic villains like the Scarlet Crusade. They’d make much more sense than the speculated “Yrel invasion from an alternate timeline” imo. Especially if we are successful in preventing Nozdormu’s corruption.
    I will be excited to see what role the Ethereals would have. I wonder what a “holy” Ethereal would look like. Given their story of how their world was destroyed it would make sense for some of them to turn to the light.

    I think the theory that Iridikron is using The Light was because he was essentially a “mirror” of Neltharion in a way and just because of how he looks.
    Though narratively I think it would be interesting if he was meant to be a mirror of Deathwing, but with the light instead of void.
    Last edited by Nightshade711; 2023-05-21 at 05:32 PM.
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  12. #6252
    Quote Originally Posted by Khaza-R View Post
    Yet we are seeing them continue to make the same mistakes as BfA and Shadowlands with the whole "wait and see" approach to the Primalist's motivations.

    Sometimes inept writers are just inept.
    There's nothing really mysterious about their motive, they want to kill the Aspects and then return the world to its [pre-Titan, pre-Old God state of elemental chaos because they're assholes. They're not exactly Raskolnikov. Raz says as much on either her second or third line.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  13. #6253
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    I’d love to see the return of classic villains like the Scarlet Crusade. They’d make much more sense than the speculated “Yrel invasion from an alternate timeline” imo. Especially if we are successful in preventing Nozdormu’s corruption.

    I think the theory that Iridikron is using The Light was because he was essentially a “mirror” of Neltharion in a way and just because of how he looks.
    Though narratively I think it would be interesting if he was meant to be a mirror of Deathwing, but with the light instead of void.
    Honestly I'd like Yrel because it might be mirrored by some lore on the Azerothian Draenei. Like, O'ros died. Would that mean the Draenei would build a new Auchindoun to bury him? Would perhaps the Council of Exarchs be reformed?

  14. #6254
    I'd like Yrel because the Space Goat Jihad is cool.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  15. #6255
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    There's nothing really mysterious about their motive, they want to kill the Aspects and then return the world to its [pre-Titan, pre-Old God state of elemental chaos because they're assholes. They're not exactly Raskolnikov. Raz says as much on either her second or third line.
    Does Iridikron actually want that or does he just want power and he uses this ideology to manipulate the others (well Vyranoth, Fyrakk is just a classic hungry dragon and Rasz was a zealot)? And if he does want that, how is he planning to accomplish that? Because killing the Aspects doesn't actually do much; they are useless anyway.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    I'd like Yrel because the Space Goat Jihad is cool.
    That too. Especially given it would have lightbound/lightforged orcs, ogres and arakkoa with it. Plus depending on how smart and diplomatic Yrel is, she could get a decent portion of the Alliance and even some of the Horde (Liadrin, Calia) at her side. So we'd actually have some conflict and the type that could find adequate resolution.

  16. #6256
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Does Iridikron actually want that or does he just want power and he uses this ideology to manipulate the others (well Vyranoth, Fyrakk is just a classic hungry dragon and Rasz was a zealot)? And if he does want that, how is he planning to accomplish that? Because killing the Aspects doesn't actually do much; they are useless anyway.
    I mean, even that isn't exactly very complicated to grasp. It's fairly telegraphed he's an Old God puppet or just self-serving. As for how they go about doing it, that's not exactly an ambiguity in motive worth calling a mystery box or even being a particular point of importance. It's not like the Legion in Legion became confusing because we weren't sure what plot device they'd use, wanting to destroy the world because they're evil demons is fairly self-explanatory, as is doing so because they're evil dragons.

    The game isn't playing coy with them. They're as straight forward as it gets villain-wise. The whole vague villain business is a false start in criticism, because it's not villains in general it affects. It was Sylvanas and because she was the only one moving the plot along and the writers didn't even know what she wanted to do for most of her screentime and hwen they ultimately decided it was retarded. The Bald Man was never bad because he was somehow vague - the first thing he tells us is he wants to kill everyone and he's running a bondage dimension. Nor did we lose anything because we didn't know the obtuse rube-goldberg machine he needed in order to complete that objective. It's because he had zero stage presence, no memorable lines, barely any screentime, no sensible relationship with any other characters, was hamhandedly shoehorned into the plot and the writers didn't even know what his personality was. Also his design was boring (twice).
    Last edited by Super Dickmann; 2023-05-21 at 05:43 PM.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  17. #6257
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    There's nothing really mysterious about their motive, they want to kill the Aspects and then return the world to its [pre-Titan, pre-Old God state of elemental chaos because they're assholes. They're not exactly Raskolnikov. Raz says as much on either her second or third line.
    I would agree if they didn't ramble on about how the titans or order magic are bad. They are clearly trying to make some justification for their motivations which have not been explored whatsoever. So far it just makes them very nonsensical as villains.

  18. #6258
    Quote Originally Posted by Khaza-R View Post
    I would agree if they didn't ramble on about how the titans or order magic are bad. They are clearly trying to make some justification for their motivations which have not been explored whatsoever. So far it just makes them very nonsensical as villains.
    Their grievance isn't obscure either, it's also spelled out by every Primalist Tom, Dick and Harry. They're upset about the Titans because they're interlopers who imposed their order upon the existing world, shifting it towards their preferences, up to and including charging dragonkind with defending a bunch of flabby mortals rather than ruling the world as apex predators. It's not deep but neither is it vague.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  19. #6259
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    Their grievance isn't obscure either, it's also spelled out by every Primalist Tom, Dick and Harry. They're upset about the Titans because they're interlopers who imposed their order upon the existing world, shifting it towards their preferences, up to and including charging dragonkind with defending a bunch of flabby mortals rather than ruling the world as apex predators. It's not deep but neither is it vague.
    Which makes no sense because the world before the titans was violent, chaotic and full of ritualistic sacrifice. Not some utopia.

    Its entirely possible they are building towards some subversive plot where the titans are liars and what we think we know about Azeroth before their ordering is false. In fact I think they tried to even hint as such with one of the Uldaman books. But again that goes make to my original point that they are repeating the same mistakes yet again.

  20. #6260
    Quote Originally Posted by Khaza-R View Post
    Which makes no sense because the world before the titans was violent, chaotic and full of ritualistic sacrifice. Not some utopia.

    Its entirely possible they are building towards some subversive plot where the titans are liars and what we think we know about Azeroth before their ordering is false. In fact I think they tried to even hint as such with one of the Uldaman books. But again that goes make to my original point that they are repeating the same mistakes yet again.
    How does it make no sense? We've social darwinists in reality, let alone the transparent logic of why if you're the apex predator, one of the four strongest beings in the world, you'd much prefer a world where you can do as you please and you'd be upset if some dickheads dropped in and told you that you should instead dedicate your life to being the professional nannies to people who'd otherwise appeal to you for strength or you could kill off on a whim. The violence and chaos of the world are features, not bugs.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

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