Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Xilurm]

So out of all the menu tabs, the ones that they've updated so far are:

"Talents & Spellbook" menu and the "Shop" menu.

I think the ones that need an update the most are definitely the "Character Info" and "Quest Log" menus. The latter especially since the map can either be tiny, or full screen while hiding the quest log completely. I find myself expanding the map often because with all the new maps you miss quite a bit of detail on them when it's small sized.

[Jaggler]

So out of all the menu tabs, the ones that they've updated so far are:

"Talents & Spellbook" menu and the "Shop" menu.

I think the ones that need an update the most are definitely the "Character Info" and "Quest Log" menus. The latter especially since the map can either be tiny, or full screen while hiding the quest log completely. I find myself expanding the map often because with all the new maps you miss quite a bit of detail on them when it's small sized.

when was the last time they touched the character panel? Must have been ages. Legion maybe?

[Xilurm]

when was the last time they touched the character panel? Must have been ages. Legion maybe?

I don't know but it's tiny. Basically the same size it has been since vanilla. They should bring them all to the standard of the talents & spellbook menu.

[Ersula]

I don't know but it's tiny. Basically the same size it has been since vanilla. They should bring them all to the standard of the talents & spellbook menu.

How about they don't do that. Can we talk about how the Dragonflight was a necessary UI downgrade, but with Midnight they're progressively making the UI uglier? It looks like a UI you'd find in a mid-budget korean mmo about space pilots, not the beautiful, fantasy UI classic has.

[Nymrohd]

I think we are bound to get another class/talent rework after TLT. Introducing fourth specs by adding new concepts and just using the massive data base of class abilities from the beginning of WoW (everything we've had and lost, legendary abilities, hero talents etc) would work. I think abandoning Hero Talents will be quite painful for a lot of specs that actually have strong Hero Talent identities but something has to give when a level squish inevitably happens again.

As for Unholy, I already play mine as a Necromancer. Just slap a cosmetic robe on them (there is a perfect cosmetic Necromancer mog from Necrolords)

[Enrif]

How about they don't do that. Can we talk about how the Dragonflight was a necessary UI downgrade, but with Midnight they're progressively making the UI uglier? It looks like a UI you'd find in a mid-budget korean mmo about space pilots, not the beautiful, fantasy UI classic has.

No. the stuff they improved on the UI is an improvement. I don't want UI that was made for a old 10inch CRT

[Jaggler]

I think we are bound to get another class/talent rework after TLT. Introducing fourth specs by adding new concepts and just using the massive data base of class abilities from the beginning of WoW (everything we've had and lost, legendary abilities, hero talents etc) would work. I think abandoning Hero Talents will be quite painful for a lot of specs that actually have strong Hero Talent identities but something has to give when a level squish inevitably happens again.

As for Unholy, I already play mine as a Necromancer. Just slap a cosmetic robe on them (there is a perfect cosmetic Necromancer mog from Necrolords)

I'm totally expecting another level squish after TLT, we'll be level 100, hero talents will have grown to five colums or we get another progression system and stuff gets cluttered again. Being powerful for some final showdown for the WSS and then we reset back to level 60, and maybe introduce new specs for all/many classes in a slimmed down system, making the whole process easier.

[Rhlor]

racials are still a thing, and visual effects for void elves. Also voice lines.
Or else we could have made mag'har customzations just available to orcs, highmountain to tauren, lightforged to draenei, and so on.

how allied races were used was really the dumbest idea

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that's a lot of work i don't see blizzard would commit too. I would bet rather they just make everyone neutral and you can play what you want with whatever faction you want

The point is that there are already high elf customizations for void elves, and void elf NPCs have started using void elf hairstyles.

If all the blood elf customizations are shared, including the green eyes that void elf Demon Hunters already use, I think that would be enough. It wouldn't be necessary to use another race slot to have five elf races, or six if we count Harranir.

[Alanar]

The point is that there are already high elf customizations for void elves, and void elf NPCs have started using void elf hairstyles.

If all the blood elf customizations are shared, including the green eyes that void elf Demon Hunters already use, I think that would be enough. It wouldn't be necessary to use another race slot to have five elf races, or six if we count Harranir.

There already is, whats the point here further really?

Instead, I would like to see some new stuff for both down the line.

[Rhlor]

There already is, whats the point here further really?

Instead, I would like to see some new stuff for both down the line.

I still think tattoos like Alleria's and Rommath's should be Void and Blood Elf customizations. And also those light marks that Arathor has for Blood Elves, along with more light customizations for hair and skin.

[Nymrohd]

This forum is really dedicated to making me hate elves.

[Enrif]

The point is that there are already high elf customizations for void elves, and void elf NPCs have started using void elf hairstyles.

If all the blood elf customizations are shared, including the green eyes that void elf Demon Hunters already use, I think that would be enough. It wouldn't be necessary to use another race slot to have five elf races, or six if we count Harranir.

that's why i'm in camp "make them neutral", doesn't add a new race, thus doesn't require all the bells and whistles a new race needs, including retrofitting all the old armor. And should be relative low effort on dev time, so no one feels it is wasted dev time.

[Cheezits]

This forum is really dedicated to making me hate elves.

I unironically think part of the dislike on MMOC for Midnight is because of the elf focus. Casual fans love them, hardcore fans are sick of them after endless post-BFA discourse and lack of story focus for the other races. Haranir being new elf introduced versus an old requested race is an extra poke in the eye.

[Pyrophax]

I unironically think part of the dislike on MMOC for Midnight is because of the elf focus. Casual fans love them, hardcore fans are sick of them after endless post-BFA discourse and lack of story focus for the other races. Haranir being new elf introduced versus an old requested race is an extra poke in the eye.

Wait until they add high elves as neutral race. What. would. be. glorious.
Outcry would be so big we can't contain in it HE megathread.

On theme - I welcome expansion about humans. Not Alliance as whole, but humans. House of Nobles, King, Westfall, cultists from Duskwood. Low fantasy one. And not Avaloren/Arathi shit. Oldschool racists, new spec for paladin crusader RDD with crossbows.

And orcs. Akin Founding of Durotar campaign.

Maybe even tauren patches about uniting all bulls (yaks, cows, mooses and wisents)

[Nymrohd]

Wait until they add high elves as neutral race. What. would. be. glorious.
Outcry would be so big we can't contain in it HE megathread.

On theme - I welcome expansion about humans. Not Alliance as whole, but humans. House of Nobles, King, Westfall, cultists from Duskwood. Low fantasy one. And not Avaloren/Arathi shit. Oldschool racists, new spec for paladin crusader RDD with crossbows.

And orcs. Akin Founding of Durotar campaign.

Maybe even tauren patches about uniting all bulls (yaks, cows, mooses and wisents)

I honestly think that getting a WoD-like with a parallel timeline but we get invaded by Seven Kingdom humans with Quel'thalas being their Ogres and Amani their Arakkoa would be fun. Would probably end up as horrible as WoD though.

[GeometryWizard]

I unironically think part of the dislike on MMOC for Midnight is because of the elf focus. Casual fans love them, hardcore fans are sick of them after endless post-BFA discourse and lack of story focus for the other races. Haranir being new elf introduced versus an old requested race is an extra poke in the eye.

IMO a lot of the elf exhaustion and discourse is bundling a lot of only somewhat related things together. Like for instance the blood elves haven't actually gotten much focus lately it's traditionally been night elf stories that keep recurring over and over again with the tired Teldrassil plotline dragged out for 3 expansions. DF isn't an elf expansion on the surface but one of the biggest complaints was how the aspects were barely ever in dragon form and so many of them are elves in visage form that your mind just associates it with more elf content. Then you also get the change in storytelling that's been happening and everyone begins to associate seeing an elf on screen with poorly written melodrama with very little action that's taken over the writing in recent expansions. For the blood elf content in Midnight I see a lot of blood elf fans on social media that don't like it because they've been sanded down and just made into high elves again that sometimes have green eyes. Night elf fans have complained about their story incessantly so it's a strange dichotomy where it feels like the game revolves more and more exclusively around 30% of the playerbase and that 30% mostly doesn't like what they're getting so it's not appealing to anyone

Specifically for blood elves I think when people say they are tired of them they usually mean they are tired of the Windrunner sisters and the extreme amount of focus they've had since Bfa with only a short break in DF. It really feels like someone high up in the story department has decided that they are the main characters of WoW and can't stop centering the story around them and it's gotten exhausting especially with how unlikeable Sylvanas and Alleria have become. Human/elf/dwarf characters or dragons that look like them have dominated the story for a while now and I really think they need some variety in TLT

tl;dr I think a lot of the elf fatigue discussion is a red flag for Blizzard that every story feels exactly the same with the same characters talking the same way and learning the same lessons and having the same morals and beliefs

[Cheezits]

tl;dr I think a lot of the elf fatigue discussion is a red flag for Blizzard that every story feels exactly the same with the same characters talking the same way and learning the same lessons and having the same morals and beliefs

And the fact Blizzard keeps doing it should be analyzed more, because I'm sure they are aware of how people feel considering the feedback hasn't changed for almost a decade, but it keeps happening. I think the generic story is a mandate from corporate/shareholders as opposed to some kind of torture experiment to fuck with people, and unfortunately I think that mandate is based on hard data that it effectively sells.

And no, one legendary game (BG3) being fantasy and dark isn't going to change that IMO. Would be nice but it's an exception to the rule for what is marketable.

That being said: if this expansion was Orcs, Ogres and Draenei being generic (see: WOD) I think MMOC would be a lot more hype just because it's not elves/humans/dwarves.

[Rhlor]

that's why i'm in camp "make them neutral", doesn't add a new race, thus doesn't require all the bells and whistles a new race needs, including retrofitting all the old armor. And should be relative low effort on dev time, so no one feels it is wasted dev time.

Void elves and blood elves are essentially a neutral race now. Void elve Demon Hunters even have green eyes.

Using certain customization combinations, they are indistinguishable.




Visually, they're already a neutral race; if the customizations are shared, there's no need to make any further changes.

And in the lore, we know that there are blood elves and high elves who join the void elf faction. We even saw high elf and void elf NPCs in Telogrus. And now, high elf NPCs are starting to use high elf hairstyles.

The customizations are for this purpose.

[Nymrohd]

And the fact Blizzard keeps doing it should be analyzed more, because I'm sure they are aware of how people feel considering the feedback hasn't changed for almost a decade, but it keeps happening. I think the generic story is a mandate from corporate/shareholders as opposed to some kind of torture experiment to fuck with people, and unfortunately I think that mandate is based on hard data that it effectively sells.

And no, one legendary game (BG3) being fantasy and dark isn't going to change that IMO. Would be nice but it's an exception to the rule for what is marketable.

That being said: if this expansion was Orcs, Ogres and Draenei being generic (see: WOD) I think MMOC would be a lot more hype just because it's not elves/humans/dwarves.

I think a huge failure with the elves is that they are not as strong thematically as they should be. A Magister, a Blood Knight and a Farstrider should be as distinct visually as a Laughing Skull, Blackrock and Shadowmoon orc were.

[Super Dickmann]

I think a huge failure with the elves is that they are not as strong thematically as they should be. A Magister, a Blood Knight and a Farstrider should be as distinct visually as a Laughing Skull, Blackrock and Shadowmoon orc were.

Elves can't be strong thematically because Blizzard decided to eliminate the race Horde-side like twenty odd years ago. Then to double down on it, they duplicated the race in the Nightborne, meaning that Blood Elves are only not redundant in the holy elf niche, despite a schism about the arcane being the dividing line between them and the night elves, as now the Nightborne fill this niche. Similarly, the holy elf part must be emphasized, as due to TBC's ending, it's their only distinguishing trait from regular high elves. The Night Elves also being universally tolerant of everything from zombies to fel to arcane doesn't help matters, but then neither does them participating in this story at all.

For what it's worth and given the above, they're basically fine and in line with what you can expect in Midnight and the holy elf part is well played, but by the end of the first patchc, that part is also nixed and they essentially are high elf classic. WoD managed to differentiate between orcs within one expansion more effectively than Blizzard have done between elves at any point post-WC3. Then again orcs give you a fuck lot more to work with and have a less dire fanbase.