Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Wangming]

I mean they have to handle the topic carefully because if they don't, the player character will be directly responsible for perpetuating morally dubious titan shit.

There is actually an 11.2 quest that points to the SL being wonky- Ve'nari asks us to get anima from devourers and says it helps power the ecodomes. Portergauge thinks this is a writer error, but I think it's actually a hint that Anima can be used in reality and it is meant to be an energy source: potentially the Shadowlands were made to power something. Harvesting energy from the ghosts like cattle.

https://bsky.app/profile/portergauge.../3lt3qhe4h5k2m

Hehh. Fake afterlife to power up something.
That gives us the possibility of a real Shadowlands that doesn't suck.

[Cheezits]

Devourers in K'aresh is definitely a massive red flag. But, then again with the whole Primal Life in The Barrens situation maybe they don't realize that at all.

It's confirmed they were attracted to the anima that came over with Karesh. They seem to still be attracted to consuming anima vs basic energy.

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Hehh. Fake afterlife to power up something.
That gives us the possibility of a real Shadowlands that doesn't suck.

I think the original Shadowlands, if the titan alteration true, was just some large land reaembling Maldraxxus, Korthia and maybe some of Ardemweald- primarily dead and dying with some nature based on decay (like Marsaminus)

Everything structured- Torghast, Oribos, Bastion, Revendreth- was likely installed.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

It's confirmed they were attracted to the anima that came over with Karesh. They seem to still be attracted to consuming anima vs basic energy.

Well, that's good at least. Wouldn't want them to change their diet. But, then again what happens when the anima runs out or well I guess maybe we eliminate all of them before that question can be asked.

[Xilurm]

I mean they have to handle the topic carefully because if they don't, the player character will be directly responsible for perpetuating morally dubious titan shit.

There is actually an 11.2 quest that points to the SL being wonky- Ve'nari asks us to get anima from devourers and says it helps power the ecodomes. Portergauge thinks this is a writer error, but I think it's actually a hint that Anima can be used in reality and it is meant to be an energy source: potentially the Shadowlands were made to power something. Harvesting energy from the ghosts like cattle.

https://bsky.app/profile/portergauge.../3lt3qhe4h5k2m

He should ask for clarification instead of demanding as if he knows everything.

[Cheezits]

Also, this would be a good time for Sylvanas to (temporarily) come back to help Quel'thalas and the Forsaken in Midnight, especially if they get into the nitty gritty of what Zovaal saw/how he knew so much during TLT.

[Eldryth]

I mean they have to handle the topic carefully because if they don't, the player character will be directly responsible for perpetuating morally dubious titan shit.

There is actually an 11.2 quest that points to the SL being wonky- Ve'nari asks us to get anima from devourers and says it helps power the ecodomes. Portergauge thinks this is a writer error, but I think it's actually a hint that Anima can be used in reality and it is meant to be an energy source: potentially the Shadowlands were made to power something. Harvesting energy from the ghosts like cattle.

https://bsky.app/profile/portergauge.../3lt3qhe4h5k2m

They're definitely retconning some aspects of Shadowlands at this point- while the Brokers being from K'aresh is definitely a huge improvement, it's also very incompatible with their original origins of being a native species to the Shadowlands.

But that also adds an extra level of confusion to ambiguous stuff like this- is it just a mistake? Is it a new story development for there to be usable Anima here? Or are they retconning stuff about Anima as well? If they don't change the quests to clarify it, we'll have to wait and see how it's used going forward.

The real jailer is still out there cooking. I think the Primus will return. Like it or not.

I can already hear people screaming. Hahaha.

If revisiting the Shadowlands makes it more interesting and fixes the terrible choice to have a bunch of generic pantheons that come across as discount Titans, then I'd be all for it. For all the deserved hate Shadowlands got, it did have potential before they left everything interesting about it (all that "the world is a prison" talk, the fact that it feels so artificial and restricting, the Primus being so suspicious and looking closer to the Jailer's much better concept art, etc.) as completely unused plot hooks and didn't let us do nearly enough to improve the system.

I think that if Ethereals are made playable, they will lean more towards the Wastelanders as they have more combat experience and also potential for shamanism, druidism etc.

I agree with that. Based on the scraps of hints we have about the dungeon (specifically the flavor text for that "Whispers of K'aresh" item), I have a hunch that it'll end with them swearing an oath to help Azeroth after they (or K'aresh) hear her plea for help.

[Cheezits]

But that also adds an extra level of confusion to ambiguous stuff like this- is it just a mistake? Is it a new story development for there to be usable Anima here? Or are they retconning stuff about Anima as well? If they don't change the quests to clarify it, we'll have to wait and see how it's used going forward.

Based on that quest, Anima is still what it was in SL- the reason Ve'nari wants us to kill Devourers is because they have excess anima for us to use, and they also seek the anima that was brought over with Tazavesh.

I think the big reveal here is that Anima CAN be used outside of the Shadowlands, which has many implications. For as much as the devs said "lol the mogu anima was different" as well as the anima some Keepers use, it may in fact be the same stuff all along- energy created from the Death realm(s). And it would explain why "The First Ones" were so intent on the infinite anima cycle... it probably is meant to power something.

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I agree with that. Based on the scraps of hints we have about the dungeon (specifically the flavor text for that "Whispers of K'aresh" item), I have a hunch that it'll end with them swearing an oath to help Azeroth after they (or K'aresh) hear her plea for help.

Agreed, it would give them a reason to travel to Azeroth while also giving room for more interesting Ethereals than just the Consortium (though you can of course RP that)

Also, regarding the Primus- I don't think he was ever the "true villain" or the original Jailer. I think he was however in on the conspiracy and likely jailed Zovaal so he couldn't know the truth, or to stop him from interfering with the Cycle. He is probably the Prime Designate of the Eternal Ones that reports directly to the Titans- hence, his name.

[milkmustache]

Based on that quest, Anima is still what it was in SL- the reason Ve'nari wants us to kill Devourers is because they have excess anima for us to use, and they also seek the anima that was brought over with Tazavesh.

I think the big reveal here is that Anima CAN be used outside of the Shadowlands, which has many implications. For as much as the devs said "lol the mogu anima was different" as well as the anima some Keepers use, it may in fact be the same stuff all along- energy created from the Death realm(s). And it would explain why "The First Ones" were so intent on the infinite anima cycle... it probably is meant to power something.

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Agreed, it would give them a reason to travel to Azeroth while also giving room for more interesting Ethereals than just the Consortium (though you can of course RP that)

Also, regarding the Primus- I don't think he was ever the "true villain" or the original Jailer. I think he was however in on the conspiracy and likely jailed Zovaal so he couldn't know the truth, or to stop him from interfering with the Cycle. He is probably the Prime Designate of the Eternal Ones that reports directly to the Titans- hence, his name.

The potential for Shadowlands anima to be retconned into being the same as Mogu/Keeper anima only convinces me further that a big TLT reveal will indeed be that the Shadowlands is ordered realm of Death, created by the Titans. I think this would be incredible.

[Limayria]

I mean they have to handle the topic carefully because if they don't, the player character will be directly responsible for perpetuating morally dubious titan shit.

There is actually an 11.2 quest that points to the SL being wonky- Ve'nari asks us to get anima from devourers and says it helps power the ecodomes. Portergauge thinks this is a writer error, but I think it's actually a hint that Anima can be used in reality and it is meant to be an energy source: potentially the Shadowlands were made to power something. Harvesting energy from the ghosts like cattle.

https://bsky.app/profile/portergauge.../3lt3qhe4h5k2m

Shadowlands took some clear inspiration from the loosh idea

[Cheezits]

The potential for Shadowlands anima to be retconned into being the same as Mogu/Keeper anima only convinces me further that a big TLT reveal will indeed be that the Shadowlands is ordered realm of Death, created by the Titans. I think this would be incredible.

I honestly don't know if devs were just lying or not. It reminds me of their insistence that the Drust aren't Vrykul.

The revendreth Anima is almost 1:1 with how the Mogu fleshcrafting anima looks, even.

[KayserB]

Male cast = death sentence

Female cast = safety + hero status

[Joshuaj]

Male cast = death sentence

Female cast = safety + hero status

Didn't Dalaran literally blow up this expac?

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Also, I main a human male...so...

[Cheezits]

Male cast = death sentence

Female cast = safety + hero status

Locus-Walker blew up the planet and worked with Xal, TWICE, despite Alleria warning him it's a dumb idea

This is probably the most understandable death of all time, it just required context. Also, that spoiler is why he's not... really the Ethereal racial leader.

[Wangming]

I honestly don't know if devs were just lying or not. It reminds me of their insistence that the Drust aren't Vrykul.

The revendreth Anima is almost 1:1 with how the Mogu fleshcrafting anima looks, even.

I'm all for more Mogu stuff.

[Bwgmon]

Male cast = death sentence

Female cast = safety + hero status

Sure am glad Ansurek became good and our friend and is healthy and alive and helping us.

[Wangming]

Didn't Dalaran literally blow up this expac?

That's like tuesday for them.

[Al Gorefiend]

Male cast = death sentence

Female cast = safety + hero status

Good. females dying is extra depressing and heartbreaking.

[milkmustache]

I'm all for more Mogu stuff.

I'd love for the Mogu to come back in TLT.

[KayserB]

If you take each event as an isolated case then yes what I'm saying may appear absurd, but when you resemble the pieces you start to understand why I'm talking about male/female cast.

DF: the only aspects that have moved to do something concrete are the females. Nozdormu afk I have dark circles, kalecgos snif snif my blue draconic flight. The females have done everything, even at the prime incarnate level, 2 male villains (one dead the other on the run), the females one dead the other turned heroine.
DF zones? The archaeologists of the first zone are led by a woman, the centaurs have a female leader (though inspired by the Mongols), the tuskars have an old male leader that handed over to a female and Thaldraszus is led by chromie.

SL : 4 eternal ones, 2 good ladies, 1 male missing with his replacement killed and the other one prouved to be a villain. All the male mortal leaders got screwed when kidnapped except for Jaina who 1v1'ned creatures like the Tarragrue in torghast alone. Sylvanas snatched the spot light and spat on Arthas instead of Uther being the one to talk to his student...

BFA : all the allied race leaders are female.

I can keep going on and on... I ain't gonna lie we do miss some male char under the spotlight..

[Cheezits]

I'd love for the Mogu to come back in TLT.

It would be charming if the Sethrak and Mogu come back as ex-Titanforged allies to skew away from the Northrend racebait- I think they are building up to the Refti being the first iteration of Sethrak.