Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Val the Moofia Boss]

How long do you think it will take the average user here to understand that Blizzard doesn't have a plan or a logic, they only have arbitrary made-up rules of what constitutes a "cool" and varied enough setting for an expansion?

In five years after The Last Titan releases.

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Similarly, an asspulled, April Fools' joke like Pandaria served as an expansion setting. Meanwhile, Nazjatar and Ny'alotha, long-awaited realms of darkness and despair from many whispers throughout the years, were just a patch setting.

Blizzard doesn't have any plan or logic, they only care if a continent is varied and fresh enough to be tolerable for an entire expansion. Argus, Nazjatar, and Ny'alotha didn't have enough variety to be tolerable for two entire years, while Kul Tiras and Pandaria did.

WoD was 70% Orc and Blizzard made an expansion out of that, because at the time they still had passion for Orcs. Argus had way more potential as it was once the Draenei homeworld... 25,000 years ago, and had since become the headquarters for a galaxy spanning legion and could have now been host to many other races (as well as possibly other races that existed on Argus 25,000 years ago besides Draenei). But Blizzard didn't have passion for that so it was written off in a patch and you just get more Eredar and demons rather than anything brand new like Pandaria's creativity.

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"We present you the World Soul Saga, a story that will span multiple expansions" *proceeds to explain where each expansion will take us*, and from the latest interviews "We already know how it will all end", but "Blizzard doesn't have a plan or a logic".

This is nothing different from how Blizzard has operated for the past two decades, where they are always planning two expansions ahead and we still got shit planning. Only difference is this time they're telling us ahead of time what they were planning.

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Emerald Dream and Argus would not work for me as expac "continents", because first one is a primal Azeroth

Zones for an Emerald Dream expansion have been brainstormed time after time again. There was a lot of potential there. It is ludicrous to boil it down to "it's all just going to be green forest zones!" rhetoric.

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Varodoc has a point. If anything the writing in WoW never commits to anything. For example, we just finished a whole expansion about the Aspects getting back their "aspectral" powers, something they've been struggling with for a decade & they've never actually explained what those powers are. Its easy to write the premise of a plot, but writing a proper climax, the thing they usually struggle with, to an expansion requires committing to the plot currently going on. And the World Soul Saga seems like an excuse to never write a climax, because like Dragonflight, each expansion is just the prelude for what's coming next.

Killing the Lich King felt like an accomplishment. It felt like you had beaten the ultimate villain and had saved the world, felt like you had beaten the game. Same with Dragon Soul and defeating the humongous world ending dragon, and even same with Siege of Orgrimmar with bookending the story with Grommash's son and ending the Horde vs Alliance conflict. It felt like an ending. I haven't felt that in the game in a long time. Not with Archimonde. Not with blue guy. Not with giant tentacle monster. Not with the janitor. Not with the firey ben 10 alien.

[milkmustache]

The Titans (some will aid us) and the Keepers. Probably some Light forces too.

I've gotten the feeling that the "conspiracy" of TLT will be that Aman'thul amongst others is entirely compromised by the Light and plans to deliver Azeroth to them in some form

[AOL Instant Messenger]

You fight Blackfuse Company goblins in Hellfire Citadel, after the AU Dark Portal was destroyed and the only portals to and from Azeroth were being manned by Horde/Alliance mages, which meant that the Blackfuse Company would have had to have travelled with Garrosh into the past to arrive on AU Draenor.

When and how? We know how Garrosh got there, and he went there with only Kairoz accompanying him. They'd have to have come through around the time when the Dark Portal was redirected, well after the Iron Horde got off the ground.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I mean... I think it's gonna be quite literal. Titular baddie.

Either Iridikron is going to prove to be correct and we slightly team with him, or Iridikron kills a/multiple Titans and they decide to remove Azeroth from her stasis and reoriginate the planet.

We'll be god-killers.

So the mobs you will be fighting in The Last Titan will be Titanforged? Stone dwarves, mechagonmes, vyrkul, and celestials like Algalon?

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When and how? We know how Garrosh got there, and he went there with only Kairoz accompanying him. They'd have to have come through around the time when the Dark Portal was redirected, well after the Iron Horde got off the ground.

Ah, now I remember. There was a subplot in the War Crimes novel about Zaela going around assembling Garrosh loyalists for the Garrosh jail break at the Temple of the White Tiger. I don't recall if they teleported with Garrosh and Kairoz to AU Draenor or somehow regrouped with him there later.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Please, do continue.

I swear, the skepticism over the ringed stasis chambers that appear in the logo of an expansion called "The Last Titan" — an expansion about the dark secrets of the titans — being titan technology is ridiculously arbitrary. I have no clue why or how anybody could doubt it.

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Ah, now I remember. There was a subplot in the War Crimes novel about Zaela going around assembling Garrosh loyalists for the Garrosh jail break at the Temple of the White Tiger. I don't recall if they teleported with Garrosh and Kairoz to AU Draenor or somehow regrouped with him there later.

It's just Kairoz and Garrosh. Zaela and her ilk retreated but seem to have remained on Azeroth and only regrouped with Garrosh after the Dark Portal reopened.

[milkmustache]

So the mobs you will be fighting in The Last Titan will be Titanforged? Stone dwarves, mechagonmes, vyrkul, and celestials like Algalon?

I'm unsure the specific mobs, but they will certainly be Titan aligned. I'm under the belief that Aman'thul is an agent of Light, so that's a possibility. Aside from that, we'll see as we get closer, but it seems certain that the Titans in some form may not be on our side.

[Merryck]

I hope we go off-world in Midnight to a planet with sky boxes like Argus, particularly Eredath. K'aresh is obviously a good candidate.

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Midnight is by far the most hype expansion ... imagine the priest sets.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Please, do continue.

War of the scaleborn was released after 10.1 when the toy was put out and new lore overrides old lore so even assuming toys are suppose to be lore indicators or dragon made stuff wouldn’t be called “Titan” the prisons would still be like all dragon.

This is how the lore has always worked. sorry, not sorry.

[Kiivar86]

I hope we go off-world in Midnight to a planet with sky boxes like Argus, particularly Eredath. K'aresh is obviously a good candidate.

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Midnight is by far the most hype expansion ... imagine the priest sets.

I'd be shocked if we don't go off-world somehow. Memory serves they talked about portals being opened so would make sense we push back in somewhere.

[Polybius]

I hope we go off-world in Midnight to a planet with sky boxes like Argus, particularly Eredath. K'aresh is obviously a good candidate.

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Midnight is by far the most hype expansion ... imagine the priest sets.

The set will just be glowing pieces of a Naaru corpse, with big purple swirlies imploding us into the infinite abyss. The 4-piece shall make us one with the void, at long last.

[Xilurm]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/earthen...earthen-339139

Look at all that 3D armor. I like this.

[Chickat]

Ive been trying to find zone flythroughs and managed to find this one. A good idea of the scope of Hallowfall. It has to be the biggest zone ever made. It looks a good bit bigger than Azure span to me. And the verticality is amazing. It should shut up people complaining about lesser expansions imo. Sure only 4 zones, but 4 zones with at least double environmental variety compared to older standard zones, and twice the size etc. Its like getting 7 or 8 zones of Legion size. Definitely not a large patch like some complained about.

[Auxis]

I hope we go off-world in Midnight to a planet with sky boxes like Argus, particularly Eredath. K'aresh is obviously a good candidate.

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Midnight is by far the most hype expansion ... imagine the priest sets.

Do we know if the Ethereal's still occupy what's left of K'aresh? I'd be interested in seeing a true Ethereal city, and I'd imagine a possible wellspring of nether energies (like Netherstorm) at the remains of their homework would be an ideal location. I like to imagine bizarro-ancient-Egyptian architecture given their similarities to mummies.

[Auxis]

Also, I noticed in the official patch notes for 10.2.7 that they posted yesterday: they mentioned that the Darkspear heritage comes with 2 different helmets. Maybe they listened and are giving us a mask and mask/face-cloth option?

[Kiivar86]

Do we know if the Ethereal's still occupy what's left of K'aresh? I'd be interested in seeing a true Ethereal city, and I'd imagine a possible wellspring of nether energies (like Netherstorm) at the remains of their homework would be an ideal location. I like to imagine bizarro-ancient-Egyptian architecture given their similarities to mummies.

I don't think its confirmed one way or another but I was looking up info the other day relating to this and the only thing indicating it may still exist is a line said by a mob way back in TBC, the Grand Collector who is the final boss of the Bash'ir Landing raid event in Blade's Edge Mountains. When he spawns he shouts "They called me down from K'aresh to deal with this band of misfits? Unbelievable! Prepare to be collected!" which seems to imply that K'aresh still exists.

[Chickat]

I was doing some BS napkin math and I believe we will be getting Legion classic and The Last Titan within 6 months of eachother.

Thats assuming 12-14 months of Cata, 14-16 of MoP, 12-14 of WoD (hopefully with changes and a little bit of cut content)

Assuming 20 months for the next 2 expansions that puts The Last Titan somewhere around Nov 2027 and March 2028. Legion classic Somewhere between Sept 2027 and May 2028.

Idk if anyone cares but I found it interesting. We will also be in Shadowlands again in the beginning or middle of the next trilogy after Worldsoul saga assuming they will do another.

[Enrif]

So, i have been out of the loop for a bit. But apparently we got more Hallowfall stuff? I saw in the belular stream from yesterday some snippets of NPCs dialog from the Arathi and Anduin/Alleria.

So, to get this right:

The Arathi have an Empire of Light on another continent on Azeroth, probably Avaloren, with their own Emperor of Light.
The Arathi arrived just 15 years ago by ship at Khaz Algar, a whole Armada, but the light crystal teleported them down to the cave of Hallowfall.
When Anduin arrives at Hallowfall and sees the Crystal, he instantly gets another "radiant song" message?


Well, that are some interesting developments. So no time travel, but the "rather recently" was indeed recently and not hundreds of years ago. Considering that a whole Armada set sail to Khaz Algar 15 years ago, Dragonflight is apparently in year 40, so in year 25, which would be the time of Vanilla/Classic... huh, these mysterious things happening in season of discovery (the crystal, the people watching and killing), might they actually be of the arathi? And the armada managed to get to Khaz Algar, without being spotted by either horde or alliance marines? Makes for interesting thoughts about their travel route. Most likely from south of pandaria would be my guess. (the old Ulduar in pre-Vanilla dev map for WoW?)

That Anduin relates to the crystal with the radiant song is no coincidence in my mind. The radiant song, IS the crystal. Well, rather the naaru inside of it. And seeing as the naaru turns to dark over and over again, it makes sense that Alleria might hear another voice. Probably the same naaru, but when it is in its dark state.

very intriguing. Especially the whole empire of light thing that might be new continent that might get us a evil light expansion without the whole alternate Yrel timeline.

[Chickat]

I wonder if they are doing a long term world revamp for 14.0. We have been saying that for 8 years, but..

They have a ton of assets useable for one from MoP till now. They will have a ton more by then. Especially considering they are revamping Northrend and Quel'thalas.

My question is, does revamping existing places save any amount of time?

Using BFA, WoD, Legion, DF, TWW, Midnight, TLT assets, surely they have over half of the assets they would need to revamp EK and Kalimdor with a lot less new art.

Would anyone be angry with a revamp using 75% existing assets from the past modern expansions?

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So, i have been out of the loop for a bit. But apparently we got more Hallowfall stuff? I saw in the belular stream from yesterday some snippets of NPCs dialog from the Arathi and Anduin/Alleria.

So, to get this right:

The Arathi have an Empire of Light on another continent on Azeroth, probably Avaloren, with their own Emperor of Light.
The Arathi arrived just 15 years ago by ship at Khaz Algar, a whole Armada, but the light crystal teleported them down to the cave of Hallowfall.
When Anduin arrives at Hallowfall and sees the Crystal, he instantly gets another "radiant song" message?


Well, that are some interesting developments. So no time travel, but the "rather recently" was indeed recently and not hundreds of years ago. Considering that a whole Armada set sail to Khaz Algar 15 years ago, Dragonflight is apparently in year 40, so in year 25, which would be the time of Vanilla/Classic... huh, these mysterious things happening in season of discovery (the crystal, the people watching and killing), might they actually be of the arathi? And the armada managed to get to Khaz Algar, without being spotted by either horde or alliance marines? Makes for interesting thoughts about their travel route. Most likely from south of pandaria would be my guess. (the old Ulduar in pre-Vanilla dev map for WoW?)

That Anduin relates to the crystal with the radiant song is no coincidence in my mind. The radiant song, IS the crystal. Well, rather the naaru inside of it. And seeing as the naaru turns to dark over and over again, it makes sense that Alleria might hear another voice. Probably the same naaru, but when it is in its dark state.

very intriguing. Especially the whole empire of light thing that might be new continent that might get us a evil light expansion without the whole alternate Yrel timeline.

Yeah, I wonder if its possible that Azeroth is already dead after BFA and we just don't know it? Would explain why Magni doesnt talk to her anymore and why hes stone now instead of crystal. Or if not dead, dorment again. I defintely think the song is the crystal though. Perhaps the final patch wont be saving Azeroth at all if the song is the crystal?

The only thing im certain of is that we are going to Undermine in 11.1 which is cool.

[Hitei]

I was doing some BS napkin math and I believe we will be getting Legion classic and The Last Titan within 6 months of eachother.

Thats assuming 12-14 months of Cata, 14-16 of MoP, 12-14 of WoD (hopefully with changes and a little bit of cut content)

Assuming 20 months for the next 2 expansions that puts The Last Titan somewhere around Nov 2027 and March 2028. Legion classic Somewhere between Sept 2027 and May 2028.

Idk if anyone cares but I found it interesting. We will also be in Shadowlands again in the beginning or middle of the next trilogy after Worldsoul saga assuming they will do another.

I don't think they are going to do any post-Cata classic developments. WoD+ (and to a lesser extent MoP+) the game is so similar to current expansions that it's just not worth running separate instances for what is basically glorified year-long timewalking. I think that is the point of MoP remix, they are testing the waters by just having a classic-style season run in regular retail.

Because when MoP remix is really well liked, they can just do Draenor remix, and Legion remix, etc. instead of running only slightly different versions of the game by having something like Legion classic.

Meanwhile I imagine that they will move on from SoD to some other seasonal idea for classic-classic, and probably rotate back through Vanilla>BC>Wrath fresh.

[Enrif]

Yeah, I wonder if its possible that Azeroth is already dead after BFA and we just don't know it? Would explain why Magni doesnt talk to her anymore and why hes stone now instead of crystal. Or if not dead, dorment again. I defintely think the song is the crystal though. Perhaps the final patch wont be saving Azeroth at all if the song is the crystal?

The only thing im certain of is that we are going to Undermine in 11.1 which is cool.

I don't think Azeroth is dead. In BfA we were apparently very successful in closing the Wounds. I think rather the last action of the Jailor is what brought in the upcoming problems. Yet, the Aspects just got their powers from Azeroth... so the messaging is rather confusing, about the world soul.