Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Joshuaj]

Well, even Bellular caught up on the extra specs topic and made a clickbait video about it.

The same guy who said the Shadowlands we see isn't natural and that "Order won the conflict"? Lol

[GeometryWizard]

Shamans feel bland since they really don't bother to write the spirituality element into it outside of vanilla class quests and Thrall losing his powers so from the outside looking in it just looks like shamans are worse mages. IMO rogue and hunter have it worse in gameplay neglect but shaman feels like an abandoned class in the lore they almost totally ignored them for Dragonflight and they have no firm presence in the cosmic war crap so without any writer trying to push shamans more going forward they might as well not exist

[Jolly Roger]

Survey was real. It was on the launcher which was new. All the previous ones I've gotten were via email.

Here's more SS from other pages where it asked you to individually rank your interest in each of the 10 proposed new specs

that priest honestly just sounds like it gets holy eye beam lol i love it

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The same guy who said the Shadowlands we see isn't natural and that "Order won the conflict"? Lol

to be fair the guy only posts what he sees on reddit or in lore theory discords

hes too dumb to make any original thought that is beyond a single layer no matter how convoluted

[lostsoup]

if Lich DK is added it needs to have the actual Lich model as a permanent visual

[Khaza-R]

"Manipulate Terrain" just sounded like a fancy way of saying "make the ground shake" like the tremor spells or what Augvoker does, not any kind of map shifting. I really think it would just be a generic shaman with more ground elemental abilities (which augvokers use anyway because nelth).

Which from what I know has been the request for shaman tank anyway. Basically melee augvoker without the time abilities.

Eh, you're probably right. But it could be a cool way to add something unique.

Like - Rain + Lightning spells electrify enemies hindering spell casts, Freeze + Earth spells shatter armor, increasing melee damage, etc.

Idk just feels better than "oh, here's a shaman who uses rocks to defend themselves lol"

[Nightshade711]

if Lich DK is added it needs to have the actual Lich model as a permanent visual

That's what I hope. I think the concept is really neat (though I'd be curious how the gameplay loop will be different from Midnight unholy DK... since it is pretty much a ranged spec except for one ability)

[Cheezits]

Shamans feel bland since they really don't bother to write the spirituality element into it outside of vanilla class quests and Thrall losing his powers so from the outside looking in it just looks like shamans are worse mages. IMO rogue and hunter have it worse in gameplay neglect but shaman feels like an abandoned class in the lore they almost totally ignored them for Dragonflight and they have no firm presence in the cosmic war crap so without any writer trying to push shamans more going forward they might as well not exist

I think the spirituality element is fine, it's just the elements and elemental plains are boring and don't get any content except when they are there to get smacked around. They also suffer from not having any unique racial groups besides the Tidesages who are more of a shaman/mage hybrid anyway.

The more the Warcraft universe got explored, the smaller and less interesting the elements became. Even in WoD they were laughably boring.

They absolutely should get into what elements are like outside of the small prisons Titans have made for them, and how they connect between worlds, but... yeah no they haven't even bothered.

[Marlamin]

For those waiting on the GameInformer stuff:

No noteworthy news, but based on vibes from that vid alone I think they're going to apply the Midnight formula in TLT as well. The Midnight formula being taking something relevant from a past expansion but not all of it (Northern EK but not other TBC content) and revamping/expanding it while also adding new zones (Harandar, Voidstorm). So a few Northrend zones (maybe like that whiteboard leak) and then a bunch of new zones.

[Inxotep]

Very curious to see how they handle northrend, also that tease at the end.. Kalimdor & EK revamps after TLT, can't wait!
We're eating so good in the years ahead

[allegrian]

Shaman has always been one of the most generic classes to me in the context of the game. Every single racial shaman group acts the same and are pigeonholed into acting like the Earthen Ring- basically the opposite of Paladins as well as Druids where several of them practice differently than the Cenarion Circle. So Shaman Tank being "lol use rocks" didn't feel any different from Ele or Enh to me.

The one exception is Kul Tiras with Tidesages.

Shamans have felt like basic elementalist mages for years, to the point that it feels like the three dwarf races are the most fitting races for the class, as they were made from stone and summon elementals, and earthen even more.

And tidesages are a mix of shaman (resto), priests (shadow) and mages (frost).

[KyleEverett]

Iridikron and the Cataclysm are easy ways for them to say zones were destroyed to condense the expansion space.

[Cheezits]

If we get any portal worlds in TLT it will probably be where the Constellars come from. Also likely the same place where Dornic was dragged to.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

Completely cooked. At least, the game is good but yeah the more I listen to present day Warcraft Team it just sounds like they are absolutely uninterested in everything regarding the IP.

I don't know but like I just do not find 2 zone structures for revamps to be very good time investment but oh well, at least it will be interesting to see how they lay that one out for Northrend. Something has to have been drowned or destroyed. Although there did seem to hint that it wouldn't be that but who knows at this point. I'm not expecting Northrend to be treated with reverence at all based on where things stand.

[Marlamin]

Completely cooked. At least, the game is good but yeah the more I listen to present day Warcraft Team it just sounds like they are absolutely uninterested in everything regarding the IP.

I don't get that vibe at all when listening to interviews, so that may just be your interpretation being influenced by preset ideas that you've made known repeatedly. They're clearly very passionate about the game and want to do right by the fans, whether or not they succeed is not the same as not being interested in wanting it to succeed.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

I don't get that vibe at all when listening to interviews, so that may just be your interpretation being influenced by preset ideas that you've made known repeatedly. They're clearly very passionate about the game and want to do right by the fans, whether or not they succeed is not the same as not being interested in wanting it to succeed.

I mean contextually, the content output is very much moving in a direction that benefits the corporation moreso than anything else. That's fine if people want that, I just think there's a lot more "art" that should exist than this weirdly structured mess of checklists that they have to adhere to for continual development.

In the end, the game's great and all. But there's just this downscaling of World of Warcraft in the sense of the perspective of caring about Warcraft. I just don't like it at the end of the day because I think this IP has a lot of ways to re-engage and increase engagement but again if it is a cost-benefit analysis then I mean I am not surprised we've ended up here in a way where they just go behind the curtains and continue to slowly chip away at it. Giving us the first page draft concepts of everything and then continue on as if you did give them grand scope when in reality it was again just a tourism bureau poster of the location you're going to.

Thankfully the Roadmaps do save the day for me and are ultimately what keeps me engaged enough on top of the Surprises they throw in during expansion cycles these days. Its' just a shame that they're so uninterested in the Setting and World they are shepherds of.

This does not change my perspective that Blizzard Entertainment is in a great position with every franchise (Except Hearthstone(?)) and things are going very well both financially and current community atmosphere. I'm just disappointed from a Lore/Narrative perspective at how brazenly uninterested they are in "meeting the moment".

[Runick]

if Lich DK is added it needs to have the actual Lich model as a permanent visual

Customizable lich form @ the barbershop like the balance druid moonkin form would be amazing. Plenty of variation on the maldraxxi lich models for that kind of modular customization, too.

That's what I hope. I think the concept is really neat (though I'd be curious how the gameplay loop will be different from Midnight unholy DK... since it is pretty much a ranged spec except for one ability)

The survey mentions phantasms and chains. Looking to existing examples for inspiration, I could see Lich DK's summoning waves of ghosts that charge forward dealing AOE damage (like the Death Metal Knight boss fight on Darkmoon Island) and using icy chains to pull enemies into the path of those ghost waves (much how Kel'thuzad uses chains for CC in HotS). Maybe summoning spectral hands to drag enemies backward when they get too close to the Lich - like the opposite of Death Grip.

[Cheezits]

-snip-

I don't understand why the video brings you to these thoughts other than "the video wasn't hype for me", is that what you were trying to say?

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

I don't understand why the video brings you to these thoughts other than "the video wasn't hype for me", is that what you were trying to say?

No, I just think there's this weird angle they're taking where Revamps have now become moreso about cost cutting than doing it for the love of the Universe and its reinvestment to generate new fandom. Honestly at this point I think it would've been better to just systematize a structure for revisiting Old Zones than them selling it in small chunks over time.

Obviously, I am just not a fan of the defined structures they have to operate in because I feel its limiting for the product at this point. Maybe, Northrend gets a better treatment because its the climax expansion but we'll see how that goes. It almost felt hinted at during the video with what Maria said about 1-2 zones. But again, I'm not really surprised if Northrend still looks ridiculous.

I'm just not really a fan of what they're yapping about because it just again moves in this direction of being done for other purposes than stated. Something that is a ongoing theme for this Saga and how they communicate.

[Count Zero]

No noteworthy news, but based on vibes from that vid alone I think they're going to apply the Midnight formula in TLT as well. The Midnight formula being taking something relevant from a past expansion but not all of it (Northern EK but not other TBC content) and revamping/expanding it while also adding new zones (Harandar, Voidstorm). So a few Northrend zones (maybe like that whiteboard leak) and then a bunch of new zones.

Sounds like what folks have been speculating they would do. Lots of talk in here about what zones might be coalesced/merged in the revamp.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

Anyways, Stonetalon is a fascinating zone and I'm kind of interested in seeing how they would add to it so I'm not going to bitch about that.

There's a lot to still love even if I find their rhetoric to be highly suspect in how they frame it. Sure, if Northrend is a mess then whatever we already experienced Quel'thalas revamp being less than ideal. So I'm not really going to care if Northrend looks absolutely ridiculous.