Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Raetary]

"The loneliness you pretend not to feel" WTF is this coming from? You're married. You have a husband and a son and can have even more children, and you are a beloved hero of your community.

She's half a void aberration, everyone views her with distrust at best or is flat out antagonistic at worst, she constantly hears deprecatory whispers trying to break her psyche.

Her short story and TWW setup all revolve around her isolating herself from friends and family as she thinks she poses too much of a threat.

Also very much lol at "you are married and have children" as if that stopped anyone ever from feeling isolated and alone.

[Polybius]

No it doesn't. It's a 1300s word that was in common use in English up into the 1900s. Why are you saying Tolkien made it up? I'd be surprised if he was even the first person to use it in a fantasy context, given people like Lord Dunsany and REH.



Tolkien isn't the sole source of all Western fantasy, don't give me that, I can argue to the death on it, though if you want that we should do it in a different thread. People who see Tolkien as the sole origin point of all Western fantasy are simply ignorant. As are people who think he's the main influence on Warcraft. He's not even close. D&D and Warhammer are the main influences, with large chunks of other factors, like 1990s superhero comics. D&D and Warhammer are themselves both significantly influenced by Tolkien, but he's only like 20% of the picture, because other authors, most forgotten now, were also huge, huge influences on both - particularly Michael Moorcock. Hell Warhammer would be completely different without Moorcock - so would an awful lot of metal music.

The biggest influence LotR had absolutely wasn't what fantasy was about, but how it was presented - changing from short stories with variable amounts of worldbuilding, to increasingly huge serial novels with extensive, sometimes ridiculous, worldbuilding.

Hot take but I always found him overrated. It's as if we never had cultures to draw inspiration from for fantasy.

[Valysar]

What time does the beta come out? (In how many hours, so that I understand better.)

[Dracullus]

What time does the beta come out? (In how many hours, so that I understand better.)

I don't think it's something they can time precisely. Not to mention high chance it will be completely broken on start. I guess around 19/7PM EU time tomorrow.

[BaumanKing]

"The loneliness you pretend not to feel" WTF is this coming from? You're married. You have a husband and a son and can have even more children, and you are a beloved hero of your community.

What a tone-deaf thing to say. Alleria has been trapped in a loveless and sexless marriage for a thousand years. Her husband doesn't even try to understand her. And her son just admitted in a recent short story that he has little in common with her. The people of Quel'Thalas fear her and the Alliance doesn't trust her. She's all alone.

And Alleria is not some broodmare who needs to have children so she won't feel lonely. I hope her story becomes a beautiful allegory of a homosexual woman finally coming out and leaving her loveless heterosexual marriage behind. This would be a much more empowering story arc than her simply returning to a man who doesn't understand her. They just don't belong to each other.

[Cherry123]

I honestly don't get the Xal'atath obsession. There is no depth there. I guess it is just the voice acting together with them making her an elf?

Literally copy and paste every expansion new "sexy edgy waifu" And you will profit from a large number of fans of aesthetics and dominance.

Literally kill her and replacing her with another Harley Quinn will make the old one forgotten.

One day Blizzard will understand why it works this way. They will understand that not only cool sexy women make a profit. But so do confident, handsome men. Women love confident men and not whiners who are constantly moping

Christie Golden and her inclusive followers don't make money. The world is ruled by beautiful and confident people. No one will love a freak

[Enrif]

Hot take but I always found him overrated. It's as if we never had cultures to draw inspiration from for fantasy.

Tolkien is fine, but he stands on a pedestal not quite earned by his own. Most of his stuff is just christian myhtology mixed with germanic folklore. Heck, Brothers Grimm are just like him, just collecting all the fringe stories and making it available for the broader masses.

But, that is the point. Without the Brothers Grimm, Tolkien and those that followed what they started we wouldn't have the fantasy genres we have today. Their influence is unmistakingley prevalent in any sort of modern fantasy.

[Dracullus]

Tolkien is fine, but he stands on a pedestal not quite earned by his own. Most of his stuff is just christian myhtology mixed with germanic folklore. Heck, Brothers Grimm are just like him, just collecting all the fringe stories and making it available for the broader masses.

But, that is the point. Without the Brothers Grimm, Tolkien and those that followed what they started we wouldn't have the fantasy genres we have today. Their influence is unmistakingley prevalent in any sort of modern fantasy.

EVERYONE takes from someone. Even our myths were forming for thousands of years, they were just pass from man to man before someone wrote them.

[Xilurm]

And Alleria is not some broodmare who needs to have children so she won't feel lonely. I hope her story becomes a beautiful allegory of a homosexual woman finally coming out and leaving her loveless heterosexual marriage behind. This would be a much more empowering story arc than her simply returning to a man who doesn't understand her. They just don't belong to each other.

This gotta be satire, right?

[BaumanKing]

This gotta be satire, right?

Allegory, not satire. Alleria is definitely queer-coded. Both in terms of her appearance and in terms of her backstory. I hope you at least won't argue with this.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Allegory, not satire. Alleria is definitely queer-coded. Both in terms of her appearance and in terms of her backstory. I hope you at least won't argue with this.

It would carry some unfortunate implications if they tried to communicate "queer-coded" through "by choice, physically suffused with a fundamentally alien and unnatural power that poses an objective and tangible danger to those around her".

[Varodoc]

Allegory, not satire. Alleria is definitely queer-coded. Both in terms of her appearance and in terms of her backstory. I hope you at least won't argue with this.

Yeah, she has a husband and a son, that is the only fact worth mentioning.

[Xilurm]

Allegory, not satire. Alleria is definitely queer-coded. Both in terms of her appearance and in terms of her backstory. I hope you at least won't argue with this.

If you mean her new appearance I guess I can understand where you're coming from, but her new hairstyle reminds me of viking women if anything.

As for her backstory, that's just wishful thinking. Her leaving her husband just to turn lesbian just because you seem to hate men sounds pretty toxic.

[Teriz]

For me, the thematic difference between a gnome/goblin tinker and a draenei artificer could just be resolved with mogs and some limited class customization. DF has given many classes customization options, I just don't see why an Artificer class couldn't have the same choice. Does there need to be a mechanical difference between a Lightforged Draenei and a Gnome in a mech? Heck you could use existing professions to give them a way to collect those class options; obviously through engineering but possibly with reagents from JC (for Draenei looks), BS (Orc?) and Alch (Forsaken).

Alternatively, you could resolve it by simply having an Artificer spec and related Hero talent trees. I lean more towards spec, since you also have Nightborne Artificers (and a need for another Horde race), but Draenei and Nightborne alone shouldn't override the far more numerous mechanical-based tech races.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Her leaving her husband just to turn lesbian just because you seem to hate men sounds pretty toxic.

And you have pretty much hit the nail on the head about BaumanKing.

[Cheezits]

Honestly I think that Thrall's loss of connection will not be a retcon of Shadowlands but will instead be directly tied to whatever is interfering with Azeroth/causing the Radiant Song.

It is still really odd that Magni got cut off from Azeroth, including the Song, and that feels tied directly to the elements acting wonky as well. I wouldn't be surprised if they have Thrall say that he did really have the elements back for a second but they drifted away again.

[milkmustache]

Is there some sort of implication that Xal'atath will use the Dark Heart on the player characters/main NPCs?

Knowing what we do about its ability to absorb essence, her statement of "Your fury will be mine" feels a bit more literal. Perhaps that will have something to help usher in Midnight?

[Murlocos]

Is there some sort of implication that Xal'atath will use the Dark Heart on the player characters/main NPCs?

Knowing what we do about its ability to absorb essence, her statement of "Your fury will be mine" feels a bit more literal. Perhaps that will have something to help usher in Midnight?

Demon Hunters, not merely content being meta for so long in Dragonflight, are now the catalysts for entire expansions. When will enough be enough?

[Ersula]

No it doesn't. It's a 1300s word that was in common use in English up into the 1900s. Why are you saying Tolkien made it up? I'd be surprised if he was even the first person to use it in a fantasy context, given people like Lord Dunsany and REH.

Right...but it wasn't a term that meant "magical machinist." Tolkien started that. Like how he originated the word Dwarf to mean something other than a human with a genetic condition. Different words. Different meaning. Same spelling.

It likely won’t be a hero class, but like all expansion classes, it’s going to be based on a Warcraft franchise character. The only Warcraft franchise character that’s tech-based is Gazlowe, and he has a very specific ability set and aesthetic. That aesthetic is the Robo backpack and Goblin tech. It just so happens that that aesthetic is shared by Gnomes, Mgnomes, Dwarves, Earthen, Goblins, and Mimiron.

Because evoker is based on one singular dragon character rather than an entire dragon culture, right? They'd have to decide if they want to make a tech based class' abilities more kitchy or sleek, but I'd bet they'd try to find some middle ground that fits every race. I mean, the Earthen tech looks more sleek & elegant than even the Elven aesthetics. Did you see the Diamond Mech mount? I wouldn't put it closer to gnomes & goblins on that spectrum.

[milkmustache]

All I'm going to say is that you brought this on yourselves....

I argued it with you in pre-announcement times, but you seem to be on track.

I do kind of lean towards Articifer over Tinker, but it could go either way. The Earthen being far more technologically advanced than I anticipated and a probable Undermine makes it feel like a no brainer, opposed to 13.0.

I highly doubt it, buuuut.. I dunno. It could be.

They'd have to decide if they want to make a tech based class' abilities more kitchy or sleek, but I'd bet they'd try to find some middle ground that fits every race. I mean, the Earthen tech looks more sleek & elegant than even the Elven aesthetics. Did you see the Diamond Mech mount? I wouldn't put it closer to gnomes & goblins on that spectrum.

The thing I can't land on is if they go race agnostic and give it to all, or argue the Druid/Paladin side with special art and give it to some.

Off the bat I'd think Goblins, Gnomes, Draenei, Lightforged, Blood Elves, Mag'har, Dwarves (all 3), Nightborne? There'd be a faction imbalance I think.