1. #7321
    Elemental Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    That is literally the same lake where Holy Paladins and Arms warriors get their artifact weapons. You know where Tyr left his hammer for apparent reasons and later the first human king came to finish the job.
    And shadow priests yes.

  2. #7322
    Pandaren Monk Worldshaper's Avatar
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    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?

    I expected her to be a leading lady, a bold and active character who pushed the story forward and guided us along numerous adventures on the Isles, as we rebuild the five flights' power.

    But she's really bland, just sitting there atop Valdrakken and sending us on errands.

    She did have something to do during 10.1 and the main campaign, but since then she's really taken a backseat.

    Anyway. I'm still hoping the returns trimphantly to the frontlines someday soon.

    8.2 - Emerald Dream.
    8.3 - Alex needs to save Azeroth or something along those lines.

  3. #7323
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?

    I expected her to be a leading lady, a bold and active character who pushed the story forward and guided us along numerous adventures on the Isles, as we rebuild the five flights' power.

    But she's really bland, just sitting there atop Valdrakken and sending us on errands.

    She did have something to do during 10.1 and the main campaign, but since then she's really taken a backseat.

    Anyway. I'm still hoping the returns trimphantly to the frontlines someday soon.

    8.2 - Emerald Dream.
    8.3 - Alex needs to save Azeroth or something along those lines.
    Well the recent questline definitely gives her a very interesting story; Zakazj was able to predict the fate of each other Aspect (because the Void sees all possible futures?) and says even Alex will turn against Tyr. Ofc it could be lying. But it is enough for there to be doubt. Imagine when Tyr comes back and learns that every fate Zakazj described turned out to come true (and how the dragonflights failed cataclysmically at pretty much every task assigned to them)

  4. #7324
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?
    so like bolvar?
    or sylv/anduin prior to that...

  5. #7325
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?

    I expected her to be a leading lady, a bold and active character who pushed the story forward and guided us along numerous adventures on the Isles, as we rebuild the five flights' power.

    But she's really bland, just sitting there atop Valdrakken and sending us on errands.

    She did have something to do during 10.1 and the main campaign, but since then she's really taken a backseat.

    Anyway. I'm still hoping the returns trimphantly to the frontlines someday soon.

    8.2 - Emerald Dream.
    8.3 - Alex needs to save Azeroth or something along those lines.
    She has been very disappointing thus far, I agree. Her fight with Rasz was cool but other than that not much of note.
    Hopefully she has a bigger role to play in the remaining patches

  6. #7326
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Well the recent questline definitely gives her a very interesting story; Zakazj was able to predict the fate of each other Aspect (because the Void sees all possible futures?) and says even Alex will turn against Tyr. Ofc it could be lying. But it is enough for there to be doubt. Imagine when Tyr comes back and learns that every fate Zakazj described turned out to come true (and how the dragonflights failed cataclysmically at pretty much every task assigned to them)
    Could also be a self-fulfilling prophecy in that manner, though. She turns against Tyr because Tyr jumped the gun and simply assumed she is evil now.

    Though overall i'd say the Dragonflights are mostly neutral. Especially compared to Odyn's attempts at safeguarding Azeroth, which mostly came down to 1) getting himself locked in and 2) playing a major role in enabling the Janitor to cause the Shadowlands crisis, with little to nothing to show for it.


    The Keepers have a pretty bad track record overall... especially as things go up the totem pole. Ra-den got himself locked up and drained and later void corrupted, Odyn made a total mess of things all on his own, Loken collaborated with the Old Gods...
    Last edited by huth; 2023-05-31 at 12:00 PM.

  7. #7327
    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    Oh right, Twilight's Hammer was using her to Resurrect Zakajz. Wonder when Paladins got into the Tomb? First or last? We know Warriors came before Priest because removing the sword made the resurrection attempt possible.
    I believe chronologically it goes Arms Warriors (kills Zakajz), Shadow Priests (truly kills Zakajz), Holy Paladins (retrieves the Silver Hand, tomb collapses).

  8. #7328
    I am Murloc! KOUNTERPARTS's Avatar
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    It sounds like Grom Hellscream's voice actor is voicing Tyr. I can't hear anything but Grom when Tyr speaks, lmao

  9. #7329
    Quote Originally Posted by Utsuko View Post
    I think the reason Alexstrasza turns against Tyr is when she learns that it was Tyr himself who corrupted the waters of Uldorus with Order magic that imbues the eggs she keeps in the Ruby Life Pools and that she finally understands the motivations of the primalists. Therefore, she feels manipulated/betrayed.
    From my understanding, that's common knowledge among the Aspects. So that wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.

    It could even refer to Infini-Tyr from the Megadungeon. The Void does not differentiate between possible timelines.

  10. #7330
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?

    I expected her to be a leading lady, a bold and active character who pushed the story forward and guided us along numerous adventures on the Isles, as we rebuild the five flights' power.
    The issue is that Alexstrasza never had a gleaming personality to begin with; the Dragon Aspects are all rather bland, but Alexstrasza quite near most of all.

  11. #7331
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    The issue is that Alexstrasza never had a gleaming personality to begin with; the Dragon Aspects are all rather bland, but Alexstrasza quite near most of all.
    When i was reading about alexstrasza it was mostly comments about her thighs and people calling her "mommy".

    Edit: Just to add more, i guess what i meant by that is people hardly ever even spoke about her personality, besides referring to things i said above.

    For me at least kalecgos so far, feels like has the best personality of them all, like storywise i think that's the aspect at least my character could relate to the most.
    Last edited by ImTheMizAwesome; 2023-05-31 at 01:31 PM.

  12. #7332
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I think the fight would be very different when we fight an Odyn who wants to murder us. I expect him to be the meanest bastard ever.
    I doubt he'd be much of a challenge.

  13. #7333
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?

    I expected her to be a leading lady, a bold and active character who pushed the story forward and guided us along numerous adventures on the Isles, as we rebuild the five flights' power.

    But she's really bland, just sitting there atop Valdrakken and sending us on errands.
    Other then throwing hands with deathwing twice she’s kinds always been this way sending us to deal with Malyigos and only shown up after he’s dead, letting the wrath gate go down and just clearing the blight, sending other reds to try and uncorrupt black eggs while she sits around, ect.

    She’s never been all that active.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  14. #7334
    Quote Originally Posted by Utsuko View Post
    How did you understand this? According to the Uldaman books, this is secret information.
    The First Ones are secret. This would be pretty obvious even if nobody openly stated it. Order does not show up like that naturally. So at best, it would have been an open secret.

    It's also fairly clear that Odyn and the other keepers don't always see eye to eye, and he was out of commission for a very long time.

  15. #7335
    It seems pretty clear to me that the reason they are holding back on Alex, besides her being the "mascot", is that her character arc seems to start with her having unwavering resolve and faith in the Aspect system and Tyr.

    Now that it's foreshadowed that she will "betray" Tyr (which I don't think is a ruse, considering the void guy was accurate with everything else), her arc is going to turn to "wait maybe the system ISN'T that great". This is already starting with the Dragonkin rebellion plotline.

    Alex will go against Tyr in some way, likely for our benefit. I think Tyr is going to come back and realize that all the other aspects failing = his experiment was a failure and they can't trust Alex to NOT get corrupted. So maybe he tries to roboticize her, or turns her over to Odyn?

  16. #7336
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Man, anyone else disappointed with Alexstrasza thus far?.
    No, but only because I had zero expectations of her. DF's biggest hurdle was and is the fact that the friendly dragons are all dull as dishwater. And unlike Bolvar or Thrall who did have a time where they worked as characters, or Khadgar, who became someone who could carry a fun story after previously being Blandalf the Blue, Alex and Company were always dull.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    My personal opinion is that the best WoW plots are those which emerge as subplots and digressions. The general pattern among the opinions I've observed places Ulduar, Throne of Thunder, and Mechagon as the best stories of their respective expansions—at least insofar as the story goes—and I'm quite inclined to agree. These digressions seem to enable the writers to indulge their creativity in absence of the generally-mediocre expansion plots, enabling something beyond the degree of quality we've become accustomed to.
    Agreed, not much to add, save that it speaks volumes that the returning BFA plot to come back in DF was the mechagnome takeover, and that said gnome comic had a better villain and plot than the actual main story.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  17. #7337
    Definitely feel like the MSQ has been ordained by higher-ups to be generic and "easily digestible" for mass audiences, likely because it's the only story they see in the game (through youtube or through casual play). You can see how the side quests like the Orc Heritage and Blue Dragon questlines are created by insane lore nerds in comparison.

  18. #7338
    Quote Originally Posted by Utsuko View Post
    How did you understand this? According to the Uldaman books, this is secret information.
    That's actually unknown. Pretty sure Alexstrasza is at least somewhat aware of the Order Magic stuff. Danuser clarifies the Order Magic in the waters regardless, so even IF Alexstrasza knew of it all, I doubt she would care, as the Waters don't really brainwash the eggs or anything like that.

    Also, regarding the secrecy stuff, the only real thing that's kept secret is the stuff regarding the Progenitors, hence why Chronicle makes no mention of them, and assumes that Light and Void's clash birthed the Cosmos (Or just the Dark Beyond, cause Order also limited the scope of the Cosmos cause Odyn and co thought Mortals couldn't handle such a massive Cosmos) which we now know is half true at best, as they did aid in the birthing of the Cosmos in a way, but we now know that all 6 Forces were involved in the Cosmos' birth, with the First Ones making and balancing them.

  19. #7339
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Definitely feel like the MSQ has been ordained by higher-ups to be generic and "easily digestible" for mass audiences, likely because it's the only story they see in the game (through youtube or through casual play). You can see how the side quests like the Orc Heritage and Blue Dragon questlines are created by insane lore nerds in comparison.
    It doesn't take an insane lore nerd to browse through the wowpedia entry for Notable Blue Dragons or Orc Clans.

  20. #7340
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Definitely feel like the MSQ has been ordained by higher-ups to be generic and "easily digestible" for mass audiences, likely because it's the only story they see in the game (through youtube or through casual play). You can see how the side quests like the Orc Heritage and Blue Dragon questlines are created by insane lore nerds in comparison.
    Reminds me of 9.2, with the main story being generic asf, only for the Firim stuff and the Cypher Lore Codex ordeals to be full of actual lore stuff which better understands the nature of the Progenitors, the nature of the Forces, and places such as the Zereths, etc.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    It doesn't take an insane lore nerd to browse through the wowpedia entry for Notable Blue Dragons or Orc Clans.
    Yeah, but the thing is that not everyone is gonna do that. Hell, I doubt a majority of the player base knew of Kirygosa prior to DF.

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