Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Joshuaj]

The "coming from another realm" is the thing that could be easily retconned. But yeah, we could also keep it that way, and just say that it's a powerful elemental from another planet who got summoned, maybe by mistake like for Ragnaros, by the shadow council.

As for the rest, aren't Elemental creatures of the realm of Order ? The only elementals I can think of from outside would be the death elemental from Shadowlands, but they seem more like a basic amalgam of the potent death energy lingering in that realm.

Considering we know VERY little of the Twisting Nether, it's very possible Murmur comes from an unknown realm in the Disorder domain.

As for the elements, no. The 6 elements of the primordial ring make by the physical building blocks for the mortal realm. The mortal realm is a mixture of all 6 cosmic forces + the primordial ring. However, elementals aren't just "element ring" only. There can be elementals for the other forces magics as well, as we've seen with Arcane (Order), Fel (Disorder), Light/Holy (Light), Anima and Necrotic, (Death), Life and Nature (Life), and more commonly lately, Shadow and Void (Shadow).

Heck, there are Automa Elementals within Zereth Mortis as well.

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Even if Titans happen to not be born from planets, they have still roamed the Great Dark Beyond. Meanwhile, the other Pantheons seem unable to manifest in it, except in some very diminished form. Seems much more logical to me to consider that the Great Dark Beyond and the realm of Order are one and the same.

Based off current lore, it's better to argue that the First Ones gave the Titans a unique gift that allows them access into the Beyond. Likely for the purpose of "nurturing the Worldsouls", though that's my theory.

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Btw, my theory leans on the idea that the Titans lost sight of their true mission in the Beyond, and they're turning Worldsouls into Titans so they could be the dominant power within the cosmos.

[Raetary]

Even if Titans happen to not be born from planets, they have still roamed the Great Dark Beyond. Meanwhile, the other Pantheons seem unable to manifest in it, except in some very diminished form. Seems much more logical to me to consider that the Great Dark Beyond and the realm of Order are one and the same.

Look i get it, i speculated the same thing when Chronicle 1 came out, but it never made much sense even back then when the book itself establishes it as the main product of creation of the Warcraft big bang, and how every Force is actively represented in it and influencing it.

They roam the Great Dark because they are in the Great Dark, they are World Souls, that isn't in question.
The question is how those World Souls ended up as the Pantheon of Order to beginn with.

[Nymrohd]

I'd say Elementals probably are part of the Physical realm and belong to all forces; animism seems to be part of every Force after all.

[huth]

Even if Titans happen to not be born from planets, they have still roamed the Great Dark Beyond. Meanwhile, the other Pantheons seem unable to manifest in it, except in some very diminished form. Seems much more logical to me to consider that the Great Dark Beyond and the realm of Order are one and the same.

Which force is having trouble with it? Disorder, Light, Void, Order seem to be managing just fine, as is Life. The denizens of the Shadowlands generally don't seem terribly interested in going, though we know the Maldraxxians at least can if they need to.

[Ersula]

I feel like it all comes down to a missinterpretation of what is the realm of Order. From what I understood, every Forces had its own realm with it being :

Death : The Shadowlands
Life : Unknown
Disorder : The Twisting Nether
Order : The great dark beyond, with Azeroth and all the other planets
Void : Unkown
Light : Unkown

Seems quite fitting to me that the place where the Pantheon of each forces reign encompasses the limit of said realm, and since the Titans, the Pantheon of Order, reign upon space...

If you look at the cosmology chart, there are three planes of existence: The Shadowlands, The Material Plane & The Dream. The Dream is touching the Life Sphere & the Shadowlands is touching the Death Sphere but they don't own them. That's mainly why I don't think the spheres themselves are actual locations & why the forces are fighting for control of the three planes of existence. Example, The Necrolords talk about having to fight off the Void & the Light from trying to take territory in the Shadowlands.

Even if Titans happen to not be born from planets, they have still roamed the Great Dark Beyond. Meanwhile, the other Pantheons seem unable to manifest in it, except in some very diminished form. Seems much more logical to me to consider that the Great Dark Beyond and the realm of Order are one and the same.

The Death Pantheon mentioned that the First Ones gave them the prime directive of protecting the shadowlands. They're not supposed to leave, not that they're incapable; for example the Necrolords regularly entered the material plane & twisting Nether to fight the Legion & The Kyrians go to the material plane to ferry souls. As well as the Primus himself hiding Frostmorne on Azeroth, etc.

I'd say Elementals probably are part of the Physical realm and belong to all forces; animism seems to be part of every Force after all.

Yes, this has already been established. Elementals were born from the planet & waged war until the Titans gave them their own Elemental planes, not unlike way they hid away Thros & The Dragon Isles.

[Jolly Roger]

if there are followers of azeroth then its possible we will get an azerite focused class

with azeroth touched by essentially every force it means a possible 3 spec hybrid

[Auxis]

How many Tendies did everyone get this month? I had 1585 when I filled the bar and spent it all on stuff. Just came back to the TP and it's saying I've got 1585 again, and I still have all of the things I purchased crossed off and are in my appearance tab/s.

It should be 1000 + a bonus 500, yeah?

I'm afraid to spend it on anything b/c it doesn't seem right that I got 3000 tenders this month.

[Nymrohd]

if there are followers of azeroth then its possible we will get an azerite focused class

with azeroth touched by essentially every force it means a possible 3 spec hybrid

Wasn't that BfA? Are we looking to recycle BfA sfx?

[Alanar]

Just a random find really, but I noticed this new shaman form sports new cloth physics as a kilt.
This is the first time they have done this for a player model. Hopefully they expand this even more.

[Sondrelk]

How many Tendies did everyone get this month? I had 1585 when I filled the bar and spent it all on stuff. Just came back to the TP and it's saying I've got 1585 again, and I still have all of the things I purchased crossed off and are in my appearance tab/s.

It should be 1000 + a bonus 500, yeah?

I'm afraid to spend it on anything b/c it doesn't seem right that I got 3000 tenders this month.

The tendies seem to get bugged quite often honestly. Mostly I get the bug where it says I don't have any. My guess is that you just got lucky and got the reverse of it.
I would guess that if you use it, it might give an error message, only allow you to use what you are supposed to have. Or less likely, give you negative tendies after it recalculates properly.

Tendies are after all the only truly account wide currency in WoW that I know of. So not surprised that it is so buggy given the developers seemed to make transferrable currencies precisely to avoid having to deal with that issue.

[Auxis]

The tendies seem to get bugged quite often honestly. Mostly I get the bug where it says I don't have any. My guess is that you just got lucky and got the reverse of it.
I would guess that if you use it, it might give an error message, only allow you to use what you are supposed to have. Or less likely, give you negative tendies after it recalculates properly.

Tendies are after all the only truly account wide currency in WoW that I know of. So not surprised that it is so buggy given the developers seemed to make transferrable currencies precisely to avoid having to deal with that issue.

Yeah I just tried it an hour or so later after logging between a few characters and it had gone back to the 35 tendies.

[Dracullus]

If we won't have any schedule this week, imo Direct will be just something like opening ceremony without Diablo and Overwatch.

[Joshuaj]

Look i get it, i speculated the same thing when Chronicle 1 came out, but it never made much sense even back then when the book itself establishes it as the main product of creation of the Warcraft big bang, and how every Force is actively represented in it and influencing it.

They roam the Great Dark because they are in the Great Dark, they are World Souls, that isn't in question.
The question is how those World Souls ended up as the Pantheon of Order to beginn with.

I think the idea of the Titans being Worldsouls should be put into question. As for why they are in the Beyond? Well SL and DF gave us a pretty good hint.

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Then again, maybe I'm wrong and they are Worldsouls. But it seems the current narrative is implying that the worldsoul origin for the Titans is bullshit.

[MauroDiogo]

I think the idea of the Titans being Worldsouls should be put into question. As for why they are in the Beyond? Well SL and DF gave us a pretty good hint.

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Then again, maybe I'm wrong and they are Worldsouls. But it seems the current narrative is implying that the worldsoul origin for the Titans is bullshit.

The current narrative tell us that while all Titans are, apparently, born of a Worldsoul (No in-game confirmation that every Titan we have met is indeed a Worldsoul), not all Worldsouls are born into a Titan.

Worldsouls are artificially infused/manipulated/nudged into a Titanic or Order-aligned state and born as a Titan.

[Telogrus]

Anyone still in denial about 11.1 being Undermine?

[Raetary]

Then again, maybe I'm wrong and they are Worldsouls. But it seems the current narrative is implying that the worldsoul origin for the Titans is bullshit.

The narrative is not implying that the Titans aren't World Souls, it's implying that a World Soul does not automatically result in a Titan but is rather molded into one.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Anyone still in denial about 11.1 being Undermine?

I am. I'm expecting the patch to based around the haranir, what the "great roots" around Azj-Kahet are and their purpose (speculation being the roots of Elun'Ahir all but actually confirmed), their attunement to Azeroth's worldsoul and the implications of it.

[milkmustache]

Anyone still in denial about 11.1 being Undermine?

I think the Orwenya prologue quest line certainly casts a large shadow of a doubt on that.

I'm still standing strong that 11.1 is Undermine. I think Orweyna comes to us to talk about Goblins causing a ruckus underground. Her kin are still not ready to accept outsiders into their home, so she comes to us to ask for our help put a stop to it. Gazlowe having already met her and other Haranir takes lead on this, decides to extend his changes for the Bilgewater Cartel to all of Goblin kind and brings us on a journey to Undermine.

That's just my idea of how it could go. 100% speculation. It could entirely be a Rootlands zone with a Goblin raid. I'll be a bit disappointed, but its holds the same amount of evidence as Undermine zone and Goblin raid, so I won't shrug it off.

My last bit of copium is that although Orweyna is featured in the prologue quest, it doesn't mean she is the "familiar face in the dark" described in the blue post. The specific wording there feels like it's hinting at someone we have known for longer than this expansion, but I could be over analyzing to fit my own desires.

[Kiivar86]

Anyone still in denial about 11.1 being Undermine?

I'm still leaning toward a Rootlands-like area with Goblin incursion. Whatever raid there maybe does touch upon Undermine in some capacity though.

That said, the Siren Isle preview having one dev with Kezan in the background has me doubting a bit.

[Joshuaj]

The narrative is not implying that the Titans aren't World Souls, it's implying that a World Soul does not automatically result in a Titan but is rather molded into one.

That kinda sounds to me like the Worldsouls are meant to be a combination of all 6 Forces, much like the Dark Beyond itself.

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Anyone still in denial about 11.1 being Undermine?

Yes. I'd be shocked if Undermine wasn't the Megadungeon tho.

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I think the Orwenya prologue quest line certainly casts a large shadow of a doubt on that.

I'm still standing strong that 11.1 is Undermine. I think Orweyna comes to us to talk about Goblins causing a ruckus underground. Her kin are still not ready to accept outsiders into their home, so she comes to us to ask for our help put a stop to it. Gazlowe having already met her and other Haranir takes lead on this, decides to extend his changes for the Bilgewater Cartel to all of Goblin kind and brings us on a journey to Undermine.

That's just my idea of how it could go. 100% speculation. It could entirely be a Rootlands zone with a Goblin raid. I'll be a bit disappointed, but its holds the same amount of evidence as Undermine zone and Goblin raid, so I won't shrug it off.

My last bit of copium is that although Orweyna is featured in the prologue quest, it doesn't mean she is the "familiar face in the dark" described in the blue post. The specific wording there feels like it's hinting at someone we have known for longer than this expansion, but I could be over analyzing to fit my own desires.

Brutal honesty here? Orwenya is going somewhere, since one of her songs is leading her to a place. I'm half convinced that location is Kezan, specifically the Undermine.

This will lead to this ordeal: 11.1 being the Rootlands with a Goblin invasion raid (Think the Treetop Terrace mixed with the Falling Forest from Skylanders), and that will lead to the 11.1.5 storyline with us returning to Kezan and entering the Undermine.

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The current narrative tell us that while all Titans are, apparently, born of a Worldsoul (No in-game confirmation that every Titan we have met is indeed a Worldsoul), not all Worldsouls are born into a Titan.

Worldsouls are artificially infused/manipulated/nudged into a Titanic or Order-aligned state and born as a Titan.

See, I'm not so sure...