Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Marlamin]

Everything they are saying is completely incoherent with the fact they removed a Major Patch, changed the game structure of the game and reduced the development timeline for a already stressed development team with a narrative team that can barely hang on or is existant.

Yet this is how they operate in a interview while the elephant in the room is ignored completely creating a complete dismissal of actual reality which in turn makes this interview completely incoherent and batshit insane.

I mean, I find it moreso comedic that they think any of their answers make coherent sense. Its' just nonsense.

I'll have to disagree with the stress in general on the development team, from what I've heard and seen they have far more time to sneak in things they want to and/or polish the stuff they're working on. I think the only thing that seems to be a bit bleeding edge (and as such might be somewhat stressful on their part?) is some of the engineering-heavy gameplay features like D.R.I.V.E as well as stuff like class balance (although that might be intended to be based on PTR testing). Story and art stuff seems pretty much done from the moment the build hits the PTR and has likely been done for quite a while already. Which honestly, I dislike because I love seeing things be more in development during public testing.

[Cheezits]

Which honestly, I dislike because I love seeing things be more in development during public testing.

I miss seeing the the gradual upgrades in Boralus through BFA Alpha.

The art team must be doing insanely well if they are able to do so many trading post things in their spare time as well as subtly big deal items like the Goblin trenchcoat that was put into Undermine without fanfare but sets new precedent for armor transmog.

[NineSpine]

Civ 7, the flagship game of 4X genre, only managing to hold in the top 10 sellers (on steam) its release week, with no other notable releases that week, and failing to even crest 100k players is not the counter-argument you think it is. It hit half the peak Civ 6 did 10 years ago, which was already not a huge game. Yes, Elden Ring and BG3 did well. That doesn't change what most people are playing, which is match-based quickplay content. You having to qualify shit with things like "for single player games on Steam" should be a red flag. Stardew did well. It's not Among Us, or Fortnite, or Pokemon Go.

You are making statements about cultural impact but then ignoring that the culture has simply shifted. People don't give a shit about 4X. They barely care about MMOs. Not because of something WoW did, but because modern players are not easily entertained by the slow grinding and tedium that the genre was originally built on.

Stardew Valley has sold more copies than Breath of the Wild. I guess BoTW was also a nothing game nobody played as well.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

[milkmustache]

Yeah, I can see it being "inspiration" or "will" in crystalized essence, but there has to be something going on with how it's green. I don't think it's fel as it doesn't seem to have any negative properties and it, for whatever reason, "calms down" Black Blood and the Dark Heart.

Maybe it's Spirit? Which, as we see in Chi, is classically greenish-teal.

That's super possible, although I'd be reluctant to use color as the tying factor.

I think the notion of "will" or "spirit" in Kaja'mite will be tied to Elun'ahir and the Rootlands somehow, which will be used as one more thread to tie Orweyna into the Undermine plot. In this sense, Azerite (or something similar) effected by essence of Life magics produces not just the free will that helps species develop as their own, but also an exceptional amount of spirit and liveliness that we see combined to make the Goblin mindset we know and love.

Now, Kaja'mite is absent from Khaz Algar, so maybe it's not directly from Elun'ahir, but it could be from something similar.

[Joshuaj]

Yeah, I can see it being "inspiration" or "will" in crystalized essence, but there has to be something going on with how it's green. I don't think it's fel as it doesn't seem to have any negative properties and it, for whatever reason, "calms down" Black Blood and the Dark Heart.

Maybe it's Spirit? Which, as we see in Chi, is classically greenish-teal.

Some Worldsoul Crystals might just appear in different colors or summ. Wouldn't be shocked if that were the case. But, if Spirit does exist within Kaja'mite, I wouldn't be shocked either.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

I'll have to disagree with the stress in general on the development team, from what I've heard and seen they have far more time to sneak in things they want to and/or polish the stuff they're working on. I think the only thing that seems to be a bit bleeding edge (and as such might be somewhat stressful on their part?) is some of the engineering-heavy gameplay features like D.R.I.V.E as well as stuff like class balance (although that might be intended to be based on PTR testing). Story and art stuff seems pretty much done from the moment the build hits the PTR and has likely been done for quite a while already. Which honestly, I dislike because I love seeing things be more in development during public testing.

I agree with your sentiment on some basis I just still feel a bit discouraged from how factory pipeline it is getting with the development of the game, however I also just feel like something in general feels "off" with the Narrative Team in terms of scope/delivery and just feel like they get handwaved a lot to the wayside when the Development Team wants to. But, maybe I'm just way off base. Its just a feeling I've long had for a while now that the Narrative Team are a punching bag and can be overridden whenever the Development Team and leadership wants to.

I don't know anymore, I just feel like the whole Blizzcon Saga Announcement (MCUification)/Wheeling out Metzen and then this interview. It's just so clear that they should've just marketed this in a completely different manner than what they did. The fact they had Housing in the backpocket and the fact that the Game itself is so stellar, it just baffles me that they had to triple down so hard on Story when it is clear we're not getting out of this narrative void hole of apathy for a long time.

Putting such an emphasis on one of the weakest points of the game is just really bizarre considering we're still at the start line for the story and the first thing they did is make the X.1 Zeralek Cavern problem again where you sacrifice a ton of time before any narrative hook is attached to the audience by pivoting to sideplots rather than fundamentally focusing on the A Plot so that you can build a product that can also have good side plots later down the line.

I mean it is their product at the end of the day, I am just really not understanding their perspective but maybe they got some great IGCs/Cinematics later down the line that does push this into some forward momentum. I just worry that there will just be a lot of baiting but the bait won't be there to bite down upon once we show up for the next updates.

[Enrif]

That's super possible, although I'd be reluctant to use color as the tying factor.

I think the notion of "will" or "spirit" in Kaja'mite will be tied to Elun'ahir and the Rootlands somehow, which will be used as one more thread to tie Orweyna into the Undermine plot. In this sense, Azerite (or something similar) effected by essence of Life magics produces not just the free will that helps species develop as their own, but also an exceptional amount of spirit and liveliness that we see combined to make the Goblin mindset we know and love.

Now, Kaja'mite is absent from Khaz Algar, so maybe it's not directly from Elun'ahir, but it could be from something similar.

Kaja'mite is found near islands that are closer to the maelstrom (Kezan, Zandalar). Perhaps the whole Elun'ahir is Y'shaarj thing has some merit? Or rather, what if Elun'ahir was planted in the hole left by Y'shaarjs removal? Since i don't think we have any indication that Elun'ahir was planeted at/near Khaz'algar, do we?

[Cheezits]

...I will say that if Y'shaarj is involved with the Rootlands, that definitely explains the new pandas.

[Nymrohd]

So here is something that very much annoys me with this patch. Why is Renzik NOT VOICED???

[elderu]

.
and the first thing they did is make the X.1 Zeralek Cavern problem again where you sacrifice a ton of time before any narrative hook is attached to the audience by pivoting to sideplots rather than fundamentally focusing on the A Plot so that you can build a product that can also have good side plots later down the line.

To be fair, we haven't got the Raid Finale Cinematic yet for 11.1, and really although Sarkareth wasn't the most recognizable or desirable boss, it wasn't until his dud of a death cutscene that the Patch felt too much like a detour/delay. Neltharion's Area was arguably more relevant to the A-Plot of DF than Undermine is to the A-Plot of TWW has been, but then Gallywix is a long time comin' type boss compared to Sarkareth.

Ion and others have at least told us this time that the Raid cinematic is an important part of the TWW and the Saga, so whether they deliver on that is yet to be seen.

[Enrif]

So here is something that very much annoys me with this patch. Why is Renzik NOT VOICED???

he isn't voiced in the german client either, and i think neiterh in the spanish one. So, whatever it is, it is cross language

[Cheezits]

So here is something that very much annoys me with this patch. Why is Renzik NOT VOICED???

Heavily implied by several people that his old VA is part of the SAG voice actors strike and for whatever reason Blizzard didn't recast him. Likely because it would look very bad.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

To be fair, we haven't got the Raid Finale Cinematic yet for 11.1, and really although Sarkareth wasn't the most recognizable or desirable boss, it wasn't until his dud of a death cutscene that the Patch felt too much like a detour/delay. Neltharion's Area was arguably more relevant to the A-Plot of DF than Undermine is to the A-Plot of TWW has been, but then Gallywix is a long time comin' type boss compared to Sarkareth.

Ion and others have at least told us this time that the Raid cinematic is an important part of the TWW and the Saga, so whether they deliver on that is yet to be seen.

Interesting, I have not seen that quote yet about the Raid Cinematics having larger impact. I just saw that scene script leak for the ending of the Raid and I just went "Yep, that's a standalone patch ending alright.".

To be fair, fans came up with better ways to compliment the fact there's a fucking entrance for the Cosmic Void to just waltz in from. It was just quite ridiculous how that ended.

So here is something that very much annoys me with this patch. Why is Renzik NOT VOICED???

Apparently the previous voice actor for Renzik his imdb page says he's a SAG-AFTRA actor, so it is most likely the reason for it.

[Cheezits]

The quote was that they DON'T want raid cinematics to be that important, if I remember right.

Now that story mode exists they really could go back to being big but yeah, not right now. If anything they are going to repeat DF where the biggest and most important stuff happened right in the middle of the expansion: I feel a conspiracy growing where they have data that is where most players check out, so they end the A plot there.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

Well, Nightfall happens before Midnight. Whether or not there's anything of importance we'll just have to wait and see. It could be a fart in the wind or actually a juicy loinsteak attached to a hook with it being reeled in by Blizzard at the end of The War Within.

Obviously, I don't like the midpoint return spike idea. But, then again they are a data oriented company and so ultimately bizarre stuff in WoW could easily be explained with this mindset in mind.

[Enrif]

Heavily implied by several people that his old VA is part of the SAG voice actors strike and for whatever reason Blizzard didn't recast him. Likely because it would look very bad.

doesn't explain the german, spanish or other langue voice actors for the same character

[Cheezits]

Obviously, I don't like the midpoint return spike idea. But, then again they are a data oriented company and so ultimately bizarre stuff in WoW could easily be explained with this mindset in mind.

I can only assume concepts like that are based on hard data and not just mustache twirling "we want lamer end patches", stupidity or laziness. I can easily see the average modern consumer just getting bored of an expansion setting after a year and checking out.

However there's no way K'aresh wouldn't be an Argus level deal.

[Reive]

looks like no 11.1.5 ptr today. next week then

[Hugnomo]

Curious about two things:



What was Gallywix referring to here? And what exactly IS Kajamite if it can stabilize Black Blood? Is it going to end up being chunks of another Beledar?

So I'm a bit late on this. But my current theory is:

One of the arathi books about the cosmology explains that each of the cosmic forces by themselves are too unstable. Pure void, pure light etc. And that something like the sacred flame, a combination of light and arcane (and fire?), is inherently more stable.

From the book:
"Singular energy types are unstable according to Ogdaen's law, and thus they bind to one or more secondary elements. The Firelands contains as much magma as it does flame, and why the holy radiance of the Sacred Flame acts as an eternal beacon."

Kajamite, like beledar/radiant remnants, or even azerite, are crystals capable of empowering/inspiring individuals. My take is that, in the same sense that beledar and the radiant remnants are holy/light chunks of the worldsoul, Kajamite is the same, but for fel/disorder. Afterall, we know kajamite made goblins what they are today, exceedingly intelligent, creative and chaotic. For me, that's one positive aspect of "disorder", while order can be stifling (i.e: earthen, edicts, etc), disorder is a force of creativity. Plus, it's green, goblins are green, we know orcs became green from being exposed to fell, it'd fit.

So, the black blood, a subtance of the void, would find more stability by binding to a different energy type, like kajamite/fel.

[Nightmare Queen]

Stardew Valley has sold more copies than Breath of the Wild. I guess BoTW was also a nothing game nobody played as well.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

People like cozy lifesims.

...I will say that if Y'shaarj is involved with the Rootlands, that definitely explains the new pandas.

Isn't he like, super dead?