Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Hitei]

I've pointed this out earlier, but mists of pandaria was another expansion that had almost no story build up. It sold terribly, selling by estimation at least a million fewer copies than the second worst selling expansion (other than TBC, but the player base wasn't huge then) and it caused massive subscriber losses. This leads me to believe the high level decision makers at blizzard won't make that mistake again. No amount of nostalgic musing about MoP being a lot of people's favorite expansion retrospectively changes the financial numbers that can be expected to inform decisions. My expectation is they are seeding and will continue to keep seeding tidbits of lore about it in 11.0 and beyond and we will go there in 12.0 at the earliest

But they immediately followed it up with WoD which conceptually (as presented to players) didn't really exist until the very last patch of MoP when suddenly bronze dragons showed up.

Also who expected the N'zoth/Azshara expansion to at launch be about a world war focused around Zandalar and Kul Tiras? Or the Legion expansion to be set on the Broken Isles?

[ercarp]

i loved essences, to me that was nearly the perfect system if it wasn't AS grindy. Or Legion with its artifact and legendary catchup systems already in place, that would be perfect

I agree, Artifact Weapons and Essences were great. I miss Corruptions too. They weren't balanced at all, but man was it fun when Twilight Devastation procced and one-shot a group of mobs in a dungeon.

I don't think borrowed power is inherently bad, they just need to put in some limits in place so people aren't punished for not grinding AP 24/7.

[Krukus]

I have little hope that Blizzard, when creating the atmosphere for specific biomes in Avaloren, also referred to other cultures on Earth than just the standard ones that have already appeared. Another Nordic or Mesoamerican zone will be boring and repetitive.

[Catastrophy349]

If I may shift the conversation a bit: let's assume the "leak" of the images/continent is real (even just temporarily for speculation's sake). What else would you like to see from Avaloren (things NOT shown in the images)? Additionally, where should the story go (connection between DF and 11.0), what kind of features should we have, etc.?

[kavikor]

if Khaz Algar is real and part of these zones i'd really like to have part of the zone in an underground bit of the zone(s). Not like how the Niffen place is but instead more like Moria from LOTR with big foreboding, abandoned dwarven architecture swarming with creatures and unknowable relics and secrets, maybe like Grim Batol open world zone?

Maybe as the endgame Suramar like zone! Lots of treasure, secrets, and cosmetics to find or a legendary questline

And secret areas that don't always show on the map too for more mystery and to give people a reason to share things between the community

[Rathwell]

If I may shift the conversation a bit: let's assume the "leak" of the images/continent is real (even just temporarily for speculation's sake). What else would you like to see from Avaloren (things NOT shown in the images)? Additionally, where should the story go (connection between DF and 11.0), what kind of features should we have, etc.?

Playable ogres. I don't care about story justification, just make it happen. And no compromises: no mok'nathal, no half-ogres of any kind, no "ogre-sized dwarf", no "oaf from the goblin starting zone".

Ogres or bust.

[blaatschaap]

But they immediately followed it up with WoD which conceptually (as presented to players) didn't really exist until the very last patch of MoP when suddenly bronze dragons showed up.

Also who expected the N'zoth/Azshara expansion to at launch be about a world war focused around Zandalar and Kul Tiras? Or the Legion expansion to be set on the Broken Isles?

But people knew about outland, which was draenor. Players were familiar with the warlords from warcraft rts and earlier expansions. It was a fresh new look at places and people we already knew. It's not comparable to the supposed completely isolated Avaloren. We aren't gonna find familiar faces there, by definition.

[Krukus]

If I may shift the conversation a bit: let's assume the "leak" of the images/continent is real (even just temporarily for speculation's sake). What else would you like to see from Avaloren (things NOT shown in the images)? Additionally, where should the story go (connection between DF and 11.0), what kind of features should we have, etc.?

Original zones that, apart from the same climate as other continents in Azeroth, have their own unique atmosphere. An isolated continent should stand out from the rest.

[Catastrophy349]

Original zones that, apart from the same climate as other continents in Azeroth, have their own unique atmosphere. An isolated continent should stand out from the rest.

Yeah, I was actually just thinking of this to myself, too. If Avaloren is supposed to be far away/other side of Azeroth/whatever, it "should" feel different.

[Joszef Kiprich]

I would love to see Avaloren as an Arthurian continent and indeed if Khaz Algar is located there, some sort of Moria, full of evil

[Wangming]

I have little hope that Blizzard, when creating the atmosphere for specific biomes in Avaloren, also referred to other cultures on Earth than just the standard ones that have already appeared. Another Nordic or Mesoamerican zone will be boring and repetitive.

I had the same fear about MoP and that turned out well. Granted it was a long time ago with different people potentially, but it worked.

[Catastrophy349]

Avaloren should certainly look different. So, if those images are real, I hope the rest of each of those zones look completely different from what is shown.

[allifeur]

Original zones that, apart from the same climate as other continents in Azeroth, have their own unique atmosphere. An isolated continent should stand out from the rest.

Yeah, I had some hopes it would the Australia or the Socotra island of wow, with a wildlife that has been separated from anything else for 6 millions years... But I imagine this inspiration was already partially taken by Draenor. It would have been interesting, considering the maori also have their own mythological dwarves, and it's another culture that still hasn't been used that much as inspiration.

[Wangming]

Avaloren should certainly look different. So, if those images are real, I hope the rest of each of those zones look completely different from what is shown.

Yeah. But that again begs the question: Why weren't those more interesting parts in the trailer from which the screenshots were made?

[Leowyld]

The only thing we can definitely pin on the next expansion, right now, is Khaz Algar. And by proxy of the related book and the name Khaz Algar, some sort of Dwarf/Earthen presence. Anything else is speculation. I think Avaloren. But we'll see. One thing I've seen happen in past leak seasons, one mistake I often see, is people inventing "rules" that Blizzard follows. "Blizzard would never use an expansion name that is...", "Blizzard would never use a logo that has...", "Blizzard would never do an expansion that is this or that". Unless Blizzard outright states such "rules" as fact, it is just speculation. Patterns can and do change. And even if Blizzard once said they have no plans to do something, plans change. Keep an open mind, almost anything is possible unless we are told specifically otherwise.

[KyleEverett]

Yeah. But that again begs the question: Why weren't those more interesting parts in the trailer from which the screenshots were made?

My belief is most leaks are intentional by Blizzard to keep discussion going leading towards announcement and trying to build hype. Maybe the goal is for Avaloren to not feel so left field by the time they do announce it next week.

[kavikor]

Yeah. But that again begs the question: Why weren't those more interesting parts in the trailer from which the screenshots were made?

in many zones in modern WoW zones are rarely a single biome without points of interest, Azure Span has the big crystal and stuff, Val'Sharah with the big nightmare splotch, im sure if these screenshots are in fact real, that they will have some areas that 'pop' a little more, whose to say that first rather boring (but beautiful) forest screenshot wont pan up and reveal unique architecture, or that the desert doesnt have some silithid corruption (this was a place where people fled from the Titans after all)

if these are videos these could all be panning around to many places and i doubt the leaker would be trying to find the "best looking" shots as if to advertise, theyre just getting any shots they can to leak it

[Hitei]

But people knew about outland, which was draenor. Players were familiar with the warlords from warcraft rts and earlier expansions. It was a fresh new look at places and people we already knew. It's not comparable to the supposed completely isolated Avaloren. We aren't gonna find familiar faces there, by definition.

Sure, but are familiar faces really what people want? I think the gut reaction is "Of course! I want to see more of the characters I like!", but if you actually look at it, the characters who tend to be fondly remembered aren't really that way out of familiarity. People loved Bwonsamdi and Denathrius. People like Fyrakk. They liked Ve'nari. They love Vulpera and Suramar and the Nightborne/Nightfallen.

What sells an expansion isn't necessarily familiarity, it's interesting features, places that look cool to explore, neat dungeons, fancy new classes and spells, etc. And familiar faces aren't nearly as important to enjoying an expansion as really engaging colorful characters and interesting storylines are.

[Catastrophy349]

Yeah. But that again begs the question: Why weren't those more interesting parts in the trailer from which the screenshots were made?

Who is to say that the "interesting parts" you mention are not in the trailer? Those 4 images are not the entire zone (of each). However, if those 4 images are, in fact, the "interesting parts" of the trailer for each zone, that's sad.

[Wangming]

My belief is most leaks are intentional by Blizzard to keep discussion going leading towards announcement and trying to build hype.

Well that certainly backfired for most.

Imagine the poor Blizzard intern Gaius van Baelsar reading this thread:
Such devastation! This was NOT my intention.