Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Jastall]

We've been years without a troll patch. This is the time and the moment.

No, you see, we obviously needed a third void zone in a row and more elves instead.

I do hope the zone has enough visual interest to be a draw tho. It shouldn't be a Korthia or Broken Shores equivalent of blatant asset reuse.

I have no doubt they'll plug whatever happens here in the overarching plot somehow, the same way Undermine was somehow plugged into the Dark Heart/Kharesh plotline. or even the Black Blood one before it. There's always some Old God servant, Void artifact, or other assorted MacGuffin they can pull out of somewhere for such purposes.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

While neat, I am alarmed how this just feels like another potential Scalecommander Sarkareth storyline in which someone toys with someone and they realize too late they've been Venus Flytrap'd.

Can't deny if I think the Zul'aman story goes this route it does just sound beyond pointless cause like "Yup thats' another dumbass who died due to their hubris. Cool. Anyways, Worldcore time.".

But, alas I haven't played through Zul'aman yet so I guess we'll see if thats' the direction they take it or its a different direction.

[Raetary]

Ula-tek has, ever since we first heard about her in the RPG, had some sort of unspecified connection with the Old Gods.

This isn't really true.

The concept of the Old Gods wasn't fleshed out and solidified back then, the link to Rag was because the RPG described him as a "blazing Old God" and the Dwarves compared the Amani trying to summon Ula-Tek to the summoning of Rag.
Hakkar was also referred to as an Old God in those books.

C'thun wasn't brought up at all, let alone the Old Gods as Void horrors.

That's not to say that it won't be tied to the Void, obviously we got Kith'ix since the chronicles and now the overall Void plot.
But the RPG does not tie her to the Old Gods as we know them today.

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Since i mentioned Hakkar, and the Dreamrift boss being a Nightmare Wild God amalgam.

I think it'd be neat if he ends up tied to the Rift of Aln as well, as another Nightmare Azeroth dreamt up.

[Cheezits]

If Kithix is involved in a major way and not just a name for Ulatek or a raid boss before it, I wonder if there will be some connection to the Qiraji who may pop up in Silithus. Non-Black Empire Qiraji and Cthraxi? Otherwise would would Kithix obey Xal?

This dev team seems invested in making neutral versions of old baddie races and Qiraji are one of the ones that would actually be cool as shit.

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Did we ever get solid confirmation on Hakkar being a Wild God? Or is there enough wiggle room that the snakes could be something else? If I know he used De Other Side to respawn and not Ardenweald.

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While neat, I am alarmed how this just feels like another potential Scalecommander Sarkareth storyline in which someone toys with someone and they realize too late they've been Venus Flytrap'd.

There is build up to a more interesting story then that, as Zul'jan's gripe with the loa is legitimate while Sarkareth was borderline crazy. I also think Vol'jin and Talanji will play into this drama somehow.

[Raetary]

Did we ever get solid confirmation on Hakkar being a Wild God? Or is there enough wiggle room that the snakes could be something else? If I know he used De Other Side to respawn and not Ardenweald.

He was respawning in Ardenweald.

His Wildseed, along with Dambalas, was stolen by Mueh'zalas lackeys, who resurrected them to have them join his forces.

[Cheezits]

He was respawning in Ardenweald.

His Wildseed, along with Dambalas, was stolen by Mueh'zalas lackeys, who resurrected them to have them join his forces.

Ah, shame. He's the only Wild God to ever show the kind of power he has, besides Cenarius.

[Magistrate]

I think people would love a calm cinematic showcasing Quel'Thalas in its glory. The announcement trailer doesn't really do that.

Again, why would it? Quel'thelas in its glory predates the Lich King. The current SMC is literally being besieged apart by a cosmic army, 2 cosmic forces, and confronting massive internal unrest.

You seem to be completely missing the point and asking for something that makes no sense.

I'd rather the fierce resistance and brilliance of the elves than more cozycore cottage simulation. That's why you have housing. Go do that and stop ruining the game.

[Cheezits]

Midnight cinematic was fine on paper, but boring (very generic dialog with no iconic moments) and ugly/cheap-looking. It's biggest win is that it's not sappy or saccharine like DF and TWW.

There should've been a proper fight between Liadrin/Lor and Xal instead of "I look at you, your head hurts". Or it could've been the formation of the Voidspire/the initial invasion instead of... what happened moments after? Why did they do that?

[SaintBigfoot]

Really don’t understand why people are so anti-a troll patch, also I just want to say the person that said they wanted them to do Lordaeron instead no the fuck you don’t if they did that right now you know for a fact, it wouldn’t be any of the forsaken NPC’s We give a shit about it’d be fucking Calia.

[Raetary]

Imo, the cinematic falls flat because it didn't deliver on the moment it was building up towards.
The dialogue and plastic looking models are one thing, but i don't think they were bad enough to be wholly responsible why people felt dissatisfied with it.

I also don't think they needed some hand to hand combat with Xal or something.

The cinematic would've been pretty damn hype, if they simply allowed the Light to show a little power.
The Sunwell surging, maybe that being the point where the beam appears, or a Holy Nova blasting the Void back with a diverse set of characters charging out the gates to actually convey who is being called in, with the Sunwell providing a grand visual.

As is, the Sunwell just provides an overly saturated background light, with a bunch of random paladin silhouettes slowly marching up the stairs (menacingly) while Liadrin is twirling holy flames like a cheerleader.
All while a pretty horrendous sounding, overtly hopeful music is playing in the background, aiming to artificially hype you up.

They should've remembered the BfA cinematic.
Anduin casting HW:Sanctify was a picture perfect depiction of what Light intervention should look like in a cinematic.

[Joshuaj]

Midnight cinematic was fine on paper, but boring (very generic dialog with no iconic moments) and ugly/cheap-looking. It's biggest win is that it's not sappy or saccharine like DF and TWW.

There should've been a proper fight between Liadrin/Lor and Xal instead of "I look at you, your head hurts". Or it could've been the formation of the Voidspire/the initial invasion instead of... what happened moments after? Why did they do that?

I thought the head thing was cool, cause it showcased just how powerful Xal really was by that point lol

[Cheezits]

Why though? At the start of Midnight we have a resource constraint in that the Horde (and Alliance) could not respond as rapidly as needed so we had to make do with the Light dudes. But by the time we are tracking Xal down, the factions should have responded. It would work if they had made any effort to imply the rest of the world was in any danger but . . . they did not? Nah, we will more be responding to a threat unleashed by either Xal or Zul'jan and have to get that under control so we don't have to fight on two fronts in QT and below.

It seems Blizz purposefully withheld the factions from showing up to make their moments "hype" in different patches. It's Nelf, Helf and Nightborne with the launch campaign, Darkspear and Zandalari Troll in 12.1 and possibly Humans and Forsaken in 12.2.

As far as I know there's no lore reason why the factions don't show up during the campaign, so unless it's revealed in the encrypted sections it's just for meta reasons.

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The cinematic would've been pretty damn hype, if they simply allowed the Light to show a little power.

One has to wonder if their hands were tied with the idea that the Light is weak in Midnight. As it gets absolutely decimated through the launch story and its heroes go crazy

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Really don’t understand why people are so anti-a troll patch, also I just want to say the person that said they wanted them to do Lordaeron instead no the fuck you don’t if they did that right now you know for a fact, it wouldn’t be any of the forsaken NPC’s We give a shit about it’d be fucking Calia.

Lordaeron is not just a Forsaken area and Calia needs actual lore and good story to make her an actual character. It should have a heavy Forsaken presence but it has a lot to do with the Alliance, Tyr, and the Light in general even ignoring the "sekrit flame temple" shit.

[Raetary]

Forgot to mention the camera work, i found that more distracting and horrendous than either the dialogue or models.

Those weird ass zooms...

One has to wonder if their hands were tied with the idea that the Light is weak in Midnight. As it gets absolutely decimated through the launch story and its heroes go crazy

I don't really think so.
The Void would've won the battle anyway, so that would've been conveyed regardless.
If anything, the Sunwell acting up on its own and still failing to defend itself would've probably made that idea more effective.

But i think the cinematic team had their hands tied because they had to work with a smaller budget, so we got stuck with barebone-nadins instead.

[Khaza-R]

If Kithix is involved in a major way and not just a name for Ulatek or a raid boss before it, I wonder if there will be some connection to the Qiraji who may pop up in Silithus. Non-Black Empire Qiraji and Cthraxi? Otherwise would would Kithix obey Xal?

This dev team seems invested in making neutral versions of old baddie races and Qiraji are one of the ones that would actually be cool as shit.

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Did we ever get solid confirmation on Hakkar being a Wild God? Or is there enough wiggle room that the snakes could be something else? If I know he used De Other Side to respawn and not Ardenweald.

I would be shocked if the Qiraji actually pop up in TLT. I think the mistake was not having them take the place of nerubians in TWW.

But anyway, it is interesting that it looks like Hearthstone is getting a Black Empire expansion block.

[Cheezits]

I would be shocked if the Qiraji actually pop up in TLT. I think the mistake was not having them take the place of nerubians in TWW.

But anyway, it is interesting that it looks like Hearthstone is getting a Black Empire expansion block.

While Qiraji being near Silithus would've made sense, we know we are going back to Silithus proper and Qiraji are teased in Midnights Delve HQ with Vrykul. I think it's possible they are a patch focus of TLT.

[milkmustache]

While Qiraji being near Silithus would've made sense, we know we are going back to Silithus proper and Qiraji are teased in Midnights Delve HQ with Vrykul. I think it's possible they are a patch focus of TLT.

And Gorian as you pointed out, which would be unfortunate to amount to nothing.

Just caught up on the CE book stuff. I'm curious if they were asked to hide it in the video or if they did it as a respect to people who may not already know.

What a weird situation. The zone (though unpopulated) leaks in full in beta, icon datamine give away raid tier, and it's included in the Collector's Edition art. I truly don't konw what to make of it. I just hope we get a little more. Doing Quel'thalas > Atal'utek > presumably Worldcore? feels like it might be a bit of a disjointed cadence... again.

[Hitei]

Really don’t understand why people are so anti-a troll patch, also I just want to say the person that said they wanted them to do Lordaeron instead no the fuck you don’t if they did that right now you know for a fact, it wouldn’t be any of the forsaken NPC’s We give a shit about it’d be fucking Calia.

Trolls are okay in theory but they also have literally one thing (well, one set of things) and that set has been done literally, LITERALLY seven times, eight with 12.0 ZA so having it happen a 9th time in 12.1 is just beyond boring. I also think Lordaeron it stupid and dumb and done to death, but at least to a lesser degree.

[KyleEverett]

I'm worried about pacing myself especially after Dev statements that Midnight wouldn't have Old Gods involved and focus on the Space side of the Void. It's entirely possible that we just deal with Trolls and Trolls eating wild gods drama after Xal'atath gets slurped which feels unimportant when the end of the world is on the line.

[Khaza-R]

While Qiraji being near Silithus would've made sense, we know we are going back to Silithus proper and Qiraji are teased in Midnights Delve HQ with Vrykul. I think it's possible they are a patch focus of TLT.

I have to disagree. AQ would be awkward to throw into TLT. Especially when Northrend already has so many things going on it has to address in a very limited amount of content. The sword being relevant doesn't mean Silithus will be a featured zone.

[Hitei]

I have to disagree. AQ would be awkward to throw into TLT. Especially when Northrend already has so many things going on it has to address in a very limited amount of content. The sword being relevant doesn't mean Silithus will be a featured zone.

Northrend doesn't really have much going on at all. Every relevant threat or narrative beat was already dealt with. The Titans and Titanforged will subplant the Scourge as primary threat and everything else (Scarlets, Vrykul, Living Nerubians, Drakkari) doesn't warrant a patch because we're talking about groups that are barely clinging to life and struggle to fill out a launch zone let alone be big enough to warrant a whole patch.