Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[zirr]

oh, you have numbers then? or is it just another "2 people i know left so its MASSIVE drop of players"?

Numbers on raider.io and warcraftlogs does support his claim pretty heavily.

But to stay on topic: HYPE!!!! 10.2 this week hopefully :-D

[RahEndymion]

oh, you have numbers then? or is it just another "2 people i know left so its MASSIVE drop of players"?

Are you genuinely implying that there hasn't been a noticably huge drop in players since 10.1? Really?

Anecdotally, my Bnet friends list has gone from 40-60+ players in game on wow to at most 2-3 at any one time. In terms of actual numbers, you can easily check out RIO and extrapolate both m+ and raid completion statistics to work out a percentage of unique character drop and then compare that with the same time periods of previous expansions and earlier seasons.. It's not hard.

Sure, you can say 'ok well not everyone does X content' which is true, however it's also literally the only non-anecdotal metric you can use to extrapolate player numbers.

Alas, my point wasn't to prove to you that player numbers have dropped.. Everyone can see that. Literally everyone. Raid/M+ participation has literally halved compared to this point in SL.

[Darkarath]

Are you genuinely implying that there hasn't been a noticably huge drop in players since 10.1? Really?

Anecdotally, my Bnet friends list has gone from 40-60+ players in game on wow to at most 2-3 at any one time. In terms of actual numbers, you can easily check out RIO and extrapolate both m+ and raid completion statistics to work out a percentage of unique character drop and then compare that with the same time periods of previous expansions and earlier seasons.. It's not hard.

Sure, you can say 'ok well not everyone does X content' which is true, however it's also literally the only non-anecdotal metric you can use to extrapolate player numbers.

Alas, my point wasn't to prove to you that player numbers have dropped.. Everyone can see that. Literally everyone. Raid/M+ participation has literally halved compared to this point in SL.

Yeah, I think that you are spot on. That is why I believe that 10.2 will be one of the best if not the best patch of WoW.

Blizzard cannot have another 10.1, it would be a disaster. It was not a bad patch at all, but again, not enough for the current market.

My point is that if 10.2 is just another regular big patch WoW is going to suffer a lot.

[Lolites]

Numbers on raider.io and warcraftlogs does support his claim pretty heavily.

so the honest answer is no...
numbers we have access to are innacurate and incomplete AT BEST...

[RahEndymion]

Yeah, I think that you are spot on. That is why I believe that 10.2 will be one of the best if not the best patch of WoW.

Blizzard cannot have another 10.1, it would be a disaster. It was not a bad patch at all, but again, not enough for the current market.

My point is that if 10.2 is just another regular big patch WoW is going to suffer a lot.

I agree actually and if the tone and temperament of the activities in 10.2 match 10.1.5/10.1.7 and comes combined with some nice visuals I think they will likely be onto a winner.

I really enjoyed 10.0-10.1 and perhaps for the first time since Legion you could really feel the optimism in the community. I hope they can find a way to bring that back.

I can imagine an open top zone would really do wonders to push things in that direction.

so the honest answer is no...
numbers we have access to are innacurate and incomplete AT BEST...

Sure, they're incomplete. But do you really think when the two most popular forms of content have their participation halved that the rest of the game hasn't felt a similar if not greater effect?

You don't have to be doomsaying to understand this is true. The last 4 months have been a genuinely incredible time for game releases that's somewhat unheard of in the last 5 years. Are you really suggesting between D4, BG3, Starfield, FF16, Totk and so on, WoW has remained unphased?

Absurd.

[Lolites]

No pirates! (but still possibly maybe some pirates I guess but definitely not as a main theme similar to DF?)

how about bucaneers or corsairs?

[Scyth]

Only a few hours left to go before hype season begins.

What are some of your hopes for the news this week?

Today I'm hoping we get a cinematic that shows us a glimpse of the Emerald Dream and the World Tree, and I hope Paladins becoming playable by all races ends up being a thing they unlock once the story is decrypted.

For later in the week, I hope it becomes apparent to us what the longterm future of the story has in store. I just want to know for sure what'll become of Alex, Tyr, Vyranoth, etc. Oh and a metric crap ton of nature-inspired transmog. Druids shouldn't have to use antler helmets from the Molten Core.

I'd like to finally have Shamans for all races, or at least some.

More cinematics are always welcome as I think all the ones we've got in DF so far have been amazing.

More lore about the Dream and Elune would be awesome!
And really hoping new tier sets look great.

[Nymrohd]

So what's the latest tea my good folk of Azeroth?

10.1.7 has a lot of story for a minor patch and most of it is still encrypted. So the tea will be served tomorrow.

[Skildar]

I've truly enjoyed 10.1 and 10.1.5. Time rifts were a blast, very dynamic and well paced, too bad they were very buggy at launch.

At the same period in Shadowlands we've had Korthia for less than 3 months with redesigned maw and it was very unsatisfying and on of the worst raids in WoW's history.

I'm surprised that metrics are telling the game is emptier now than it was at the same time in Shadowlands, but I'm pretty sure if polls were made people would say they're happier with the game now than they were with the game at the same time during Shadowlands.

[micwini]

I've truly enjoyed 10.1 and 10.1.5. Time rifts were a blast, very dynamic and well paced, too bad they were very buggy at launch.

At the same period in Shadowlands we've had Korthia for less than 3 months with redesigned maw and it was very unsatisfying and on of the worst raids in WoW's history.

I'm surprised that metrics are telling the game is emptier now than it was at the same time in Shadowlands, but I'm pretty sure if polls were made people would say they're happier with the game now than they were with the game at the same time during Shadowlands.

That's because the game is now made for the vocal minority, instead of the silent majority. Numbers don't lie. SL had massive issues, but the way DF is structured is not the way forward. I believe for modern times, something like Legion/BFA is the best middleground they came up with so far.

I also clicked the link in your sig and was pleasantly surprised. I feel like a lot of people here can learn from it

[Darkarath]

I've truly enjoyed 10.1 and 10.1.5. Time rifts were a blast, very dynamic and well paced, too bad they were very buggy at launch.

At the same period in Shadowlands we've had Korthia for less than 3 months with redesigned maw and it was very unsatisfying and on of the worst raids in WoW's history.

I'm surprised that metrics are telling the game is emptier now than it was at the same time in Shadowlands, but I'm pretty sure if polls were made people would say they're happier with the game now than they were with the game at the same time during Shadowlands.

If someone was happier in SL than in DF, I would be worried for the sanity of such a person. Although I would say that Torghast, just as a solo dungeon to hunt cosmetics, was really fun (I skipped SL until 9.2.5 if I recall correctly, so by then It was pretty easy and relaxing). I would love them to iterate on the idea, this time just as an evergreen secondary fun activity.

[Raetary]

I'm surprised that metrics are telling the game is emptier now than it was at the same time in Shadowlands,

Is it really surprising?

There was a wave of pretty significant games being released in the last few months that people flock to.

People are busy playing BG3, Starfield, etc. while wow has yet to release its next content update.
I'd wager most people are done with 10.1 story at this point and are just waiting for 10.1.7 and 10.2.

[Jaggler]

Is it really surprising?

There was a wave of pretty significant games being released in the last few months that people flock to.

People are busy playing BG3, Starfield, etc. while wow has yet to release its next content update.
I'd wager most people are done with 10.1 story at this point and are just waiting for 10.1.7 and 10.2.

This. We are probably in the most stacked era of gaming since the pandemic hit, i know people in my friendslist are busy with D4, BG3, Starfield etc.

One aspect that seems to be ignored by many, is that in contrast to SL, BfA or Legion you aren't kneecapping yourself if you take a break in DF. Most people probably achieved their goals in the 10.1. patch cycle in regards to how many bosses they killed or which rating they want to push.

[Shadowferal]

Numbers on raider.io and warcraftlogs does support his claim pretty heavily.

I've mentioned before that Blizz wanted to core out the playerbase that will accept anything. So retention rates should be higher...and useless.
The numbers that should mean anything are "new subscribers." And they gave up on that.

[Osmeric]

I've mentioned before that Blizz wanted to core out the playerbase that will accept anything.

I suspect they are repeatedly discovering that these people ultimately won't accept just anything.

[pacotaco]

If someone was happier in SL than in DF, I would be worried for the sanity of such a person. Although I would say that Torghast, just as a solo dungeon to hunt cosmetics, was really fun (I skipped SL until 9.2.5 if I recall correctly, so by then It was pretty easy and relaxing). I would love them to iterate on the idea, this time just as an evergreen secondary fun activity.

I see so many flaws in your logic...

- You're judging the enjoyment of another person of an expansion you skipped more than half of it.
- You want them to bring back Torghast when most of the community despised it because it was mandatory, and almost never played it when they made it optional.


¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Shadowferal]

I suspect they are repeatedly discovering that these people ultimately won't accept just anything.

I concede that "free-to-play" would be a risk.

[Darkarath]

I see so many flaws in your logic...

- You're judging the enjoyment of another person of an expansion you skipped more than half of it.
- You want them to bring back Torghast when most of the community despised it because it was mandatory, and almost never played it when they made it optional.


¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Perhaps I did not explain myself clearly enough:

- I played SL in 9.0. It was so terrible that I erased my account with an Insane in the Membrane character with more that 30k achievement points. SL being bad was not the only reason of me erasing my account but definitively the biggest factor in my decision.

- I returned in 9.2.5 (with a new account, my current one), and while I still hated SL I enjoyed it a bit when everything was not mandatory and easier, as, for example, Torghast, which in 9.2.5 was not the mandatory grind that it was in 9.0.

- That easy and relaxing 9.2.5 version of Torghast is what I enjoyed and what I believe It would be a nice side evergreen activity.

Hope that my position is clearer now.

[Marlamin]

- That easy and relaxing 9.2.5 version of Torghast is what I enjoyed and what I believe It would be a nice side evergreen activity.

I liked Torghast too, would be cool to get something like it back (although anima powers stuck around I guess).

Speaking of, there was a new mention of evergreen in the context of scaling in game files a bit ago but not sure where I saw that, will have to look for that. Might be something, might be nothing.

[Cheezits]

I'm pretty sure that Blizzard doesn't go too hard on .1 patches because most players (including casuals) just don't have it in them to play almost a full consecutive year of WoW. They go harder on the second patch because there's been enough of a lull for a lot of players to come back around to the game.

That being said: content cadence still better than BFA/SL and I much prefer these patches to 7.1/7.2. Also Year of Siege and most of WoD lol.

I can see the Dream being Argus-tier. Definitely more than a single large zone.