Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Xilurm]

Yes, considering that WoW already has robots, spaceships and various other oil and electricity powered vehicles, cars fit it just fine. WoW has Gnomeregan since vanilla and an undersea train connecting two continents.

Stormwind and Ironforge are both in South EK.

[milkmustache]

Serious question for people excited for the cars in Undermine: do you feel this fits an online fantasy world like WoW, or is there a line that they could cross for you where something like this would start to ruin the immersion?

I mean-- yes. It fits a fantasy world like WoW. My personal excitement for Undermine has come from the idea that this setting cannot be done in many other situations. Goblins and all of the fourth wall chaos that they bring are integral to a lot of the thematics of WoW. They're far more lighthearted, as the game is overall now compared to Vanilla, but think about Ratchet, Booty Bay, Winterspring... these areas may not have had cars, but they were never far off.

We'll be back to some more traditional high fantasy roots (ha) in 11.2, but this is a fun way to use a really cool zone that can be a little silly in a serious way.

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I wonder if we will be able to go to the isle of Kezan too, above Undermine.

There's been suggestion of it; one of the stills from the Direct shows a drill boring into a cliffside with what appears to be Zuldazar in the background, but it may very well be Kezan redone.

[Rageonit]

Stormwind and Ironforge are both in South EK.

Well than I guess it goes around the globe, since there's no sea between those cities...

[Timester]

Guys, forget any kind of virtual casino, as it's actually banned in many countries any type of casino. The GTA Online Casino DLC is banned in many countries for the same reason. Just forget it.

There's a very simple solution to that: Have it be a self-contained economy. All bets can only be in casino tokens, which cannot be used for anything else than the casino and cannot be traded for gold.

It's also banned.

[Joszef Kiprich]

You're saying a car would fit in Lord of the Rings?

There was a car on screen in The Fellowship Of The Ring.

[Timester]

You're saying a car would fit in Lord of the Rings?

Does a helicopter fit? Because helicopters are part of Warcraft lore since 1995.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Notably, "cars" and other industrial or pseudo-industrial technology is nothing new in WoW or Warcraft. These elements were present all the way back in Warcraft 2 and have been a consistent part of the Warcraft universe, even if they've been expanded on in WoW's era (but what part of lore hasn't?)

Does a helicopter fit? Because helicopters are part of Warcraft lore since 1995.

The distinction as I see it is between modern amenities and thematically-suitable schizo tech. I think the introduction of familiar modern amenities (e.g. the selfie camera from WoD) is more damaging to the setting than spaceships or industrial military technology because it changes the day-to-day of the setting and doesn't thematically mesh like the industrial military technology does.

[Timester]

The distinction as I see it is between modern amenities and thematically-suitable schizo tech. I think the introduction of familiar modern amenities (e.g. the selfie camera from WoD) is more damaging to the setting than spaceships or industrial military technology because it changes the day-to-day of the setting and doesn't thematically mesh like the industrial military technology does.

But it fits the exact same culture the Warcraft Goblins portrait since 1995. It's not like Blizzard is announcing Autobahns everywhere and Volkswagen for everyone. No, it's for a very specific area, something they done already before at the same place (Kezan starting zone).

[Cheezits]

The distinction as I see it is between modern amenities and thematically-suitable schizo tech. I think the introduction of familiar modern amenities (e.g. the selfie camera from WoD) is more damaging to the setting than spaceships or industrial military technology because it changes the day-to-day of the setting and doesn't thematically mesh like the industrial military technology does.

Has any tech actually been introduced into the day-to-day beyond teleports (in gnomish areas) and cameras? I feel like camera is the big one used by NPCs now and that feels fine to me as the one commodity advancement in WoW lore. Tech teleports are something gnomes have been doing forever.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

But it fits the exact same culture the Warcraft Goblins portrait since 1995. It's not like Blizzard is announcing Autobahns everywhere and Volkswagen for everyone. No, it's for a very specific area, something they done already before at the same place (Kezan starting zone).

Aye, I suppose I can't fully disagree with that. I do understand that this is rooted enough in goblin lore. I was more responding to share my position on the general flooding of the setting with modern amenities than the car thing that was the specific topic. It does still feel a little weird, though. I'd at least prefer if the cars were more fantastic and unusual, and that does go for how they were in Cataclysm as well.

[Joshuaj]

The distinction as I see it is between modern amenities and thematically-suitable schizo tech. I think the introduction of familiar modern amenities (e.g. the selfie camera from WoD) is more damaging to the setting than spaceships or industrial military technology because it changes the day-to-day of the setting and doesn't thematically mesh like the industrial military technology does.

If we can have industrial military tech, we can have normal tech. No idea why things such as the S.E.L.F.I.E camera break the setting, especially for day to day. Humans, Elves, etc still live the exact same way.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

We've had gyrocopters, hot rods, bikes and trains before, I suppose. I think it's mainly the term "car" that irks me. It sounds too modern and banal.

I hope the thing in Undermine isn't called that.

Yeah, I think changing the name for some kind of Seussian bullshit would do wonders.

[Joshuaj]

Spaceships are magical, aren't they? The "dimensional ships," as the draenei call them, run on naaru energy IIRC.

We've had gyrocopters, hot rods, bikes and trains before, I suppose. I think it's mainly the term "car" that irks me. It sounds too modern and banal.

I hope the thing in Undermine isn't called that.

Ships are magitech. The Eredar, the Legion, the Titans, and the First Ones use Magitech a ton, but it's possible the other forces do this as well (Though, like we've seen with Death, it can be on a much lesser scale).

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Wait-- I must have missed a post.

Are people criticizing the use of have cars in the Undermine?

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Has any tech actually been introduced into the day-to-day beyond teleports (in gnomish areas) and cameras? I feel like camera is the big one used by NPCs now and that feels fine to me as the one commodity advancement in WoW lore. Tech teleports are something gnomes have been doing forever.

Cameras are the main one that comes to mind, admittedly. That said, I think there are still problems with excessive distribution of modern technology even in the military sphere also, such as with the "infra-green" crap in WotLK and the entire Redridge questline, since it alters military doctrine in a way that feels a bit more intuitively banal than siege tanks and gyrocopters do.

[Joshuaj]

As for the "Car" name, only Ion's called it that so far. We have no idea if that the name for these vehicles in game yet. But even if it were called a car in the lore, it can just be something the Goblins made up. Seems fine to me.

You could just call it: C.A.R!

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Wait-- I must have missed a post.

Are people criticizing the use of have cars in the Undermine?

Unfortunately yes. Idk why tbh.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

As for the "Car" name, only Ion's called it that so far. We have no idea if that the name for these vehicles in game yet. But even if it were called a car in the lore, it can just be something the Goblins made up. Seems fine to me.

You could just call it: C.A.R!

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Unfortunately yes. Idk why tbh.

Almost as if Mirage Raceway in Thousand Needles never existed.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Wait-- I must have missed a post.

Are people criticizing the use of have cars in the Undermine?

Some are. Even though goblins have been seen using this kind of car before in Cataclysm, I do partly get what they're saying since I can see how this level of exposure to an advanced technology can result in a slippery slope because of Blizzard's characteristic lack of restraint.

Almost as if Mirage Raceway in Thousand Needles never existed.

I think the key difference is in presentation. The cars at Mirage Raceway weren't modern cars with internal combustion engines, they were driven by rockets.

[Joshuaj]

Want me to he honest?

TVs and PCs could exist in WoW as well. We have cars, we have gas stations, we have planes, we've got submarines and trains, we've seen spaceships and jets VIA magitech usage, we've seen machine guns and tanks VIA either normal tech means or magitech means, why not go all in, ya know?

Heck, if the verse wanted to, we could see normal tech fighter jets!

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Some are. Even though goblins have been seen using this kind of car before, I do partly get what they're saying since I can see how this level of exposure to an advanced technology can result in a slippery slope because of Blizzard's characteristic lack of restraint.



I think the key difference is in presentation. The cars at Mirage Raceway weren't modern cars with internal combustion engines, they were essentially chariots driven by rockets.

*Looks at the Hot Rod*

You could just argue that Goblin technology's gotten better.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Want me to he honest?

TVs and PCs could exist in WoW as well. We have cars, we have gas stations, we have planes, we've got submarines and trains, we've seen spaceships and jets VIA magitech usage, we've seen machine guns and tanks VIA either normal tech means or magitech means, why not go all in, ya know?

Heck, if the verse wanted to, we could see normal tech fighter jets!

Y'see, that's exactly the problem I'm warning against. While advanced technology is thematically-enjoyable for me when it's kept to the places in which and races to which it belongs, this exact lack of restraint just results in the setting being watered down to a glorified urban fantasy setting. Sometimes what's thematically-appropriate needs to override a realistic distribution and rate of advancement of technology.