Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Makabreska]

I'm maintaining my insane dose of Copium that we will see Khadgar return at some point. I refuse to let go

Well, in stories like this, if we wont see him killed Varian-style in a cutscene and instead he goes missing during the catastrophe, then he is alive.

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I'm more worried about Dalaran itself than khadgar... Losing another full city and such an iconic one is sad. Hope we get a promise of getting a new dalaran in the future.

Eh, let's not forget Dalaran was already destroyed once and then rebuild. But I grown bored of the place so tis fine it's gone.

[milkmustache]

I'm more worried about Dalaran itself than khadgar... Losing another full city and such an iconic one is sad. Hope we get a promise of getting a new dalaran in the future.

I know that consensus seems to be that Silvermoon will be reclaimed as some large hub for Midnight, but I'm still leaning in the camp that maybe we'd see a rebuilt Dalaran. Far less convinced than I was pre-alpha, but I think it's still possible.

I just think that Silvermoon would be an incredible, incredible questing zone.

[huth]

I'm maintaining my insane dose of Copium that we will see Khadgar return at some point. I refuse to let go

Well, we had his mentor come back somehow. It's not totally out of possibility.

[Hugnomo]

I hope we see Kahdgar back, a new rebuilt dalaran and Dalaranian humans as a new allied race. Kahdgar sporting a new Merlin/Gandalf-esque look, leader of the Council of Six, leading Dalaran and a new playable race of lithe humans with the sorcerer wizard archetype for customizations (long beards, fancy hairstyles, etc).

I love the idea of having the several human kingdoms as fleshed out, distinct playable "races" like we got with Stormwind, Gilneas, Kul'Tiras and Lordaeron (forsaken). Plus, it seems like the Arathi, the original one, would not be difficult to implement (looking at the alpha), and they'd fulfill the more religious theme of the human culture.

[allegrian]

I hope we see Kahdgar back, a new rebuilt dalaran and Dalaranian humans as a new allied race. Kahdgar sporting a new Merlin/Gandalf-esque look, leader of the Council of Six, leading Dalaran and a new playable race of lithe humans with the sorcerer wizard archetype for customizations (long beards, fancy hairstyles, etc).

I love the idea of having the several human kingdoms as fleshed out, distinct playable "races" like we got with Stormwind, Gilneas, Kul'Tiras and Lordaeron (forsaken). Plus, it seems like the Arathi, the original one, would not be difficult to implement (looking at the alpha), and they'd fulfill the more religious theme of the human culture.

The wizard beards for humans are long overdue, our only option are short races like gnomes and dwarves for their wizard beards, but they're too short to feel the same as the classic wizard archetype.

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Well, in stories like this, if we wont see him killed Varian-style in a cutscene and instead he goes missing during the catastrophe, then he is alive.

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Eh, let's not forget Dalaran was already destroyed once and then rebuild. But I grown bored of the place so tis fine it's gone.

The thing is dalaran is not only a physical place, it's a symbol, like the mage hub (literally in Legion), one of the original human kingdoms, the main hub of 2 of the most beloved expansions and is basically wow's hogwarts seeing how even kaelthas, the king of the magic elves learned magic there.

[milkmustache]

I hope we see Kahdgar back, a new rebuilt dalaran and Dalaranian humans as a new allied race. Kahdgar sporting a new Merlin/Gandalf-esque look, leader of the Council of Six, leading Dalaran and a new playable race of lithe humans with the sorcerer wizard archetype for customizations (long beards, fancy hairstyles, etc).

I love the idea of having the several human kingdoms as fleshed out, distinct playable "races" like we got with Stormwind, Gilneas, Kul'Tiras and Lordaeron (forsaken). Plus, it seems like the Arathi, the original one, would not be difficult to implement (looking at the alpha), and they'd fulfill the more religious theme of the human culture.

I like the idea of those customizations being added to humans, but I think if Dalaranian Humans become an allied race there would be a legitimate outrage.

He'll definitely be back in pure Gandalf the White style. He's a great anchor for the story without having to dilute the uniqueness of Horde and Alliance leaders. It's a lot more fun to have all-knowing wizard dictate two bickering groups to fight together than it is to just have assumed unity and no flavor to it.

[Lahis]

Classic Wizard customization for humans? Yes please.

Classic Wizard customization as a another Allied Race that should have been a customization option instead? No thank you.

[Hugnomo]

I like the idea of those customizations being added to humans, but I think if Dalaranian Humans become an allied race there would be a legitimate outrage.

He'll definitely be back in pure Gandalf the White style. He's a great anchor for the story without having to dilute the uniqueness of Horde and Alliance leaders. It's a lot more fun to have all-knowing wizard dictate two bickering groups to fight together than it is to just have assumed unity and no flavor to it.

Why do you think there'd be outrage? Not to be combative, just genuinely asking.
I get that some people prefer for there to be more customizations to base races than new allied races. But the playable humans we have are very clearly established to be from Stormwind. Wouldn't it be cool to have a new group, with unique racials, mounts, city, aesthetics, join the fray? Instead of having new customizations that you can roleplay as being a "dalaranian human" without having that recognized in game?

I feel like some of the grievances about allied races don't make much sense. Because they *are* new customizations for the base races, just with *more* attached to it.
Is it that people perceive the extra work they have in creating a racial mount/racials/totems/paladin mount comes at the expense of developing something else?
If they're going to spend resources making new customizations anyway, I find it to be even better that they use them to flesh out an unexplored group/race/political faction than to have more of the same.
Personally, I hated that we got wildhammer customization baked into the bronzebeards, while dark irons actually got premium treatment (racials, heritage armor, mounts, totems, intro quests).
Obviously, in an ideal world we would get both new customizations and new allied races and eventually regular new races.

[Joshuaj]

Questing through Cataclysm again and oh boy. The frat bro culture stench was really all over the game back then

A complete polar opposite to how queer and "woke" Dragonflight feels

Wait until you hear how social media influence works

[Hugnomo]

Classic Wizard customization for humans? Yes please.

Classic Wizard customization as a another Allied Race that should have been a customization option instead? No thank you.

Could you elaborate on why you feel that way in regards to the second sentence?

I'm thinking that for people who have already invested in a stormwind human character, and have always wanted or roleplayed as a dalaranian wizard, it'd be crappy to have to make a new character instead. Are there more reasons that I could be missing?

[Joshuaj]

I'm more worried about Dalaran itself than khadgar... Losing another full city and such an iconic one is sad. Hope we get a promise of getting a new dalaran in the future.

Considering how ugly current Dalaran looks, I wouldn't be shocked if this was just their excuse to design a new, better looking Arcane City.

[Ersula]

Could you elaborate on why you feel that way in regards to the second sentence?

I'm thinking that for people who have already invested in a stormwind human character, and have always wanted or roleplayed as a dalaranian wizard, it'd be crappy to have to make a new character instead. Are there more reasons that I could be missing?

Like with High elves, people are asking for options they already have. They only want the meta semantics of saying it's a unique race, which creates conflict because any new "Dalaran human" customization will be demanded be included in "stormwind human" customization.

Arathi already simply use Stormwind & Kul Tiran human models. Kirin Tor have always used Stormwind models. Players should do the same. (Though I would say for the sake of RP, the allied race tag should be removed. As in "Kul Tiran Human" should just say "human." "Void elf" should just say "elf" on your character tag.)

Wait until you hear how social media influence works

yeah that's called "feedback." It's what you want from your consumers.

[Hugnomo]

Like with High elves, people are asking for options they already have. They only want the meta semantics of saying it's a unique race, which creates conflict because any new "Dalaran human" customization will be demanded be included in "stormwind human" customization.

Arathi already simply use Stormwind & Kul Tiran human models. Kirin Tor have always used Stormwind models. Players should do the same. (Though I would say for the sake of RP, the allied race tag should be removed. As in "Kul Tiran Human" should just say "human." "Void elf" should just say "elf" on your character tag.)
yeah that's called "feedback." It's what you want from your consumers.

But what is wrong in wanting a specific fantasy to be expressed in game? Whether that be Burly sailors, Silver covenant elves, aristocratic human mages, Sun elves, void elves ... These are all distinct themes. Maybe not enough for a full new race (though they did manage to do that with Gilneans), but different enough for there to make sense having a distinct group with different customizations, racials, hubs, mounts, etc. Kirin Tor have always had stormwind models, that's true. But like, Sylvanas had a night elf model at one point. I don't know, I don't really get arguing for less things. If we can get more diverse fantasies expressed in game, and there's people who want it, I don't get the instinct to stifle that. The only reason I genuinely do concede is that these resources could be allocated to things other people would prefer. That's fine, it's a matter of preference. But being against it at face value I don't really get.

[Ersula]

But what is wrong in wanting a specific fantasy to be expressed in game? Whether that be Burly sailors, Silver covenant elves, aristocratic human mages, Sun elves, void elves ... These are all distinct themes. Maybe not enough for a full new race (though they did manage to do that with Gilneans), but different enough for there to make sense having a distinct group with different customizations, racials, hubs, mounts, etc. Kirin Tor have always had stormwind models, that's true. But like, Sylvanas had a night elf model at one point. I don't know, I don't really get arguing for less things. If we can get more diverse fantasies expressed in game, and there's people who want it, I don't get the instinct to stifle that. The only reason I genuinely do concede is that these resources could be allocated to things other people would prefer. That's fine, it's a matter of preference. But being against it at face value I don't really get.

How is Wizard a race??? Dalaran is literally a collegate town made from sending mage candidates from the other human cities. They're not a divergent species. The Arathi turned into the eastern kingdoms less than 1000 years ago.

[Makorus]

I know that consensus seems to be that Silvermoon will be reclaimed as some large hub for Midnight, but I'm still leaning in the camp that maybe we'd see a rebuilt Dalaran. Far less convinced than I was pre-alpha, but I think it's still possible.

I just think that Silvermoon would be an incredible, incredible questing zone.

The thing with Silvermoon depends on how it will be handled.

Will the inevitable Void take-over happen at the start and it becomes Suramar essentially, or is it something we prevent?

I think #1 will be cooler but people are crying for a revamped Silvermoon.

[Hugnomo]

How is Wizard a race??? Dalaran is literally a collegate town made from sending mage candidates from the other human cities. They're not a divergent species. The Arathi turned into the eastern kingdoms less than 1000 years ago.

Well neither of the races we have are "races" anyway.
For there to be a distinct race there isn't a strict, settled criteria. But being of a different, sovereign political group is a trait that is common to all of them. Maghar and MU orcs are technically the same race. So are Zandalari and darkspear. Kultirans and Stormwindians. But they are are disparate groups of people, with their own governance, culture, themes.

"Wizard" is a theme, archetype. The Kingdom of Dalaran is a distinct group of humans who formed their own kingdom, with their specific style of governance, leadership, culture and themes. Just like the Kultiran were before them.

[Vakir]

I'm maintaining my insane dose of Copium that we will see Khadgar return at some point. I refuse to let go

I have hope. The description says he's "nowhere to be found" and presumed - typically a major hero doesn't go down unless we have a body (or figuratively in Varian's case) and they get a long, dramatic, and unambiguous death scene.

Doesn't preclude him dying later in the same expansion, mind you. Again, like Varian. A number of close calls in a full CGI cinematic followed by dying shortly later.

[Chickat]

That key art goes hard.

Anybody know where if possible I could get a 1440P version of that key art for my desktop?

[Makabreska]

Anybody know where if possible I could get a 1440P version of that key art for my desktop?

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...your/#lightbox

[Makorus]

But what is wrong in wanting a specific fantasy to be expressed in game? Whether that be Burly sailors, Silver covenant elves, aristocratic human mages, Sun elves, void elves ... These are all distinct themes. Maybe not enough for a full new race (though they did manage to do that with Gilneans), but different enough for there to make sense having a distinct group with different customizations, racials, hubs, mounts, etc. Kirin Tor have always had stormwind models, that's true. But like, Sylvanas had a night elf model at one point. I don't know, I don't really get arguing for less things. If we can get more diverse fantasies expressed in game, and there's people who want it, I don't get the instinct to stifle that. The only reason I genuinely do concede is that these resources could be allocated to things other people would prefer. That's fine, it's a matter of preference. But being against it at face value I don't really get.

??? Dalaran is literally a different city. Are we gonna get Lorlathil Night Elves, Camp Ataya Taurens etc. added as Allied Races as well?

If you live in Florida, do you consider people from California or the UK a different race as well?

It's a waste of a race slot. What's the point of having different races for different character customization options? Having all human customization under "Humans" actually makes it way better to express a specific fantasy. And all it requires people to do is to, y'know, roleplay. That's why the Mag'har Orc thing and the Dark Iron thing is so bad. Because it actively hinders roleplaying.