Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Vakir]

The other thing is, people are very sky beam fatigued and have been since like...2016. It's memed on with regards to being a capeshit trope.

I get the Sunwell Voidstorm clash, there's not a lot of other ways to visually convey what's going on. But another?

[Joshuaj]

Can I just say this rq? The Arathi Empire uniting with Aman'Thul would actually be a pretty cool plot-line, as it might even connect with the Titan Watcher heretics at Avaloren.

[Cheezits]

The other thing is, people are very sky beam fatigued and have been since like...2016. It's memed on with regards to being a capeshit trope.

I get the Sunwell Voidstorm clash, there's not a lot of other ways to visually convey what's going on. But another?

It doesn't seem like there will be another actual sky beam but moreso what the energies in general will look like. The Sunwell always had a little beam going up the chamber if I remember right.

However, the suspicious North EK loading screen with Atal'Utek DOES have a skybeam.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/s/BamkGMkS06

[Joshuaj]

The other thing is, people are very sky beam fatigued and have been since like...2016. It's memed on with regards to being a capeshit trope.

I get the Sunwell Voidstorm clash, there's not a lot of other ways to visually convey what's going on. But another?

I say beam cause I think it'd be a unique parallel to Skylanders, where the rebuilt Core of Light shot a beam that permanently banished the Darkness (Which, funny enough, led to a twilight sky), and both it and Warcraft are owned by Activision (Which is now owned by Microsoft), but it doesn't really have to be a beam at all. I do think it'd be cool though. A beamless Gold and Blue well would fit though, and so long as it clears the skies and balances things out, that's all that matters in the end.

[milkmustache]

That's assuming these plots will connect in TLT, ofc (Which it low-key might).

I do hope this leads into them not retconning the First Ones, and more-so saying that the Titans have been ordering a LOT of the Cosmos under the directives of Order.

This feels like it'll be the case, though I'd like for the ordering of the Cosmos to be less on the Titans nature, and more on them going a bit rogue, even if it's just Aman'thul.

My big issue with the way the cosmological powers have been presented is that it removes agency from the actors in the story. If it all boils down to "Well, the Titans ordered the universe because that's all they know how to do," then I think that'd be a bit of a waste of a cool build up. There is a bit of tragedy in it that I like, but I think the implications it brings for the player and our stance in the universe muddy it all up.

That's not me saying I disagree with the First Ones, especially if this is the direction they take. The First Ones being non-personified ambivalent forces that sort of big-banged the universe into creation is a cool and easy to understand plot. I like it as a colloquialism for their magics, rather than them being 6 literal beings.

[LoreSeeker]

Oh nice the post is visible, if i find more audio i will update, so much is encrypted but its so random what isnt.
Umbric and Rommath also have cute audio post well.

Maiev voice lines are honestly hilarious i kinda love her sassy takes.

[Joshuaj]

Can I just say this? We're currently at the point in the story where Metzen's says "We unite the scattered Elven Tribes of Azeroth, we unite with the forces of the Light, and we banish the Shadow forever".

We haven't yet seen the "This is Azeroth, things may spiral out of control, and it might get so bad, that it'll lead directly into The Last Titan" stuff, and THAT is what we should take away from all of this.

With the power of the Shadow apparently making its way deep into Azeroth, will that be a plotline for TLT? Or will that be part of Midnight, and we end up seeing the Worldcore at the end of the expac? What will the 12.2 zone be? Revamped Plaguelands? Something else? Will Azeroth's Sun and Moons play any part in Midnight or TLT?

[Nymrohd]

I kinda want Quel'Thalas to just be Quel'Thalas at least. The normal sky because we finally have it updated and completed.

Then you are going to be disappointed because the biggest problem with wanting a pristine Quel'thals is not the Voidstorm, it's the Lightbloom

[Joshuaj]

This feels like it'll be the case, though I'd like for the ordering of the Cosmos to be less on the Titans nature, and more on them going a bit rogue, even if it's just Aman'thul.

My big issue with the way the cosmological powers have been presented is that it removes agency from the actors in the story. If it all boils down to "Well, the Titans ordered the universe because that's all they know how to do," then I think that'd be a bit of a waste of a cool build up. There is a bit of tragedy in it that I like, but I think the implications it brings for the player and our stance in the universe muddy it all up.

That's not me saying I disagree with the First Ones, especially if this is the direction they take. The First Ones being non-personified ambivalent forces that sort of big-banged the universe into creation is a cool and easy to understand plot. I like it as a colloquialism for their magics, rather than them being 6 literal beings.

I only say this cause, assuming Firim's mentions on the First Ones are true, and given what Saezurah says about "Her voice awakening the others", it really does make me wonder if the spirals at the Heart of the Sepulcher ARE actually the First Ones, and they're simply just in a state of hibernation. Remember, Danuser and co said the First Ones left (Which, they did), and that we wouldn't find a Progenitor CORPSE in the Sepulcher. They never said we wouldn't see them whatsoever, though.

Heck, the person who made the Sepulcher Jailer skybox said the nebulas represented the 6 forces that shaped WoW's Universe.

[Sondrelk]

Can I just say this rq? The Arathi Empire uniting with Aman'Thul would actually be a pretty cool plot-line, as it might even connect with the Titan Watcher heretics at Avaloren.

My hope is that the Arathi Empire becomes an evergreen faction of bad guys for us to fight. Someone to effectively be the opposite faction for whenever we want faction war, but don't want to villain bat the Horde again.

Tying them to a cosmic power like Aman'thul would lessen them in my eyes.

[Joshuaj]

So, if the Progenitors are retconned, then Blizzard's gonna have to explain that ordeal heavily. I'm honestly hoping they're not, simply for continuities sake. I get people hate the First Ones, but I'm not one of them, and I know folks that find them interesting as well. I like me my supreme beings, especially if they don't mess with the rest of the lore (Which, based off the last few expacs, they don't...).

[Darkarath]

But I don't see what would make Midnight the best expansion. Probably because it's biggest feature is just an evergreen feature, not a Midnight feature. And the addon change may very well end up being amazing for WoW in the long term but it will be a dumpster fire for release and no one is convincing me otherwise.

IMO Midnight has potential to be the best expansion because it is launching with all the features that have been successful over the years + Housing, which it's going to be fairly big and it seems very well done. Oh and we also have the Prey system, which might end up being good.

In the end, we all know that what makes an expansion great or forgettable it's the patch content. For me the story it's also very important, but I'm aware that I'm in the minority here. In this particular topic, Midnight has potential for greatness and for complete failure.

Sooooo maybe Worldcore is a Midnight thing after all?

This is a possibility that has been increasingly likely given how TWW has transpired and what little information we got from Midnight beta.

The fact that Xal'athat wins (again) in Quel'thalas and gets whatever she needs from the Sunwell and then dissapears, could only lead (presumably, because to be fair we still don't know much about Xal'athat) to the Worldcore.

This outcome could be cool but I have one big concern: more instanced zones. Seriously Blizzard stop that shit.

My hope? Xal'athat throws the Beledar into the Undersea, giving us a NOT INSTANCED WAY into the Worldcore. Could be pretty cool IMO.

[Cheezits]

Then you are going to be disappointed because the biggest problem with wanting a pristine Quel'thals is not the Voidstorm, it's the Lightbloom

Yeah sadly the area got Legion'd and has perma-corrupted mob zones. The silver lining is that it is at least mostly magical enemies and not faction stuff that won't make sense post-MSQ. Also it looks pretty.

[Joshuaj]

My hope is that the Arathi Empire becomes an evergreen faction of bad guys for us to fight. Someone to effectively be the opposite faction for whenever we want faction war, but don't want to villain bat the Horde again.

Tying them to a cosmic power like Aman'thul would lessen them in my eyes.

I kinda want us to unite with the bulk of the empire, yet have a faction of zealots stand against the Emperor, and unite themselves with that Red Dawn faction (Which may or may not continue into future expansions).

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IMO Midnight has potential to be the best expansion because it is launching with all the features that have been successful over the years + Housing, which it's going to be fairly big and it seems very well done. Oh and we also have the Prey system, which might end up being good.

In the end, we all know that what makes an expansion great or forgettable it's the patch content. For me the story it's also very important, but I'm aware that I'm in the minority here. In this particular topic, Midnight has potential for greatness and for complete failure.



This is a possibility that has been increasingly likely given how TWW has transpired and what little information we got from Midnight beta.

The fact that Xal'athat wins (again) in Quel'thalas and gets whatever she needs from the Sunwell and then dissapears, could only lead (presumably, because to be fair we still don't know much about Xal'athat) to the Worldcore.

This outcome could be cool but I have one big concern: more instanced zones. Seriously Blizzard stop that shit.

My hope? Xal'athat throws the Beledar into the Undersea, giving us a NOT INSTANCED WAY into the Worldcore. Could be pretty cool IMO.

Low-key, if Midnight connects things to the Undersea, I'd genuinely respect it.

[Sondrelk]

I kinda want us to unite with the bulk of the empire, yet have a faction of zealots stand against the Emperor, and unite themselves with that Red Dawn faction (Which may or may not continue into future expansions).

More or less that. Except allying with the rebels, and the empire at large being zealots.

Said before. But I want an empire that you can always count on to have stolen an airship that we need to liberate. Or to attempt colonizing Feralas.

[Joshuaj]

There's still a lot of things to be addressed in the Worldsoul Saga imo:

The stuff with the Light
That apparent "Sacred Flame" which may or may not exist in the Plaguelands (I forget if it's confirmed or not)
The Titans
Iridikron
Xal'atath and her plans with the Shadow against the Worldsoul
Azeroth's True Nature
Elune's potential connection with all of this
The Khaz'algar stuff
The Undersea
And some other stuff I maybe missed?

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More or less that. Except allying with the rebels, and the empire at large being zealots.

Said before. But I want an empire that you can always count on to have stolen an airship that we need to liberate. Or to attempt colonizing Feralas.

Oooo I'd like that too.

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If I were to have 1 big takeaway from all of this, though...

LEMME FIGHT SARGERAS IN THE LAST TITAN, BLIZZARD!

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Oh, and new build is likely today.

[Nymrohd]

I'm inclined to agree and BFA was pretty ambitious at launch. (I gotta wonder, however, if the failure of Warfronts and the poor reward structure of Islands were still the result of not enough time);The reason I brought it up is that's literally what we were told - Ion mentioned in an interview that Mists and Legion were very strong, but that the expacs around them suffered.

They can also be lying corporate mouthpieces per usual, but it's a weird thing to lie about since they're volunteering that bad look info. They didn't need to say anything and could have just pretended Hour of Twilight and WoD as a whole were "EPIC" rather than mixed to poor.

I read it more as "we know those expacs sucked but they did so that those others could be so good. Remember how good those were? Well we cannot deliver that again without something else being bad so you have to lower your expectations, yes?"

[Enrif]

There's still a lot of things to be addressed in the Worldsoul Saga imo:

The stuff with the Light
That apparent "Sacred Flame" which may or may not exist in the Plaguelands (I forget if it's confirmed or not)
The Titans
Iridikron
Xal'atath and her plans with the Shadow against the Worldsoul
Azeroth's True Nature
Elune's potential connection with all of this
The Khaz'algar stuff
The Undersea
And some other stuff I maybe missed?

out of the top of my hat:
black blood
beledar
sirene isle
worldcore
manifold

[Cheezits]

I read it more as "we know those expacs sucked but they did so that those others could be so good. Remember how good those were? Well we cannot deliver that again without something else being bad so you have to lower your expectations, yes?"

Is that not true? It's a bitter pill to swallow but if the two most beloved expansions after Wrath only happened by fucking up other expansions, the sheer content of those expansions may never happen again as under their new content cadence they do not want to fuck up an expansion at the sake of another.

The easiest way to cope with this is to lower expectations but that is not something the WoW fanbase does a lot.

Also the one sad thing about these reveals is that Lordaeron is probably off the table now, unless the Worldcore is accessed through the Sacred Flame stuff and/or Lordaeron is tied to the megadungeon.

[Nymrohd]

Is that not true? It's a bitter pill to swallow but if the two most beloved expansions after Wrath only happened by fucking up other expansions, the sheer content of those expansions may never happen again.

Again my argument is, that is a lie. Those expansions were not fucked because resources were moved to the next expansion, they were fucked because resources were used poorly. WoD was bad because a massive amount of time was wasted on Garrison and on remaking two entire zones because of sudden orc fatigue worries. If we had gotten the original cooler Gorgrond with the train running through it and the original Talador that actually gave Doomhammer, one of the most important figures in Orc history, a proper storyline, maybe they'd have time to actually do max level content and proper rewards for it.
Legion was the expansion with the most content and was followed by BfA which had even more launch content than legion (+17% more quests than Legion on release!) so they didn't sacrifice something to give us BfA, they just did not walk back on content. It is a convenient excuse for them when the real issue is that their lead devs failed to see problems that were immediately apparent to the rest of the internet the moment the content hit alpha.
And as for SL, it didn't start production too late because of how complex late BfA was . . . and its patch cycle was not messed up because of how much content they added to DF. They just had a mix of poorly handling COVID and massive office drama that sunk their productivity TOGETHER with multiple bad design decisions that were inexcusable immediately after BfA.

The reason we are NOT getting another Legion is that they no longer are getting the budget they used to get back then, largely because they fucked up so much that their growth numbers slumbed and now they are always talking retention, as if they are in a stagnant market (multiplayer PC games have an +8% annual growth rate ffs).