Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[guro-tchai]

Quel'thalas and Amani mountains. the Chronicles artwork of Silvermoon is gorgeous, but the in-game version doesn't compare. there is a plot to be finished there - a people divided due to the Void, which might be featured fairly soon.

[Houle]

You say luck, I say Zovaal was playing his cards well with the possibilities and whatnot. Regardless, the fact remains in that Sargeras didn't stomp on Zovaal's plans, and the events of the Shadowlands happened the way they did anyway.

So, betting everything on the microscopically small chance that some mortals defy all odds and that everything turns out EXACTLY how he needed it to be, with no chance of influencing the outcome himself, is "playing his cards well" in your opinion? Lol. The actual word for that is "gambling". Zovaal basically won the lottery in Legion. Nothing more, nothing less.
And regardless, much like Sargeras, he got stopped. With the small difference that Zovaal got shanked, while Sargeras is still very much alive.

[huth]

So, betting everything on the microscopically small chance that some mortals defy all odds and that everything turns out EXACTLY how he needed it to be, with no chance of influencing the outcome himself, is "playing his cards well" in your opinion? Lol. The actual word for that is "gambling". Zovaal basically won the lottery in Legion. Nothing more, nothing less.
And regardless, much like Sargeras, he got stopped. With the small difference that Zovaal got shanked, while Sargeras is still very much alive.

I think it's less that he was playing well, and more that he just kept playing again and again. What we saw was just the one plan that worked, not the hundreds of failures preceding it.

He had no shortage of time, after all.

[Hitei]

So, betting everything on the microscopically small chance that some mortals defy all odds and that everything turns out EXACTLY how he needed it to be, with no chance of influencing the outcome himself, is "playing his cards well" in your opinion? Lol. The actual word for that is "gambling". Zovaal basically won the lottery in Legion. Nothing more, nothing less.
And regardless, much like Sargeras, he got stopped. With the small difference that Zovaal got shanked, while Sargeras is still very much alive.

That is not what he did. As Huth said, Zovaal's stratagem wasn't some very specific thousand stepped plan that needed to work out perfectly. He just kept doing all sorts of things and kept very close watch on everything around so that when something useful popped up he could snatch it and make use of it.

He didn't plan his entire strategy around Argus and us beating Argus. Argus was there and a dangerous "soul" so he had the Nathrezim plant a trap in it so that if Argus got defeated, or was eventually killed by Sargeras after he was done with him (to prevent the Void taking him) or just finally ran out of strength, it would be a weapon that could harm Oribos.

His plan wasn't to make the scourge and LK so that he could get to Sylvanas so that he could get to Anduin so that he could steal the Sigils. He had the Dreadlords convince the Legion to use the LK and Scourge so that he could spread his influence in the mortal realm. The LK was rather useless to him, but when Arthas was killed, Sylvanas happened to show up so he saw another potential pawn to send more souls his way. When Sylvanas fucked up her own gambit, he had her kidnap a bunch of potential people in hopes that maybe one could be used as a puppet to retrieve one or more of the sigils for him.

None of it was his set in stone plan. The set in stone plan was "slowly build up enough strength to break out of the Maw with Denathrius, Helya and Mueh'zala's help, then attack Oribos and the other covenant realms, take their sigils by force and use them to access Zereth Mortis and take control of reality." You'll note that most of this plan was already near completion before Shadowlands even happens. Revendreth is already under his control, Maldraxxus is down to a 3 v 1 war between Houses and about to be under his control and Bastion is at the start of a civil war to fall under his control. All the other tools just speed up that base strategy: deal a blow to the Arbiter to get even more souls, sneak an agent into Bastion to steal the sigil without having to take the whole region, etc.

He didn't need the arbiter gone or Argus' trap to work. He already had anima flowing in en masse from Revendreth. It just sped everything up.

- - - Updated - - -

Yes it must take time and I'm really sure it will happen one way or another.

How about the changes?

I hope Durotar will have again a forest as the orcs' heritage quests suggest. I wonder what that would look like.

The Barrens could become a single area again with new giraffes.

On the Alliance side, I don't have too many ideas. Surely Gnomeregan reclaimed, Loch Modan dam rebuilt etc.

Do you have other ideas?

I don't get why people really want to fight troggs and kobols in Loch Modan... but the lake is back. Or be back in Westfall, WPL or Durotar but they're more green and have nicer textures.

WoD was 'revamp' done right. If you're going to revamp a zone it shouldn't just be HD, it should be entirely novel, with new terrain and a new aesthetic. The barrens shouldn't just be one zone again, it should be entirely overtaken by Botani survivors and a sprawling new parasitic jungle. Westfall but besieged by the Naga with a reef raised from the sea floor at the coast. Tirisfal but it's a toxic wasteland overrun by oozes and slime horrors pouring out of Lordaeron/UC (already a lost cause).

[ImTheMizAwesome]

How would you guys feel about rebuild ground mount riding? Again, similar to GW2, like dragonriding is.

Better mount idle animation and rider position, being able to sprint on a ground mount, maybe even add some attack skill that dismounts you but deals some dmg to a mob/mobs.

Of course at the beginning you would have special customizable ground mounts and types, like wolf/saber/horse/goat and some frog etc, for example frog like a bunny in gw2, could jump very high.

[Lady Atia]

How would you guys feel about rebuild ground mount riding? Again, similar to GW2, like dragonriding is.

Better mount idle animation and rider position, being able to sprint on a ground mount, maybe even add some attack skill that dismounts you but deals some dmg to a mob/mobs.

Of course at the beginning you would have special customizable ground mounts and types, like wolf/saber/horse/goat and some frog etc, for example frog like a bunny in gw2, could jump very high.

Would be kinda redundant now that we have Dragonriding tbh.

[ImTheMizAwesome]

Would be kinda redundant now that we have Dragonriding tbh.

I guess that's true.

As someone that still likes to use ground mounts, sometimes i still use them in DF even tho it's a waste of time to go to different zone, but it would be nice if it was revamped, adding some race activities to that and such, but with dragonriding i guess it really is redundant in some ways.

Unless they won't activate flying at the beginning of next expansion, i don't see them doing it.

[Melorandor]

Quel'thalas and Amani mountains. the Chronicles artwork of Silvermoon is gorgeous, but the in-game version doesn't compare. there is a plot to be finished there - a people divided due to the Void, which might be featured fairly soon.

Nah, it got forgotten. Blizzard probably doesn't know who the Void Elves are at this point.

[Mecheon]

They've been doing this for several expansions, do you think a revamp is planned? I don't see why they would do that otherwise.

I just think they like to update old models if they're using the critter in the expansion or because they're old. BfA wind serpents because it was using them regularly

Who even knows why boars got updated though

[Lady Atia]

I guess that's true.

As someone that still likes to use ground mounts, sometimes i still use them in DF even tho it's a waste of time to go to different zone, but it would be nice if it was revamped, adding some race activities to that and such, but with dragonriding i guess it really is redundant in some ways.

Unless they won't activate flying at the beginning of next expansion, i don't see them doing it.

Yeah - it works in GW2 because you start with the raptor and work yourself up to the glider dragon - and since I can't see them taking away dragonriding from max level players again I doubt they would do such a feature just for new players who happen to level up their first char.

Maaaybe if we ever get a non-flying endgame zone again which could give us some kind of wall climbing mount, but again they could just stick with dragonriding.

Edit: Oh, and maybe some kind of updated underwater mount. Special Groudmounts could see a use in PvP/Dungeons but that's either hard to balance or super niché and might break stuff (for example if you could use a bunny jump mount to damage mobs in dungeons etc).

[Makorus]

Would be kinda redundant now that we have Dragonriding tbh.

Yup. You can already see that in GW2 as well. Near enough everyone of the mounts was made redundant when Skyscales were added. The only time you would ever use another mount is for horizontal speed, but often time, you are still better off flying around stuff with a skyscale.

And in WoW, we already started with a (better) Skyscale.

[micwini]

Here's my speculation for 10.2:

primalists want to 'unleash' the emerald dream to overwrite our ordered reality. I think the new zone will be the tree area west of ohnaran planes, after the primalists there successfully bring the dream into/over reality. Or we just go into the dream to stop the primalists there

Actually good and sensible theory. Have a thumbs up lad.

[Santandame]

Yes it must take time and I'm really sure it will happen one way or another.

How about the changes?

I hope Durotar will have again a forest as the orcs' heritage quests suggest. I wonder what that would look like.

The Barrens could become a single area again with new giraffes.

On the Alliance side, I don't have too many ideas. Surely Gnomeregan reclaimed, Loch Modan dam rebuilt etc.

Do you have other ideas?

Here's some ideas I could see for zones:


Durotar - No longer primarily a barren wasteland. Life has seeped into the zone from the North, with forests similar to Ashenvale permeating around Orgrimmar. The Botani, having taken over the Northern Barrens have invaded the zone from the east, bringing their own jungle styled ecosystem with them. Durotar is now a zone teeming with life, but from different eco based systems at war with each other, reflecting the savageness of Draenor. The zone will be a mix of Gorgrond, Tanaan Jungle and a small elven style forest in the North.

Northern Barrens - The Botani have completely taken over the Northern Barrens. It is now a lush jungle full of life, and savage terrain.

Southern Barrens - Alternatively, the Breakers have taken over the Southern Barrens, terraforming much of the zone into dangerous ravines, canyons and a rocky landscape. The border of Northern and Southern Barrens is home to a never ending war between the Botani and Breakers.

Stonetalon Mountains - The Night Elves have regrown the forest in the wake of the Venture Co's destruction. The zone range truly reflects a forested mountain range now. The Saberon that fled Draenor make their home here, as well as a group of Arakkoa.

Desolace - Life continues to flourish in the zone, thanks to the Cenarion Circle's efforts. The northern half the zone is completely teeming with life and jungles. In The Maruuk Centaur have made their way over from the Dragon Isles to establish relations with their long lost centaur relatives. Further south in the zone, corrupted Arakkoa make their home. The Naga have vanished from the coastline. Instead, Dread Admiral Nightsquall sends a contingent of his pirate fleet to scour the ruins for an unknown purpose.

Feralas - The Highborne have repopulated Dire Maul. The Woodpaw Gnolls have learned the magic of Decay from Decatriarch Wratheye, who intends to unite the Gnoll clans under her banner. The Gnoll's lead attacks on Dire Maul, with the southern half of the zone becoming a decayed, blighted forest.

Tanaris - Gadgetztan has expanded, taking up the majority of the zone, with the meat of the zone taking place within the corrupt city. Trade Princes, crime families, syndicate members etc can be found here. Dread Admiral Nightsquall's pirates have a huge presence in the city, and are docked in the harbour.

Winterspring - Mazthoril has been expanded into a major Blue Dragon settlement. Vyranoth having escaped the events of Dragonflight relatively unscathed has destroyed Everlook and creates an Ice Palace in its place. Here she leads the remnants of the Primalists.

[huth]

His plan wasn't to make the scourge and LK so that he could get to Sylvanas so that he could get to Anduin so that he could steal the Sigils. He had the Dreadlords convince the Legion to use the LK and Scourge so that he could spread his influence in the mortal realm. The LK was rather useless to him, but when Arthas was killed, Sylvanas happened to show up so he saw another potential pawn to send more souls his way. When Sylvanas fucked up her own gambit, he had her kidnap a bunch of potential people in hopes that maybe one could be used as a puppet to retrieve one or more of the sigils for him.

Let's not forget that out of the three Lich Kings (Ner'zhul, Arthas, The Bolvar) none did what he wanted. Sylvanas was just happenstance.

The guy took the shotgun approach to planning. Do everything, keep what works.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Let's not forget that out of the three Lich Kings (Ner'zhul, Arthas, The Bolvar) none did what he wanted. Sylvanas was just happenstance.

The guy took the shotgun approach to planning. Do everything, keep what works.

Thats really his fault. He's the one in control.

[Xi Jinping]

Jungle Orgrimmar sounds cool. The city covered in green foliage

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Can we continue talking about future patch/expac speculation please? I don't want anyone to get banned here.

Worry about policing your own posts and less about other people’s posts.

[Aucald]

This thread isn't about the lore of previous expansions such as BfA or Shadowlands, it's about discussing future content patches and expansions. The lore of possible future content would be relevant, but let's keep it on-topic and not keep mining for previous controversy.

[Raetary]

On the Alliance side, I don't have too many ideas. Surely Gnomeregan reclaimed, Loch Modan dam rebuilt etc.

There is a lot of things you could do.

Cleansing and repopulation of the Plaguelands (which should be combined into one zone imo)
Reclamation of Gilneas and the rebuilding of Tirisfal/Lordaeron city/Undercity under the desolate Council.
Easing Gilnean/Forsaken relations.
Lots of Scarlet Crusade activity in that entire region.

Reestablishing Stromgarde as a civilian hub.
Do something with the Raventusk and the elements in the area.

Reclamation of Gnomeregan with the help of Mechagon.
Finalize rebuilding the Dam in Loch Modan.
Maybe do something with Grim Batol.
Expand on that loose plotthread with the Dark Iron cult that wanted to ressurect Ragnaros into a proper Khaz Modan spanning threat, especially around the Blackrock zones.

Add a gilnean presence in Westfall and have them help out the settlers and teach them how to do druidism (yey, human druids) to elevate them out of poverty.
Establish the Stormwind nobility as antagonists and give them a fucking face for once, and have them try to knock Westfall down again.

Unite the Gnolls clans in Redridge and make them a big, 2nd Gnoll War-esque threat.

Add more Gilnean presence in Duskwood, open up the Twilight Grove, do Life/Death shenanigans between the Grove and Raven Hill.
Add more cults and more insane dark magic practitioners, maybe even unite the zone with Deadwind Pass and do something funky with Karazhans influence.

Expansion of Booty Bay and the presence of Goblin ventures in Stranglethorn, maybe do something again with Zul'Gurub.

Turn the Harborage into a proper town.
We know Hakkar isn't fully gone (somehow) so maybe do more Hakkari shenagigans and summon him successfully in Atal'Hakkar. (mostly saying this so Zul'gurub can be used for something else for once, maybe as a proper questhub.)

And i have honestly no idea what to do with the Blasted lands.

[ImTheMizAwesome]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/infinit...1-5-ptr-333268

Are you guys happy with another zaralek recolors?