1. #10201
    Quote Originally Posted by Nibelheimy View Post
    That's if the book is even about Azshara, I've read it multiple times. It's also plausible the queen is Xal'atath and the harbinger Iridikron, and considering the person in the silhouette is 99% Xal'atath. I wouldn't count any chickens just yet.
    You are doing some pretty elaborate mental gymnastics if you are arguing that a Naga manifesto is saying "Our Queen" but actually doesn't mean Azshara, it means Xal'atath, a person who has never once been called queen anywhere.

  2. #10202
    Before being set free from the blade, Xal'atath was in the possession of a group of naga. It then had to be brought to Azshara later by Nathanos. I wonder why she didn't already have it and some nameless naga did? It was certainly central to her plans for N'zoth.

    Not all Naga follow Azshara as we've seen. If Xal'atath was Indeed a old god originally, she would of certainly been known as a queen amongst the black empire.

    I appreciate you trying to jam the pieces of the puzzle we have into a definate story right now, but there's a lot more puzzle pieces to come.

    Its not elaborate mental gymnastics to suggest there's more than one possibility to a story thread in a World of warcraft patch speculation thread.

  3. #10203
    Quote Originally Posted by Nibelheimy View Post
    Before being set free from the blade, Xal'atath was in the possession of a group of naga. It then had to be brought to Azshara later by Nathanos. I wonder why she didn't already have it and some nameless naga did? It was certainly central to her plans for N'zoth.

    Not all Naga follow Azshara as we've seen. If Xal'atath was Indeed a old god originally, she would of certainly been known as a queen amongst the black empire.

    I appreciate you trying to jam the pieces of the puzzle we have into a definate story right now, but there's a lot more puzzle pieces to come.

    Its not elaborate mental gymnastics to suggest there's more than one possibility to a story thread in a World of warcraft patch speculation thread.
    You are the one attempting to jam pieces here.

    "Here is a NAGA text talking about "THEIR QUEEN", I wonder what name goes in this blank spot?"
    "Xal'atath!!! Cause maybe there was some unheard of group of rogue Naga who didn't follow Azshara and instead worship Xal'atath as a queen"

    I am calling a duck a duck.. We know that Azshara left because she was tired of dealing with "intermediaries and heralds" and was going to seek true power. She spent the previous 10,000 years up to that point working with N'zoth, the intermediary and herald of the Void. She opens a Void portal and leaves. The next time that we hear anything about the Naga, they are talking about how "their queen" is off someplace beyond the veil of shadow.

    It's pretty obvious Azshara moved on from old god shit to just straight up Void.

  4. #10204
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    It's pretty obvious Azshara moved on from old god shit to just straight up Void.
    Why not have her simply use the cosmic knowledge she acquired to act on her own entirely, using the means she learned while working for the void for so long? Azshara should be seeking power for herself and herself only.

    And I doubt Azshara is ok with just ruling Azeroth anymore now that she knows what is out there. Imo the true throne of power is probably something in a Zereth that gives her the level of power Zovaal sought. Which means we shouldn't see her plot comes to conclusion any time soon because it would be more of the same

  5. #10205
    I agree with the above. This would be more honest to her character too.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    It's pretty obvious Azshara moved on from old god shit to just straight up Void.
    By no means am I jamming anything, I am simply speculating on possibilities and not trying to force my ideas as the facts, which is contrary to what you're doing.

    I simply think if Azshara after being done over by N'zoth more than once, then being tortured by nameless N'zoth minion helplessly until generic adventurers save her. To only just then warp immediately to the big bad unknown boss in a cosmic realm we have yet to explore to suddenly assume a great deal of power to transcend with the current level of story on that is a shoddy jailer level of writing I hope we don't have to repeat.

    Especially when Xal'atath was just shown in a cinematic tease in a void portal.

  6. #10206
    I've tried comparing Xalatath body to the silhouette in the cinematic and the only thing that doesn't match are the ears, but maybe they've made a new model for Xalatath and or they simply pull down her ears

  7. #10207
    On the Umbral Veil I assume it is the transitive plane between the Physical and the Void; similar to how the Veil lies between the Physical and Azeroth (and perhaps the Nether lies between the Physical and Chaos?). We see Alleria use it a lot as well. If it is used to travel across the Physical it makes more sense for it to be coterminous similar to how it looked when we enter it in Eredath while questing with Alleria.

  8. #10208
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    You know what's a REALLY crap feeling? Flying around the Dragon Isles and feeling just how good Dragonriding is because of how vertical and HUGE the Isles are. Going back to any other continent just feels so small in comparison. I'm not looking forward to the next continent feeling "tiny".
    I prefer the smaller, much more detailed and denser zones like Suramar, Zuldazar, Mechagon as opposed to the current DF zones like the Azure Span which is a huge area of an empty landscape with mobs and objectives being scarcely scattered across the zone, merely so that you have a reason to use the 800% flying. I wish they went back to their BfA area design philosophy--as Ion once stated--to make the zones more alive, interactive and full of details mentioning Borean Tundra as a counterexample back then, where the vastness of the zone itself had nothing to add to its value, in fact, it took away from player experience when you just had to keep traveling across huge areas aimlessly without those having any meaningful impact in particular aside from increasing your travel time from one objective to another.
    I feel like with DF we just went back there and I'm praying this is not the new trend. I'd love to see detailed zones with reasonable density return in the aesthetics and details of which I can get immersed, I don't mind having zones "ground mound only" for the first few patches either--as long as they're not vast.

    In terms of dynamic flying, I'd slighty redesign it to allow higher speeds and momentum only high in the air and after x seconds of flying. I hate navigating small distances with the damn dragons, say, in Valdrakken or Loamm, dynamic flying is not fit for flying low, just above the ground or between close destinations--thus, it's rather annoying than useful in cities amd smaller outdoor structures.

  9. #10209
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    I've tried comparing Xalatath body to the silhouette in the cinematic and the only thing that doesn't match are the ears, but maybe they've made a new model for Xalatath and or they simply pull down her ears
    Now try comparing it to Azshara's model which as a Night Elf has ears at a different angle than the high elf models.

  10. #10210
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Now try comparing it to Azshara's model which as a Night Elf has ears at a different angle than the high elf models.
    I did too but it's not close enough. Though it seems I've got the angle wrong for both as the space between the torso and her left arm is different than the one on the pictures I used. I've tried doing a better match but couldn't, maybe someone else could do a better job than I did ^^


  11. #10211
    Azshara isn't an elf anymore. She's a naga with huge white tentacles sticking out from her head. Are you assuming she has gained some sort of Visage form, or why is she even a candidate for being the silhouette inside the portal? :-)

  12. #10212
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Azshara isn't an elf anymore. She's a naga with huge white tentacles sticking out from her head. Are you assuming she has gained some sort of Visage form, or why is she even a candidate for being the silhouette inside the portal? :-)
    Because she has chosen to appear in a high elf form.

  13. #10213
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Azshara isn't an elf anymore. She's a naga with huge white tentacles sticking out from her head. Are you assuming she has gained some sort of Visage form, or why is she even a candidate for being the silhouette inside the portal? :-)
    She's had both forms from the start. She shows up in Legion in regular humanoid form.

  14. #10214
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    I did too but it's not close enough. Though it seems I've got the angle wrong for both as the space between the torso and her left arm is different than the one on the pictures I used. I've tried doing a better match but couldn't, maybe someone else could do a better job than I did ^^

    I would say that is Xal'athat, as it is what makes most sense. I completely dismiss Azshara as a possibility. It is certainly possible that she is able to adopt different forms but I highly doubt that she is the one in the cinematic. Finally, while improbable, I would not discard Alleria. She is the one that seems more alike to that elven figure IMO, and she might be completely nuts by now.
    Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive.


  15. #10215
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Because she has chosen to appear in a high elf form.
    She was never High Elf though?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    She's had both forms from the start. She shows up in Legion in regular humanoid form.
    Do you have a screenshot somewhere so we can compare and see the context as well?

  16. #10216
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    Do you have a screenshot somewhere so we can compare and see the context as well?
    It's the same model as above, they didn't update it between Cata and Legion.

  17. #10217
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    As someone that dislikes cosmic planes exploration (not forces), I think they could work if they were presented by playable races' perspectives and inner conflicts; let me explain:

    In WC3 we learned about the Burning Legion and Scourge through Humans/Orcs/Elves' eyes, not through Demons/Undeads; the plague and the legion invasion started in their homeland, and the turmoil created the reason to push forward at the same time that iconic characters from the playable factions were being developed to take a role from the enemies perspective, such as Illidan (Night Elf) and Arthas (Human), that's why WC3 is so iconic.

    That's what I think WoW is missing recently, build-up. The only story that I liked in Dragonflight is the Black Dragonflight resolution because it's the only story that's following a great arc that started back in Vanilla and gave more context to characters such as Sabelian introduced in Burning Crusade, Wrathion introduced in Cataclysm, Ebyssian in Legion, and ofc Deathwing (Neltharion), but other than that, the Incarnates/Primalist plot feels weak as most of SL was... I think if Blizzard had used Twilight's Hammer instead of this new faction to give more context to these Incarnates, the story would improve a lot.

    Shadowlands announcement, for instance, I think would've been a lot more exciting if in BFA we had learned more about Zovaal and the Maw after 8.2, and instead of fighting N'zoth and the Black Empire in 8.3, we could have fought a reformed Scourge with forces mostly from Shadowlands led by Sylvanas and Nathanos, and an empowered version of Nathanos could've been the last boss, after defeating him we would learn through the cinematic that Sylvanas went to Icecrown to open the rift.

    For Shadowlands expansion itself, I think the covenants and its zones felt too out of place with so few Azerothian characters, so instead of having only a very few characters as we saw in most zones and covenants, I think the perfect scenario would be having many more Azerothian characters, but as ghosts to keep their aesthetic and resemblance, such as Kael'thas/Garrosh alongside most of their followers in Revendreth, Gronmash/Vashj/Kel'thuzad alongside most of their followers in Maldraxxus, Ysera/Caerne and most Night Elves, Tauren, and Trolls that died before BFA in Ardenweald, Uther/Tyrion/Rakeesh(Velen's Son)/Anasterian Sunstrider/Lirath Windrunner and many others that had tragic death before BFA in Bastion, and in the Maw, we would have, just for nostalgic sake, some Arthas/Lich King followers.

    But sadly we only got a few known faces here and there and a ton of stories about characters nobody gives a s**t about.

    - -

    I'm 99% sure 11.0 isn't a World Revamp at this point, so my last hope is that 11.0 focuses on the playable race's lore and how they're going to handle the new threat, instead of helping foreigns and seeing all the plot from their perspective, as we got in Shadowlands and Dragonflight.
    The problem with a scourge-centered last patch of BfA is that people already complained about Orc and Legion fatigue when they did the same with MoP>WoD and WoD>Legion. That said, I think they could have achieved foreshadowing without having a full patch themed after the Jailer. Just sprinkle a few little bits in there during Legion and BfA - f.e. mentioning Ardenweald during Val'Sharah or having Maldraxxi forces appear on Argus in some side quest.

    #TEAMGIRAFFE

  18. #10218
    I do hope Xal and Azshara's elf form get a decent update and that we might get some proper slutty gowns in this game. I need a black gown that hits the floor with long flared sleeves and a low cut neckline for my Mistress of the Dark mog and it would look great for Xal too.

  19. #10219
    Azshara isn't Void aligned or "humanity" aligned. She's Queen Azshara aligned. Always has been.

    She managed to stay perfectly sane while being closer to an Old God than Neltharion was, so the point she was completely changed physically by them. If they change that now and make her "corrupted villain #45" that would be very lame.

  20. #10220


    Looking at these two pictures, the elven portal figure seems to have the same hood and the same shoulder armor as Alleria. She even might be holding a bow or some weapon. Probably still Xal'athat, but worth taking into consideration.

    https://imgur.io/t/world_of_warcraft_legion/693Ig
    Last edited by Darkarath; 2023-07-24 at 09:01 AM.
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