Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[PotHockets]

Good find!! Interesting names dropped there and interesting zones... Did some leak talked about Northrend? Because between what this implies and that we know that we will have to face the Keepers at some point...

And more important, after reading this I still have hope on Vyranoth's betrayal. The schock of what Alexstrasza did might have changed her forever in a evil and twisted way... I certainly hope so.

So I had a theory during Shadowlands, which clearly turned out to be wrong, that the next expansion was a Northrend revamp. There were a lot of bread crumbs that something was going on with the Scourge back home with them running rampant now that the Helm of Domination is shattered.

Reading that brought that back to mind. It would make sense too as a big nostalgia hit for the anniversary and allow them to develop even more assets to use for an EK/Kalim revamp.

[Catastrophy349]

So, my "prediction" is that Vyranoth "swapped sides" so quickly because she's trying to re-gain/gain our trust. I just don't believe the sudden "change" in heart (especially as quickly as it happened). Excited to learn more about the past through the novel.

Additionally, during the 10.1.7 cinematic, if you re-watch Vyranoth's tone of voice, word choice, and body language in the "Fyrakk and Vyranoth" cinematic when Fyrakk turns the "Druid of the Flame (boss)" into a "juiced up Shadowflame (boss), in addition to the interaction between Alex and Vyranoth at Valdrakken, something isn't "right."

[Paula Deen]

So I had a theory during Shadowlands, which clearly turned out to be wrong, that the next expansion was a Northrend revamp. There were a lot of bread crumbs that something was going on with the Scourge back home with them running rampant now that the Helm of Domination is shattered.

Reading that brought that back to mind. It would make sense too as a big nostalgia hit for the anniversary and allow them to develop even more assets to use for an EK/Kalim revamp.

It would be suicide to do a Northrend Revamp directly following LK Classic UNLESS all the continents were getting revamped at the same time.

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So, my "prediction" is that Vyranoth "swapped sides" so quickly because she's trying to re-gain/gain our trust. I just don't believe the sudden "change" in heart (especially as quickly as it happened). Excited to learn more about the past through the novel.

Additionally, during the 10.1.7 cinematic, if you re-watch Vyranoth's tone of voice, word choice, and body language in the "Fyrakk and Vyranoth" cinematic when Fyrakk turns the "Druid of the Flame (boss)" into a "juiced up Shadowflame (boss), in addition to the interaction between Alex and Vyranoth at Valdrakken, something isn't "right."

Your idea is great, but I just do not think modern Blizzard has the capability to right a nuanced character in that way.

[shieldslammer]

So, I have NEVER been a "revamp" supporter. Not because I don't want it, but because I never cared much for it. However, my mind has since changed over the last year or so.

The question: What do YOU (MMO-C) consider a "good revamp?" Like, how do YOU "envision" it?

Instead of going to a new hidden island I'd like for the entirety of Azeroth to be in the current time frame and relevant. So world quests one day might be active in Feralas and Un'goro. Maybe on another day they are in Badlands and Searing Gorge. Similarly, maybe a revamped Dire Maul is an M+ dungeon. Put a raid in some well-known structure like Scarlet Monastery.

Combine zones while also making them bigger but still feeling familiar. Take Goldshire. It's like two carts and a few buildings and like six creepy kids that sometimes stare at a wall. Lorewise it should be a city. So a revamp is an opportunity to better realize the world. Similarly, instead of Scholomance being a 5-man perhaps it should be a campus, and the dungeon is just a part of the bigger structure. Make Gilneas more than a starter zone.

Make Order Halls evergreen. They don't need to be like Legion where it was equal content for all classes. It would be fine to see 11.2.5 "New shaman order hall questine added" because it made sense for the current expansion Rise of the Elemental Lords. (I am kidding about the expansion name. Everyone knows the real name is For Whom the Grim Batols).

Show the reconstruction of Night Elf structures in Kalimdor over time. See how how the Scarlet Crusade reacts to Forsaken trying to re-establish themselves in Lordaeron. They talk about running out of Warcraft 3 story but the real nostalgia these days is over World of Warcraft vanilla. So draw on that.

Have granular conflict instead of red vs blue conflict. Have nations that think for themselves rather than submitting to the will of an Alliance or Horde. Have conflict and factions within nations--so perhaps you have Turalyon ally with the Scarlet Crusade (but make them relatable instead of cartoon villains) while Anduin returns to oppose them.

This is too interesting a setting to just leave it stagnant for leveling while end game (99% of actual playtime) is shoved into some new island with new lore every two years. And ultimately I think seeing what the Night Elves and Forsaken in the homelands are up to or what's going on with the Argent Dawn or Cenarion Circle or some other faction would be way more interesting than finding some new Drakonid to help.

[Catastrophy349]

Druids of the Flame cutscene:

Fyrakk: He knew what was necessary to win this war (Iridikron).
Vyranoth: We took up arms together to free the world from the titans' meddling. That is the war I fight. That is the victory I seek.
Fyrakk goes nuts.
Vyranoth: Indeed. Then our course is set. (She is going to continue Iridikron's plan(s) on her own/different way)

To me, she is basically saying "OK, your nuts. BUT, I will find another way." Hence, "joining" the Aspects.

Valdrakken cutscene:

Vyranoth gives just enough information to get Alex to get her to "trust and confide in her". Just like she "trusted" Alex not to mess with the eggs. Remember what she said, "all that remains is vengeance." What a better way to do it?

Obviously, this is hopium/copium (most likely the writers are just that bad). But if I'm right? DAMN! This is going to get good!

[PotHockets]

So, my "prediction" is that Vyranoth "swapped sides" so quickly because she's trying to re-gain/gain our trust. I just don't believe the sudden "change" in heart (especially as quickly as it happened). Excited to learn more about the past through the novel.

Additionally, during the 10.1.7 cinematic, if you re-watch Vyranoth's tone of voice, word choice, and body language in the "Fyrakk and Vyranoth" cinematic when Fyrakk turns the "Druid of the Flame (boss)" into a "juiced up Shadowflame (boss), in addition to the interaction between Alex and Vyranoth at Valdrakken, something isn't "right."

I think that's a reach. Vyranoth is just the sanest of the incarnates. All she wants is to stop the Titans and the Keepers subjugation of mortal races not end existence like Fyrakk and Iridikron do.

The following is speculation but:

The interaction is just icy because Alex helped lock her up for 20k years but Vyranoth still knows that at the very least Alex has all of the dragons best interests at heart. Vyranoth has love for her like a sibling would but probably sees Alex's refusal to accept what the Titans/Keepers true motives are as something to be concerned about. Notice how it wasn't till Alex acknowledged that they're all in it together no matter what they face that she agreed to stick around i.e. Vyranoth probably thinks that Alex is finally open to seeing the Titans/Keepers for what they really are.

[Thomir]

Vyranoth ought to embrace the Titan's gifts. Their magic is far more fashionable.

[Catastrophy349]

I think that's a reach. Vyranoth is just the sanest of the incarnates. All she wants is to stop the Titans and the Keepers subjugation of mortal races not end existence like Fyrakk and Iridikron do.

The following is speculation but:

The interaction is just icy because Alex helped lock her up for 20k years but Vyranoth still knows that at the very least Alex has all of the dragons best interests at heart. Vyranoth has love for her like a sibling would but probably sees Alex's refusal to accept what the Titans/Keepers true motives are as something to be concerned about. Notice how it wasn't till Alex acknowledged that they're all in it together no matter what they face that she agreed to stick around i.e. Vyranoth probably thinks that Alex is finally open to seeing the Titans/Keepers for what they really are.

Reach or not, there's no way anyone with a sense of "telling a good story" believes that Vyranoth "swapped sides" that fast. It makes NO sense.

[Paula Deen]

I think that's a reach. Vyranoth is just the sanest of the incarnates. All she wants is to stop the Titans and the Keepers subjugation of mortal races not end existence like Fyrakk and Iridikron do.

Do we know Iridikron wants to end all life existence though? I don't even Fyrakk wants that, I think he just wants to commit genocidal levels of tree arson like the stinky undead elf before him.

[Catastrophy349]

Vyranoth ought to embrace the Titan's gifts. Their magic is far more fashionable.

Would love to see her receive the Blessing of Amirdrassil, then turn on us.

[PotHockets]

Reach or not, there's no way anyone with a sense of "telling a good story" believes that Vyranoth "swapped sides" that fast. It makes NO sense.

I think that was because we lost a patch personally and they had to condense her dipping out to collect her thoughts first.

Besides betrayal like that is so obvious that it's boring as hell storytelling to me. That's just me though.

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Do we know Iridikron wants to end all life existence though? I don't even Fyrakk wants that, I think he just wants to commit genocidal levels of tree arson like the stinky undead elf before him.

Iridikron is definitely working for the Void and that's their MO.

[Catastrophy349]

I think that was because we lost a patch personally and they had to condense her dipping out to collect her thoughts first.

Besides betrayal like that is so obvious that it's boring as hell storytelling to me.

Here's to hoping the "War of the Scaleborn" fills in the gap. Perhaps, the time between "Vyranoth joining us and walking with Alex" and the start of 10.2 takes place in the book. The WoW books (recently) always have a "present" and "past" story happening. A main character is going through something in the present, and through conversation/memory, reflects on the past.

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Think of the Sylvanas book where she is talking to Anduin in the present (about events from the past). Or "Dawn of the Aspects" where Kalecgos of the present experiences events from the past.

[PotHockets]

Here's to hoping the "War of the Scaleborn" fills in the gap. Perhaps, the time between "Vyranoth joining us and walking with Alex" and the start of 10.2 takes place in the book. The WoW books (recently) always have a "present" and "past" story happening. A main character is going through something in the present, and through conversation/memory, reflects on the past.

Yeah I haven't picked up one of the books since I think the Legion ones? I might actually grab this one because if nothing else I want to see what Vyranoth's pov is and it definitely seemed like she was the focal character from that excerpt. Actually maybe it's gonna be Vyranoth as a pov character for the past and Alex as pov for the present. That would be pretty cool.

[Thomir]

I think Odyn will kill Vyranoth.

[PotHockets]

I think Odyn will kill Vyranoth.

It's a distinct possibility. I don't trust Odyn at all and he has zero tolerance for anyone that doesn't worship the ground he walks on. Could even work as a catalyst for the flights turning against the Keepers.

[Catastrophy349]

The excerpt I shared from the book definitely got me excited, for sure.

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Going to be a crazy 7 days starting the 31st of October between the book release, BlizzCon, and following Tuesday patch release!

[Chickat]

Here you go. It originated on 4chan but was posted here over 100 pages ago.

Other than the glider and beetle mounts wall climbing, it sounds bland tbh.

[seainma]

Reading through this thread is a joy. I wonder how many of you are planning to hate the next expansion no matter what is announced.

Its also interesting to see how many of you say that Dragonflight is boring, I'm glad that some of you are starting to turn around on the cosmic stuff. Post shadowlands cosmic was a bad word. But I remember there being a call for a slower expansion, back on Azeroth (I understand that Azeroth to some just means Kalimdor and EK) without a massive big bad. Blizzard does that and some of yall are still mad.

[Darkarath]

It would be suicide to do a Northrend Revamp directly following LK Classic UNLESS all the continents were getting revamped at the same time.

I think that it could be the opposite.

If they return to Northrend it would be made from the scratch, like Draenor was. They would add at the very least Azjol-Nerub as a zone and with the few names dropped in War of the Scaleborn I am pretty sure that they can make another zone.

IMO, every Warcraft player would be excited to return to Northrend. SL was a missed opportunity to revamp Northrend and (almost) every WoW player regrets that Blizzard did not follow that path.

For Classic players that just played WotLK, they will have Cata Classic, or a new HD version with more content of the most iconic continent of WoW.

I think that It might work VERY well.

Regarding Vyranoth, if she is a betrayer, I do not need to say that Northrend fits her very well. And remember, in the Primalist Future, an ice storm has fucked up... Everything?

I have always talked shit about Blizzard for how Vyranoth changed sides, and it has always been my hope that the book shows that she is, in fact, going to betray us.

More important, the date of the book. I brought up this point before. Why so close to Blizzcon? Why? Is there something in the book that they do not want to reveal just before announcing 11.0?

[Reive]

Reading through this thread is a joy. I wonder how many of you are planning to hate the next expansion no matter what is announced.

Its also interesting to see how many of you say that Dragonflight is boring, I'm glad that some of you are starting to turn around on the cosmic stuff. Post shadowlands cosmic was a bad word. But I remember there being a call for a slower expansion, back on Azeroth (I understand that Azeroth to some just means Kalimdor and EK) without a massive big bad. Blizzard does that and some of yall are still mad.

the writing is just garbage. mop was also a slower expansion and yet it's 100 times better than dragonflight