Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Wangming]

I think we've discussed it here as well; instead of having specific racials, remove any racials that add throughput and then add a large number of racials to each race and let people pick 3-4 out of them.

I'm going to pick a claw attack to my worgen. Or a bite. it is stupid it doesn't exist.

[Chickat]

IMO the reason they've done the Moonkin customization in 10.2 is so that they don't have to come up with specific form for each race. It's simpler for them and it gives players a nice tool, 1 stone 2 birds kind of thing. I'd imagine they'll expand on it in the future for bear/cat forms too.

I agree. I think druids coming to all races makes sense, and they can always add race specific forms down the road when they have time.

[pacotaco]

The items you get from a raid are part of the lore, and inside the Sepulcher you did get tier sets which increases your power levels.

The catalyst is also canon, isn't it? We get a quest chain with us investigating the zone, ending with us finding out about the catalyst and how to use it against the Jailer.
So I'd say that yeah, progenitor gear is canon.

[Chickat]

Whelp, its 6am here and I still havent went to bed. Im gonna get some sleep, but at least im only 5.5 hours away from being caught up on the thread, and Im off tomorrow, so perhaps I can start joining in on the discussions as they happen instead of inserting my opinions into discussions from days ago. BBL

[Lady Atia]

new demon hunter spec is torment. dont look like support but not sure.
all race given shamans.
lands of conflicts are updated revamp like cata and textures
khaz algar new lands underground black stormy skybox and titan buildings opening hole in EK but go very deeper down to the center
new races in algar but customization for a lot of races. noticed no water races for algar. looks like might be a new patch for vashjir
new glyphs revamped new system like talent trees but in depth changes spells not power relating
small tree for races not power relating

Kinda sad if they add a new demon hunter spec and it isn't using a bow, but maybe if we get a propper glyph and race spell rework you could use that to basically make a bloodelf dh with a bow lol.

Also kinda weird if they update EK but not Kalimdor, but it could work if they manage to make EK evergreen enough that it isn't looking out of place next to the future Kalimdor?

I imagine the glyph and races tree's are not so much trees but nodes for each major spell with different options where you can choose one, a bit like the profession trees? So more like a forest instead of a tree. Because it would be a bit weird forcing people to use f.e. red bestial wrath just to unlock a red cobra shot.

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I think we've discussed it here as well; instead of having specific racials, remove any racials that add throughput and then add a large number of racials to each race and let people pick 3-4 out of them.

What I really want to see is a node that unlocks certain weapon types for certain races, atleast transmog wise. Trolls, Elves f.e. should be able to use glaives and imagine if our Nightelf Priests could unlock bows for transmog!

[huth]

Kinda sad if they add a new demon hunter spec and it isn't using a bow, but maybe if we get a propper glyph and race spell rework you could use that to basically make a bloodelf dh with a bow lol.

I dunno, i think it'd make more sense for them to be using fel and shadow for ranged attacks. Diablo DH is a wholly different thing than WarCraft DH.

[Nymrohd]

I'm going to pick a claw attack to my worgen. Or a bite. it is stupid it doesn't exist.

Honestly I think worgen should just get the option to transmog their weapons to hidden and just use fist weapon attack animations after

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I dunno, i think it'd make more sense for them to be using fel and shadow for ranged attacks. Diablo DH is a wholly different thing than WarCraft DH.

Why not both?

[Wangming]

Did you really just say the only thing that could be improved in SL was Korthia. lmao.

The SL i mentioned would have way less lore problems, and would keep death a mystery which is good for the franchise PLUS keeps it open to do an actual Shadowlands in the future too.

I mean let's be honest here. While it had a lot of retarded stuff, what tanked Shadowlands was the horrible patch cadence. We have had dumb lore decisions since TBC. Barely connected zones? Cataclysm. Half baked systems that cost as a raid tier? WoD. None of the flaws SL had were unique to SL. Yet people stuck around for all that sludge. The exodus only began when SL made us wait so long for the first patch, many expansions already had their second one by that time.

As A counterpoint, DF barely qualifies as mid, but it has a roadmap and pretty frequent patches and immediately loads of people pretend it is good. This isn't rocket science.

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Kinda sad if they add a new demon hunter spec and it isn't using a bow

Well we never saw a bow wielding demon hunter, did we?

[Lady Atia]

Did you really just say the only thing that could be improved in SL was Korthia. lmao.

The SL i mentioned would have way less lore problems, and would keep death a mystery which is good for the franchise PLUS keeps it open to do an actual Shadowlands in the future too.

Yes, because I actually enjoyed Shadowlands besides Korthia. I didn't enjoy the content draught, but anything else that sucked (Covenant restrictions, Sylvanas being forced to be a "bad guy" thanks to Afrasiabi, the dumb broken system were you cant choose were you belong aswell as being seperated from your loved ones) was pretty much changed by the time Zereth Mortis came along. I also really loved the amount of new mounts there (which is what Dragonflight is lacking ngl), solo shuffles aswell the fated season at the end.

Was it as good as Legion? Maybe not, but it was easily as good as the first half of Cata, MoP and WotlK.

BfA though can rot in hell together with Dragonsoul lol.

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I mean let's be honest here. While it had a lot of retarded stuff, what tanked Shadowlands was the horrible patch cadence. We have had dumb lore decisions since TBC. Barely connected zones? Cataclysm. Half baked systems that cost as a raid tier? WoD. None of the flaws SL had were unique to SL. Yet people stuck around for all that sludge. The exodus only began when SL made us wait so long for the first patch, many expansions already had their second one by that time.

As A counterpoint, DF barely qualifies as mid, but it has a roadmap and pretty frequent patches and immediately loads of people pretend it is good. This isn't rocket science.

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Well we never saw a bow wielding demon hunter, did we?

We actually do, in Hearthstone.

[pacotaco]

Pandaria had both light and dark moments. The first zone had a proper balance. And while it had light hearted moments in the Valley of Four Winds, Kun Lai and Townlong had some very dark questlines (the Shado Pan lady possessed by the Sha of Hatred doing war crimes against the Taunka is as dark as it gets).
Plus the light hearted moments were fully realized. Halfhill was a questline that would probably take you a month to unlock max rep with every character not to mention how it synergized with leveling Pandaren cooking which was very involved and interacted with your farm.
I felt that several questlines in DF don't really go anywhere. I was excited when I saw we unlocked extra quests at different renown levels for the DF faction but . . . do we really? You get one questline in Iskara that unlocks an additional Tuskar settlement; there are more settlements than that one though on the island. Why not have at least one quest that also has you travel to Northrend to see them reconnect with their kin there? Maybe have an additional quests with the baby gnoll at the end.
Maruuk questline ends with the dungeon and we get no additional quests; at least you get some more info with the Baine quest though that doesn't explain how the Nokhud remain such a major threat after they take such a beating during the campaign and dungeon.
The Dragonscale Expedition quests also don't really go anywhere; you spend so much time to get inside the vault but we don't really see them make any important connections; it is just plot exposition. At least a decent amount of work went into their climbing world quest (though the photography one is so half-baked, what is the point of taking photos if we can never see them!)

The way MoP narrative is structured is that you reach a new zone bringing war with you. What it seems a peaceful land ends in conflict. You try to balance things a bit and you leave to the next zone leaving a mess behind you.
But the overall narrative is also a mirror, with things escalating on each patch, until you defeat Garrosh and bring back a bit of peace to Pandaria.

DF follows the same structure, but it fails at immediately resolving those conflicts in the same narrative zone arc, and usually leaves a feeling (at least to me) of being an errand boy more than a pivotal person helping in the conflict.

[Wangming]

We actually do, in Hearthstone.

Okay, I actually stand corrected.

[pacotaco]

Kinda sucks that Tyr is probably going to be a villain. I hope we dont kill him at least. I'm fine killing Odyn, but at least 1 keeper should end up on our side imo.

If anything Tyr would be one of our few allies vs the Titans. It's always been represented as someone really loving the mortal races.
We will probably see him confessing the Aspects that he's responsible of Galakrond and the Incarnates, and telling us about the lands beyond the Storming Sea.

[Jaggler]

It would be cool if Tyr (maybe with Freya), after maybe having a few qualms about it, joins us in a rebellion against the keepers and tells us about a faction of anti-titan-rebels on Avaloren and helps us in reaching it.

[pacotaco]

I'd still like to know why exactly the Order infusion is bad. I guess we will see it in the book.

I think it's because it changes them. And the main conflict is mainly because they started doing it to unborn children of unwilling parents. I think the morally questionable thing is pretty obvious.

[Jaggler]

I think it's because it changes them. And the main conflict is mainly because they started doing it to unborn children of unwilling parents. I think the morally questionable thing is pretty obvious.

Not only changes them physically but also mentally, making them more "open" to the way of Order.

[Nymrohd]

Okay, I actually stand corrected.

And beyond that, Illidan was primarily training Night and Blood elves, people known primarily for their skill at archery; especially in Warcraft where both subraces' most celebrated military units are primarily archers (Sentinels and Farstriders). It always seemed weird to me that none of them tried to blend their new abilities with their original talents. We know e.g. a demon hunter who used to be a mage and while he cannot use his arcane skills anymore (because the Fel intervenes), he still has his knowledge of the arcane.
That said, it shouldn't just be a physical archer because that would make it a hunter. Obviously it would imbue arrows with fel but giving them some fel spell attacks makes sense (maybe Death From Above could become a PvE ability). I am also ambivalent about summoning; Loramus summons felhunters to help him track demons but add that and archery and it would really just be BM hunter but fel.

[Wangming]

Not only changes them physically but also mentally, making them more "open" to the way of Order.

Which isn't the worst force to be alligned with. The bigger problem I feel is that it isn't a shield against other forces. Like you know the Worgen curse protects against the curse of undeath. Or at the very least at the level of the Plague. The Lich King had no problem creating Death Knights from them. But zombie? Nah.
Ysera on the other hand was easily corrupted by the Nightmare.

[Baraden]

I'm going to pick a claw attack to my worgen. Or a bite. it is stupid it doesn't exist.

Imagine if Blizzard allowed invisible fist weapons for every class rather than just monk; you could have worgen rogues and warrior using their claws in combat

Or even better; imagine if a worgen druid just stays in their worgen form for cat form; allowing you to bite and claw as your normal worgen appearance rather than cat - all these animations already exist, it would be almost no work on blizzard's end and would actually allow you to RP as a genuine worgen

[Teriz]

I'm simply not buying the notion of a 3rd DH spec. Especially a third melee DH spec.

Maybe if it used bows.....

[Wangming]

And beyond that, Illidan was primarily training Night and Blood elves, people known primarily for their skill at archery; especially in Warcraft where both subraces' most celebrated military units are primarily archers (Sentinels and Farstriders). It always seemed weird to me that none of them tried to blend their new abilities with their original talents. We know e.g. a demon hunter who used to be a mage and while he cannot use his arcane skills anymore (because the Fel intervenes), he still has his knowledge of the arcane.
That said, it shouldn't just be a physical archer because that would make it a hunter. Obviously it would imbue arrows with fel but giving them some fel spell attacks makes sense (maybe Death From Above could become a PvE ability). I am also ambivalent about summoning; Loramus summons felhunters to help him track demons but add that and archery and it would really just be BM hunter but fel.

Yep. And all Demon Hunters we see in game use melee weapons. Either the iconic glaves or a bigass scythe. Giving Demon Hunters a spec that is hunter with extra steps but turning Dark Rangers into an eye color is just a slap in the face.