Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Dracullus]

This is why I think it would be coupled with some kind of Hard Mode for open world content. Players don't like having stuff taken away, but they do like having more content, and to be able to gear up and such faster.

Yeah, I advocate for this idea for years. Imo best way would be transforming War Mode into Hard Mode, cause it's pretty useless outside expac launches.

Of course, since people always pick path of least resistance and I don't really want extra grinds to return, can't really think about good power rewards outside maybe some big valorstones buff (on the other way, I simply want valorstones to go away and/or change to account currency for upgrading alt gear). Biggest opportunity for Hard Mode is leveling. Separate one continent like in Remix, remove flying, tough up mobs, calculate XP so you must go through all quests without skiping harder ones. And most important - unique cosmetic rewards for your account.

[Merryck]

If Midnight came out with dynamic ground mounts and a new race/class, on top of player housing and a small world revamp, it would be the ultimate expansion. Plus more Draenei content, of course.

[Jolly Roger]

so with 11.1 essentially having everything shown i can only guess 3 guarantees
1. kong vs godzilla references
2. black blood machines
3. gallywix buffed via void and his azerite topped cane gets mentioned

[milkmustache]

If Midnight came out with dynamic ground mounts and a new race/class, on top of player housing and a small world revamp, it would be the ultimate expansion. Plus more Draenei content, of course.

It's wild that this doesn't seem unreasonable, instead pretty likely. I'll say new class is maybe the least likely.

[Eldryth]

I wonder what TLT will entail though, really. Personally I've already had my fill with Titan lore in TWW, and over the past few expansions there's pretty much been this omnipresent focus on Titan lore or machinery (replaced by First Ones in SL).

We've seen a lot of Titan buildup in DF and TWW, but it's mostly been clear setup for the Pantheon's return in TLT. I don't really see them pulling a bait-and-switch for the finale- I mean, I did consider them possibly pulling a twist with Sargeras being the titular Last Titan after the intro, but ultimately, all this setup only works if we get to truly meet and interact with the Pantheon in the end.

And the Void is also being used as the main threat for (at least) two consecutive expansions in TWW and Midnight. Telling a complete story seems to be the focus here rather than swapping to something new every time, and personally, I'd consider that a good change.

Northrend is the weird one and I assume it's either misleading or the expansion is only on part of the island, somehow. Maybe Ulduar disconnects from the island and links back up with Halls of Valor to create a new landscape?

That or they lean HEAVILY on the Scourge (somehow), Vrykul and Drakkari to keep things varied outside of Storm Peaks.

I think people are generally underestimating how much Northrend will have changed after all these years. The Scourge is mindless, and the Ebon Blade have been fighting the remnants for years now. The Drakkari are either wiped out or scattered, depending on the source. The Vrykul lost their leadership and most of their forces. Very few Nerubians survived there.

Plus Iridikron most likely returned there to be a significant player in TLT.

Most of the remaining threats there- the Vrykul tribes, Iron Dwarves, and various Giants- would fit very well into a story about their creators returning, with the mindless Scourge and Iridikron's forces for variety.


It's also worth remembering that returning to the old world was presented as a major selling point when Chris Metzen revealed these expansions at Blizzcon. There's a massive demand for revamping iconic regions, and they know it. That aspect of Midnight and TLT got a lot of hype at Blizzcon, and backing away from that wouldn't be received well. I really don't think they'll try to pull a twist on that.

[Enrif]

I think people are generally underestimating how much Northrend will have changed after all these years. The Scourge is mindless, and the Ebon Blade have been fighting the remnants for years now. The Drakkari are either wiped out or scattered, depending on the source. The Vrykul lost their leadership and most of their forces. Very few Nerubians survived there.

Plus Iridikron most likely returned there to be a significant player in TLT.

Most of the remaining threats there- the Vrykul tribes, Iron Dwarves, and various Giants- would fit very well into a story about their creators returning, with the mindless Scourge and Iridikron's forces for variety.


It's also worth remembering that returning to the old world was presented as a major selling point when Chris Metzen revealed these expansions at Blizzcon. There's a massive demand for revamping iconic regions, and they know it. That aspect of Midnight and TLT got a lot of hype at Blizzcon, and backing away from that wouldn't be received well. I really don't think they'll try to pull a twist on that.

Don't forget the repercussion of Cataclysm, and especially the Dragonsoul raid, which changed Dragonblight alone in quite some way. And the effects of Shadowlands opening the veil over Icecrown and the use of the Forge of Souls.

I can see Northrend to look quite different to what it was in Wrath. Stormpeaks crumbled down into Zul'drak, Sholazar growth into Borean Tundra, Dragonblight quite destroyed, all due to cataclysm. Icecrown melting due to Shadowlands. Not sure what to do with Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjord, they could be the zones with the least changes i guess.

[Joshuaj]

I wonder what TLT will entail though, really. Personally I've already had my fill with Titan lore in TWW, and over the past few expansions there's pretty much been this omnipresent focus on Titan lore or machinery (replaced by First Ones in SL).

I do love Northrend and Ulduar content but it'd be neat if they surprised us.

Titans arrive in the pre-patch, we witness their return at Ulduar. But then it all takes a major twist and the expansion isn't at all what we thought.

We're forced to set sail and find Avaloren.

Or we venture back in time to prehistoric Northrend to witness what the Titans were really up to. A pre-Scourge Northrend with no Icecrown, Freya is busy setting up Sholazar Basin, Vrykul are still Titan-forged, etc. Yogg-Saron chilling below.

Just a pristine land of snow, mountains, elemental forces, Titan-forged starting to construct Ulduar. Dragon Aspects don't exist yet. Malygos is still a good boi.

Might be too much of an undertaking though, since Northrend would still be connected to the rest of Kalimdor at that point. Not sure how they'd set up borders beyond the zones.

I was hoping the next saga would be about Order Vs Disorder. When I say Disorder, I don't mean "remnants of the Burning Crusade reformed" or "Denathrius taking over the demons", or something like that.

I straight up mean "Disorder Lords Vs Titans". Beings that represent pure anarchy vs beings that represent pure authority.

- - - Updated - - -

Anarchists Vs Titans!

[Raetary]

Regarding dynamic ground mounts, i don't see them removing flying again or adding some weird 'hardmode', but rather changing their zone design philosophy to more consistently accomodate ground mounts.

So, more Undermine-like ground-mount only zones or even larger subzones, that are designed with dynamic ground mounts in mind and can't fly in.

[allegrian]

I am sure that as much as players like it, there are a whole bunch of world design developers who would prefer if players properly explored the zones by ground, and didnt just leapfrog between various points on the map ignoring everything in-between.

I mean, they basically said exactly that already when they removed flying in Wod, and restricted it on launch in Legion, BFA and SL. And they were right, gameplay is much better with no flying (at launch), where you properly explore and inmerse yourself in the world.

I barely remember the details of DF and TWW zones outside of key landmarks. Cities like Dornogal look awesome on foot, with tons of details that you barely notice from the sky. Legion levelign was awesome with hookshots and hidden rares and treasures, while now you just turbo through each zone in 1 minute and check the minimap for rare or treasure icons.

BFA's world pvp was awesome (the best since vanilla) and made you recognize each zone and its landmarks in a way you don't remember zones with flying enabled from the start.

It was bad when there was normal flying, and now it's worse because you fly 10x faster and barely notice the zones.

[Nymrohd]

I mean, they basically said exactly that already when they removed flying in Wod, and restricted it on launch in Legion, BFA and SL. And they were right, gameplay is much better with no flying (at launch), where you properly explore and inmerse yourself in the world.

I barely remember the details of DF and TWW zones outside of key landmarks. Cities like Dornogal look awesome on foot, with tons of details that you barely notice from the sky. Legion levelign was awesome with hookshots and hidden rares and treasures, while now you just turbo through each zone in 1 minute and check the minimap for rare or treasure icons.

BFA's world pvp was awesome (the best since vanilla) and made you recognize each zone and its landmarks in a way you don't remember zones with flying enabled from the start.

It was bad when there was normal flying, and now it's worse because you fly 10x faster and barely notice the zones.

While I fully agree with you, we sadly seem to be grossly outnumbered.
I would love a Heroic world mode with additional difficulty and better challenges but I don't know if an MMO has implemented that successfully

And yeah, BfA's world pvp was the best version of world pvp ever in wow having gameplay, story and rewards.

[allegrian]

While I fully agree with you, we sadly seem to be grossly outnumbered.
I would love a Heroic world mode with additional difficulty and better challenges but I don't know if an MMO has implemented that successfully

And yeah, BfA's world pvp was the best version of world pvp ever in wow having gameplay, story and rewards.

I remember making my way through dazaralor (hub, not raid) and sitting on the throne while some hordes tried to stop me, until I got outnumbered and left using a goblin glider from the top of the pyramid, good times.

And yeah we are super outnumbered and anytime we express this opinion on official forums or reddit, we get dogpiled. I hope they do some kind of hardmode or they do more creative stuff like the new siren island (aren't they doing a no-fly hard mode there?) and Undermine.

[Auxis]

So, the Hooded Supplier from MoP Remix is in the Karazhan Catacombs during the Felcycle scenario. Haven't actually seen them but they said something in chat: "If you insist..."

So either it's Xal in disguise (like we suspected) involved with this motorcycle for some reason, or the supplier went with us back to Pandaria during Remix to get something - because they didn't exist back in original MoP.

[Enrif]

So, the Hooded Supplier from MoP Remix is in the Karazhan Catacombs during the Felcycle scenario. Haven't actually seen them but they said something in chat: "If you insist..."

So either it's Xal in disguise (like we suspected) involved with this motorcycle for some reason, or the supplier went with us back to Pandaria during Remix to get something - because they didn't exist back in original MoP.

It's likely just one of the dark riders
https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Dark_Riders

[elbleuet]

Right now - yes. If new-Kirin Tor will be counsil of magic schools, not political power - why not? Why not unite Sunreavers and Magisters?
Orcs and taurens magi are indeed rare, we could remove them. But Thalyssra and Rommath is must have. I think Meryl is safe bet too. Mordent Evenshade is fresh air too.
Khadgar, Rommath, Thalyssra, Jaina, Meryl, Umbrick and Mordent. 3 Alliance members, 3 Horde ones, neutral (mostly) Khadgar.

Absolutely boring to me.

It's another way to say "i'm a Horde player and I want neutral Kirin Tor but the 2 other main centers of magic will remain Horde ofc".

In 2024 Khadgar says one of the Kirin Tor duties is to protect the Alliance. You can't just skip that part.

Can the Alliance have at least one magical organization while the Horde has 2 capitals of magic ? Is it too much to ask ?

[KyleEverett]

My main Midnight theory still remains that the first patch after dealing with the Amani is us retaking the Sunwell and taking control of the void infused well which is now a direct portal to the void. 12.2 is then inside the void where K'aresh is our main base and we defeat a void lord or two.

My personal hope is Azshara is our ally of convenience and she ascends as a void lord at the end and her "personal affection" for Azeroth has her promise to leave it alone.

[Jaggler]

Absolutely boring to me.

It's another way to say "i'm a Horde player and I want neutral Kirin Tor but the 2 other main centers of magic will remain Horde ofc".

In 2024 Khadgar says one of the Kirin Tor duties is to protect the Alliance. You can't just skip that part.

Can the Alliance have at least one magical organization while the Horde has 2 capitals of magic ? Is it too much to ask ?

Khadgar doesn't say that.

[Pyrophax]

Absolutely boring to me.

It's another way to say "i'm a Horde player and I want neutral Kirin Tor but the 2 other main centers of magic will remain Horde ofc".

In 2024 Khadgar says one of the Kirin Tor duties is to protect the Alliance. You can't just skip that part.

Can the Alliance have at least one magical organization while the Horde has 2 capitals of magic ? Is it too much to ask ?

It is Jaina's words, not Khadgars.
And what place does Suramar and Quel'Thalas have in current game? Dalaran and Kirin-Tor have wast and overwhelming presence in magical system of Azeroth. Suramar mages and Quel'Thalas Magisters are just AFKing in their caves.
My proposition is to unite all mages of Azeroth in neutral organization, not show some faction allegance, as you do. And by Khadgars words - not to use it for world changing, but to study and learning.
And that give Alliance chance to develop their center of magic - for humans, Void Elves and Night Elves there is a chance to shine. So hold your pants and don't start H/A barking as usual.

[elbleuet]

It is Jaina's words, not Khadgars.
And what place does Suramar and Quel'Thalas have in current game? Dalaran and Kirin-Tor have wast and overwhelming presence in magical system of Azeroth. Suramar mages and Quel'Thalas Magisters are just AFKing in their caves.
My proposition is to unite all mages of Azeroth in neutral organization, not show some faction allegance, as you do. And by Khadgars words - not to use it for world changing, but to study and learning.
And that give Alliance chance to develop their center of magic - for humans, Void Elves and Night Elves there is a chance to shine. So hold your pants and don't start H/A barking as usual.

Still boring asf. Just like Tauren mages can be.

Quel'Thalas will be the main hub of the next expansion, so obvously the Magisters won't afk for long so I don't see your point.

Speaking about Jaina's words, she's right. The Kirin Tor must protect the Alliance. And not become a world organization for homeless orc mages.

[allegrian]

Still boring asf. Just like Tauren mages can be.

Quel'Thalas will be the main hub of the next expansion, so obvously the Magisters won't afk for long so I don't see your point.

Speaking about Jaina's words, she's right. The Kirin Tor must protect the Alliance. And not become a world organization for homeless orc mages.

They just keep removing territory, factions and cities from the alliance Lore for shock value.

[Lahis]

They just keep removing territory, factions and cities from the alliance Lore for shock value.

TLT could start with the Titans nuking Ironforge as a punishment for dwarves and gnomes for abandoning their edicts since becoming fleshy beings.