1. #13421
    Like it or not, factions are still the staple of wow and i think it would be awesome to see faction content again without them being hostile to each other.

    A cinematic like the legion one where horde and alliance fights together with an enemy would be crazy, but this time without them breaking up again and fighting with each other in the end.

  2. #13422
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    I only wonder why they stopped with the Legion patch cycle of releasing the raids with the minor patch. I thought it made it easier for new patch areas to matter for all players, and the raids being offset didn't negatively impact actual time spent in a raid.
    Plus I felt it made more sense with the story; you had time with the area before the raid which is supposed to be the end of that area's story.

  3. #13423
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Familiarity.
    I compared earlier between MoP and DF, but a difference was a connection to what we had earlier. Familiar ingame characters that were also in the zones, hobnobbing with the newer. And of course the writing was far superior...and who didn't like "story time with Lorewalker Cho?" Everything that was new suddenly added to an overall familiarity that became positive. And to me, it was because of that connection to the old that was maintained ingame.
    This actually rings true. We know the Djaradin but we don't know their full origins . We don't know the connection between the Centaurs of DF and the ones on Kalimdor and whatever Blizzard can come up with is that "They're not the same, trust us." Obviously they're "different" but they're so different from each other that the Centaurs on Kalimdor didn't get model updates...

  4. #13424
    The Undying Teriz's Avatar
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    My money is on an alliance civil war next expansion.

  5. #13425
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    MoP was not "famillar" it was incredibly different, so different that people moaned that it didn't feel like Warcraft(Oh that again). It had elements that we were famillar with(We did get to see Titan related stuff but outside the two factions it was a very foriegn place).


    And f off with the Alliance inner conflict stuff. Just throwing the Horde's past two times of inner conflict onto the other faction is lazy and dumb.

    Edit: My bluntness for it is only cause I'm tired of people suggesting it when there's far better things to do with it.
    Last edited by Aeluron Lightsong; 2023-08-29 at 03:25 PM.
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  6. #13426
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    My money is on an alliance civil war next expansion.
    We're definitely going to get a hint of that with the Man'ari questline, if so. Turalyon's/Stormwind's reaction to them joining the Alliance (if that's the case) will be VERY telling.

    That questline (and to an extent the Nelf one, both in heritage and the overall Amirdrassil plot) has the potential to set the stage hard for what's to come in 11.0.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2023-08-29 at 03:20 PM.

  7. #13427
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    You must have a really poor memory.
    Just like I told the other guy: Don't flame and instead come up with arguments to support your claim. All the UI issues, Profession issues, quest bugs, etc. it was insane. Im talking purely about that. Launch was smooth lagwise, but man I've never recalled an expansion where my chat box (base UI) would resize after everytime I relogged or /reloaded. Just to give an example.
    I will not reply to posts that are non-constructive or contain flaming and/or trolling.

  8. #13428
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    And f off with the Alliance inner conflict stuff. Just throwing the Horde's past two times of inner conflict onto the other faction is lazy and dumb.
    There's nothing wrong with Alliance conflict, it just needs to be done well. I think some leaders being understandably concerned about Velen letting ex-Legion members into his city is an interesting premise. It's probably the most interesting Alliance development since Void Elves, which still hasn't paid off.

    Considering EVERYTHING Blizz has done since BFA, I really really really doubt we will see any retreads of how Garrosh/Sylvanas was handled.

  9. #13429
    Quote Originally Posted by micwini View Post
    Just like I told the other guy: Don't flame and instead come up with arguments to support your claim. All the UI issues, Profession issues, quest bugs, etc. it was insane. Im talking purely about that. Launch was smooth lagwise, but man I've never recalled an expansion where my chat box (base UI) would resize after everytime I relogged or /reloaded. Just to give an example.
    Which is nothing compared to what we had to deal with in earlier expansions. DF was comparatively pretty smooth.

  10. #13430
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    There's nothing wrong with Alliance conflict, it just needs to be done well. I think some leaders being understandably concerned about Velen letting ex-Legion members into his city is an interesting premise. It's probably the most interesting Alliance development since Void Elves, which still hasn't paid off.

    Considering EVERYTHING Blizz has done since BFA, I really really really doubt we will see any retreads of how Garrosh/Sylvanas was handled.
    We don't need Alliance conflict, it never needed it. It just needed development and not lazy things like reusing the same idea the Horde had to go through for two expansions. No more factions fighting itself. And furthermore Void Elves weren't really an "interesting development aside from Alleria's unique new storyline with the Void. Which didn't really get touched upon except maybe her comment the whispers increasing despite N'zoth's "death."


    Personally I'd rather have just Alliance development against other forces that isn't themselves(Inner conflict) or specifically the Horde. If for some reason it was a random Titan Keeper in Arathi Highlands going rogue and the Alliance had to deal with it, I'd be fine with a small questline with that but thats an example.




    Which is nothing compared to what we had to deal with in earlier expansions. DF was comparatively pretty smooth.

    WoD's server issues seem to be a thing at the time(I didn't see any issues about it either). Except maybe one big content mentioning something about it.
    Last edited by Aeluron Lightsong; 2023-08-29 at 03:47 PM.
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  11. #13431
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    MoP was not "famillar" it was incredibly different, so different that people moaned that it didn't feel like Warcraft(Oh that again). It had elements that we were famillar with(We did get to see Titan related stuff but outside the two factions it was a very foriegn place).


    And f off with the Alliance inner conflict stuff. Just throwing the Horde's past two times of inner conflict onto the other faction is lazy and dumb.

    Edit: My bluntness for it is only cause I'm tired of people suggesting it when there's far better things to do with it.
    Any argument as to why the Alliance doesn’t need conflict? I’ve never seen you present an argument except for the implication that you just don’t like it. That as well as your insistence that WoW dragons are an interesting portrayal of dragons just suggests to me that you just want cookie cutter good vs. evil and that you aren’t interested in any moral ambiguity. Which is fine but from a narrative standpoint it’s incredibly boring and you’re likely to be the minority in terms of wanting that.
    Last edited by Santandame; 2023-08-29 at 04:33 PM.

  12. #13432
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    We don't need Alliance conflict, it never needed it. It just needed development and not lazy things like reusing the same idea the Horde had to go through for two expansions. No more factions fighting itself. And furthermore Void Elves weren't really an "interesting development aside from Alleria's unique new storyline with the Void. Which didn't really get touched upon except maybe her comment the whispers increasing despite N'zoth's "death."
    The void elves bring both void-practicing ex-Blood Elves and High Elves into the fold of the Alliance. The implications and potential are probably the biggest thing to come from the Allied Races, it just wasn't used very well in BFA.

    I think Man'ari will be the next step of the increasing space/cosmic race subfaction (three flavors of Eredar + Void Elves) on Alliance. Which frankly have more implications for future plots than the Kul Tirans or Mechagnomes do, though I'm sure they'd still be used in the event of a revamp or something similar.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2023-08-29 at 04:03 PM.

  13. #13433
    Quote Originally Posted by ImTheMizAwesome View Post
    I honestly think that it was pretty disappointing that the rebellion questline didn't have much VA or any even, i might not remember it correctly, but yeah it was cool that they added some dialogue choices there and you're right about Alex and dragons.


    I won't be sad if 10.2 will end up being the last patch of DF, but who knows maybe 10.2 will knock it out of the park.
    It's funny. The options I picked were not at all considered in the following dialogue. To the question earlier what my biggest gripes are: One I forgot about is one that has been present for a few years now, which is the apparent influence of modern politics on ingame lore. Thats a very easy way to break immersion. I loved that the lore was always based on kingdoms and cultures from the far past. Made for a more fantasylike and immersable world.
    I will not reply to posts that are non-constructive or contain flaming and/or trolling.

  14. #13434
    Warchief Catastrophy349's Avatar
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    I'm so excited to discuss 10.1.7 and 10.2 stuff with all of you soon enough, then speculating on what it all means for the future!

  15. #13435
    Merely a Setback Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    Any argument as to why the Alliance doesn’t need conflict? I’ve never seen you present an argument except for the implication that you just don’t like it. That as well as your insistence that WoW dragons are an interesting portrayal of dragons just suggests to me that you just won’t cookie cutter good vs. evil and that you aren’t interested in any moral ambiguity. Which is fine but from a narrative standpoint it’s incredibly boring and you’re likely to be the minority in terms of wanting that.
    You need an argument why the alliance needs conflict not the other way around.

    Turalyon has been shown again and again to be reasonable and willing to work with any power and forgive great sins like what Illidan did, the night elfs were pissed in BFA but have no reason to fight when they can just do there own thing like in BFA, Moria has been doing every thing legit since Cata, the house of nobles was cleaned up by anduin, and even Genn chilled out and realized not all forsaken are as evil as sylvanas.

    There just no reason for any conflict with in the alliance unless there going to make a character do a 180 out of no where.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  16. #13436
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    You need an argument why the alliance needs conflict not the other way around.

    Turalyon has been shown again and again to be reasonable and willing to work with any power and forgive great sins like what Illidan did, the night elfs were pissed in BFA but have no reason to fight when they can just do there own thing like in BFA, Moria has been doing every thing legit since Cata, the house of nobles was cleaned up by anduin, and even Genn chilled out and realized not all forsaken are as evil as sylvanas.

    There just no reason for any conflict with in the alliance unless there going to make a character do a 180 out of no where.
    This actually isn't true, it was stated by Shaw but the heritage quest and specifically the newer follow-up dialogs imply that Shaw was either overstating it or is unaware of the remaining corruption in the nobles. Considering they purposefully tied Turalyon to the House of Nobles a few times, I think that is worth mentioning.

    Like the follow-up quests specifically state that there is more cleaning to do, and it is the first quest to really establish more families in the HON and imply a follow-up storyline about them versus the newly-created House of the People.

    Moria, Genn and Tyrande I can't see being use for future conflict, but the Stormwind/Noble/Turalyon thing is something to keep an eye on. As well as the Scarlets and Man'ari questlines, both of which may introduce some kind of conflict with Light-users.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2023-08-29 at 04:36 PM.

  17. #13437
    Merely a Setback Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    This actually isn't true, it was stated by Shaw but the heritage quest and specifically the newer follow-up dialogs imply that Shaw was either overstating it or is unaware of the remaining corruption in the nobles. Considering they purposefully tied Turalyon to the House of Nobles a few times, I think that is worth mentioning.

    Like the follow-up quests specifically state that there is more cleaning to do, and it is the first quest to really establish more families in the HON and imply a follow-up storyline about them versus the newly-created House of the People.

    Moria, Genn and Tyrande I can't see being use for future conflict, but the Stormwind/Noble/Turalyon thing is something to keep an eye on.
    Didn’t know there was a follow up quest I’ll have to find that on my human.

    But even then Turalyon just doesn’t have any set up to cause problems at the moment so at best we could get the nobles pulling some sort of coup but it’s not like they would have any support in the alliance so it would just be a within stormwind thing.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  18. #13438
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    There's nothing wrong with Alliance conflict, it just needs to be done well. I think some leaders being understandably concerned about Velen letting ex-Legion members into his city is an interesting premise. It's probably the most interesting Alliance development since Void Elves, which still hasn't paid off.

    Considering EVERYTHING Blizz has done since BFA, I really really really doubt we will see any retreads of how Garrosh/Sylvanas was handled.
    Personally I think the part that would be the hardest to pull off about those questlines is that they would have to take place in areas actually relevant to the factions at hand, which means a revamp.
    It wouldn't make sense to have the Dark Iron resurgence plotline anywhere but the Dwarf zones. Even a hypothetical Dwarf adjacent zone like Khaz Algar setting off tensions would still require us to actually go back to old zones to have a fitting resolution.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  19. #13439
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    Didn’t know there was a follow up quest I’ll have to find that on my human.

    But even then Turalyon just doesn’t have any set up to cause problems at the moment so at best we could get the nobles pulling some sort of coup but it’s not like they would have any support in the alliance so it would just be a within stormwind thing.
    It's pretty interesting, it's the first real continuation of Stormwind City lore since Cata.

    https://www.wowhead.com/news/human-h...t-guild-334134

    Listen, there's no doubt in my mind that the House of Nobles will try to put a stop to the guild. Count Clessington was evidence enough that there are still many who are only in it for power. Where there is power, there is always corruption.
    The House needs change and it starts here. It starts with the people. With their voices joined together loud enough to be heard behind the locked doors of the House. It can only help to already have my voice echoing them, inside.

    So that's what I will fight for in the House. Not a House of Nobles, but a House of the People.

    I'm certain this won't be met favorably by most other nobles. Not yet. But a few of the younger ones, like Joran here, have already started to listen.
    This all sounds suspiciously like setup for a new Human questline, one that could go all over the Stormwind kingdom...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Personally I think the part that would be the hardest to pull off about those questlines is that they would have to take place in areas actually relevant to the factions at hand, which means a revamp.
    It wouldn't make sense to have the Dark Iron resurgence plotline anywhere but the Dwarf zones. Even a hypothetical Dwarf adjacent zone like Khaz Algar setting off tensions would still require us to actually go back to old zones to have a fitting resolution.
    Well the "connection to existing races thing" it's one of the reasons I predict at least a partial revamp. That and the future zones that may not all be in one continent, pointing to another expansion with zones all over the place (like how Cataclysm was handled).

    So far the only namedrops are Avaloren and Khaz Algar, and supposedly Avaloren is NOT a titan/keeper area (heretic), so the Earthen in Khaz may not exactly be right next to them.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2023-08-29 at 04:47 PM.

  20. #13440
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    You need an argument why the alliance needs conflict not the other way around.

    Turalyon has been shown again and again to be reasonable and willing to work with any power and forgive great sins like what Illidan did, the night elfs were pissed in BFA but have no reason to fight when they can just do there own thing like in BFA, Moria has been doing every thing legit since Cata, the house of nobles was cleaned up by anduin, and even Genn chilled out and realized not all forsaken are as evil as sylvanas.

    There just no reason for any conflict with in the alliance unless there going to make a character do a 180 out of no where.
    My question was aimed at why they don’t want Alliance conflict; because I’ve never seen them present an argument why it shouldn’t happen, only that the idea of it makes them uncomfortable for some reason.

    Of course story development would need to happen to introduce conflict in the Alliance; but that’s how you develop a story - you introduce new or different elements. An event could happen that fractures the Alliance or makes them question their relations with each of the races inside of it. A new or returning character (Yrel) could be introduced to seed conflict. As has already been stated, Turalyon is still a character to watch and there is still the House of Lords to contest with in Stormwind. Whilst the ship has sailed with Tyrande, Genn and Moira there are still characters that can bring about conflict.

    It’s the writers job to create the story. If they want to create conflict in the Alliance for the Warcraft narrative, then there are plenty of ways they can do it. The faction desperately needs something because they are totally vanilla and devoid of any character or identity apart from Stormwind and the colour blue.

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