Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Sondrelk]

I see what you mean.

But I am increasingly of the opinion that a revamp doesn't need to be an expansion. It could just be a free update to everyone, arriving all at once in a patch, or in large chunks. Like when they overhauled levelling at the end of Legion or whenever it was, in 7.3.5 I believe.

There are still plotlines that need to be resolved in EK and Kalimdor. The Ragnaros cultist plotline for instance only really make sense taking place in Blackrock Mountain. So in some way we do need to go back at some point.

Until we endgame storylines taking place in EK and Kalimdor there will always be that desire to have a World Revamp, and I don't think it's an issue Blizzard can just avoid forever.

[Makorus]

Again, that's false. If you disagree with this, describe any race currently on or from Avaloren. Describe the culture or style of Avaloren based on the information we have.

From this single image;

We get a ton of information about Pandaren and Pandaria.

Did you even read their post?

[Delever]

Again, that's false. If you disagree with this, describe any race currently on or from Avaloren. Describe the culture or style of Avaloren based on the information we have.

From this single image;



We get a ton of information about Pandaren and Pandaria. And we had that from the beginning.

My brother in Christ what does your question have ANYTHING to do with what I just said?

[Teriz]

Did you even read their post?

Yeah I did. And yes an expansion about Panda people on a lost East Asian style continent is reason enough lorewise to visit that location. Especially when one of the people from that lost East Asian continent is a champion of the Horde who helped Thrall establish Orgrimmar.

[KurtMash]

As for the setup: Odyn was never ok with the dragons being elevated to Aspects. But at least they were still serving Titans. Now, with Aspects breaking with Titans, and gaining their powers back not through the Titans but (possibly) directly through Elune, and us stealing his Storm Drakes, he's sure to be pissed. Assuming the Heretics were worshipping Elune and Life, he could decide that it's time to end it once and for all and he goes to Avaloren himself instead of sending some missions.

[Teriz]

My brother in Christ what does your question have ANYTHING to do with what I just said?

Because what you said was that what we have with Avaloren is just as good justification for an expansion as what we had for Pandaria.

Again, that's BS.

[Myrrh]

No, but by that logic nothing ever makes sense. Many players probably didn't even read the quest texts that explain why we are fighting Razsageth in the vault. Or is even aware that the reason we fight Drakonids so often is because of the protests against their poor treatment by the dragons.

I mean, I agree - you claimed they were well known as a reason for the WoD>Legion connection being stronger though.

The Broken Isles was a well known location though. The Tomb of Sargeras was prominently featured in Warcraft 3, and it's approximate location was even shown on in-game maps long before Legion.

[Makorus]

Yeah I did. And yes an expansion about Panda people on a lost East Asian style continent is reason enough lorewise to visit that location. Especially when one of the people from that lost East Asian continent is a champion of the Horde who helped Thrall establish Orgrimmar.

But... That's not why we went to Pandaria?

Was Chen even acknowledged by anyone from the Horde until 5.4?

[Xilurm]

On a scale of 1-10, how likely is it that the reveal on Friday is that the expansion is about Avaloren?

[Delever]

Because what you said was that what we have with Avaloren is just as good justification for an expansion as what we had for Pandaria.

Again, that's BS.

It is not because what I mean by lore reason is in game story events leading up to us visiting said place. The existence of pandaren just by itself is not a good enough reason to visit what was previously thought to be a comic relief analogy to the martial arts culture of china. And the reason for going to Pandaria was not Chen or because pandas existed. It was made up and was literally given when the expansion was announced and was not built up years before. Same thing will happen with Avaloren IF that is the next landmass we go to.

You are letting your own personal feelings interfere with logic because you just don't like avaloren being the potential next destination. And then you re projecting those feelings making other people sound as if they re defending avaloren being the next location as the best choice.
I personally don't really have an opinion on whether it's the best choice or not. It will depend how they justify it just like with previous expansions. It just doesn't seem any less possible to me than Pandaria did at the time.

[Wangming]

You are confusing lore reasons to go somewhere vs what the players want. The fact that some players wanted pandas is undeniable and probably why Pandaria happened. What we knew about it lorewise to justify an entire expansion around it is just as good (if not worse) as what we know about avaloren.

Okay, let me add another level.
What the Character wants.

Because as it so happens MoP is probably the best one in that regards. You see no one, not the Alliance nor the Horde, went there for Pandas. They went there for Anduin. If you are a die-hard horde player, hurting the Alliance King sounds just what you might want to do. And as an Alliance player who saw him every time you went into the throne room and his father ever since Wrath began, you might actually care for either of them. And if so you would be happy to embark on a rescue mission.

But now with Chromie time and you just doing one slice of the whole journey something like this might not work again.

[Teriz]

But... That's not why we went to Pandaria?

Was Chen even acknowledged by anyone from the Horde until 5.4?

No, we went to Pandaria because Blizzard wanted players to be able to play as Pandaren and Brewmasters. Blizzard also wanted an expansion set in an East Asian style. Thing is, we knew that BEFORE we even went there.

And yes, as soon as Chen was established as a canon character (way back in vanilla) that made all of his exploits in WC3 canon as well.

[Sondrelk]

I mean, I agree - you claimed they were well known as a reason for the WoD>Legion connection being stronger though.

The WoD Legion connection was Gul'dan surviving at the end of the HFC raid and being sent through the portal to somewhere.
The Tomb of Sargeras om the Broken Isles was a well known location in WoW lore as a place with loads of demons.

There is a vast difference between a location being mentioned in a book in a dungeon far away from the main location of the expansion. A book which is not even part of any quest or otherwise. And a location shown in the first mission of the Nelf campaign in Warcraft 3, a mission well known for also giving us the Azshara/Naga connection, and prominently featuring fan favorite Illidan.

[Makorus]

No, we went to Pandaria because Blizzard wanted players to be able to play as Pandaren and Brewmasters. Blizzard also wanted an expansion set in an East Asian style. Thing is, we knew that BEFORE we even went there.

And yes, as soon as Chen was established as a canon character (way back in vanilla) that made all of his exploits in WC3 canon as well.

Yeah, just like Blizzard wants people to go to Avaloren? But it's not good enough because ...?

[NikolaiShade]

As for the setup: Odyn was never ok with the dragons being elevated to Aspects. But at least they were still serving Titans. Now, with Aspects breaking with Titans, and gaining their powers back not through the Titans but (possibly) directly through Elune, and us stealing his Storm Drakes, he's sure to be pissed. Assuming the Heretics were worshipping Elune and Life, he could decide that it's time to end it once and for all and he goes to Avaloren himself instead of sending some missions.

Honestly there are many ways to introduce a new landmass: Odyn wants to go there and work out some stress; Iridikron goes there and tyr compels us to follow him; Freya warns us to go there.

The problem here is: what is known about that landmass? It's the first time the player and the character know the same things. Think about it, one of my toon is a dreanei paladin, what the heck should he have known about chen stormstout? on the other hand I knew who Chen was and what panadaria was. This time we (characters and player) know the same informations: there are heretics (very well defended and one could infer technological advanced) in avaloren; a dragon has gone to the west and could have given birth to new dragons (how? what kind of dragons are? what kind of "powers" do they posses?); pirates returned with riches after going to the west; and there are earthens that mysteriously act like dwarves in Khaz Algar, and we are presuming Khaz Algar is in AValoren or near it.

Honestly can I admit I find this setup more interesting than Dragon Isles and Pandaria?

[Neoplanet]

As for the setup: Odyn was never ok with the dragons being elevated to Aspects. But at least they were still serving Titans. Now, with Aspects breaking with Titans, and gaining their powers back not through the Titans but (possibly) directly through Elune, and us stealing his Storm Drakes, he's sure to be pissed. Assuming the Heretics were worshipping Elune and Life, he could decide that it's time to end it once and for all and he goes to Avaloren himself instead of sending some missions.

Thats why i belive tyr is still a good guy , and Odyn will.be the "titan" villan

[Sondrelk]

On a scale of 1-10, how likely is it that the reveal on Friday is that the expansion is about Avaloren?

Avaloren specifically probably 6-7 out of 10. Khaz Algar though I would put as a 9 out of 10.
We don't have a concrete link between Avaloren and Khaz Algar after all, just them being mentioned in the same place.

[Hitei]

On a scale of 1-10, how likely is it that the reveal on Friday is that the expansion is about Avaloren?

7.5ish or thereabouts.

[Delever]

Okay, let me add another level.
What the Character wants.

Because as it so happens MoP is probably the best one in that regards. You see no one, not the Alliance nor the Horde, went there for Pandas. They went there for Anduin. If you are a die-hard horde player, hurting the Alliance King sounds just what you might want to do. And as an Alliance player who saw him every time you went into the throne room and his father ever since Wrath began, you might actually care for either of them. And if so you would be happy to embark on a rescue mission.

But now with Chromie time and you just doing one slice of the whole journey something like this might not work again.

And I agree wholeheartedly with what you just said. But this lore justification was given after the expansion announcement, not before. They can very well do the same with avaloren. Again I m not saying it will be good. I just fail to see why people suddenly think this is strange other than the fact that they would be attempting to add new zones instead of ones that already existed. I just don't see anything out of order here. It would happen at some point.

[Gloriandus]

I would prefer to have Avaloren to be a goal to reach, not "go there from the start". Something that when you finally get to it, it's mind-blowing. Kind of like the first time you enter Divinity's Reach in GW2. Like, whoa! Maybe first patch is just "getting there".