Midnight 12.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Gorsameth]

Also makes the rage about the Jailer's death scene kind of funny when it wasn't actually just a vague tease, but a follow-up to what N'zoth was saying. But because BFA was so crap people didn't connect N'zoth's warning to Zovaal's.

No, its that "omg the bad guy was just trying to protect us from an even worse guy" is the most face palm moments of garbage writing.

[Makabreska]

“Five” evil gods, huh.

Either Blizzard’s lore team dun goofed or once again, the players/community can telegraph Blizzard’s story choices and direction years in advance.

Plenty of people here can to the latter, that's how we know every time that this next expansion will defo have a world revamp.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

I think it's an attempt to reign in the over-modernization of Cataclysm. Characters were ridiculously verbose in Vanilla.

They were, and it was perfectly fair, but it was in a fairly tame capacity. The new dialogue feels far more, as I said, masturbatory and anodyne. It may just be that it's plain worse, but there's something about the way characters communicate now that feels a tad insufferable. The stilted pathos makes it worse.

It's not the verbosity or the anachronism alone, either—I enjoy FromSoft dialogue and it leans quite heavily into verbose and anachronistic diction. In fact, most of the dialogue I write myself is very anachronistic. Modern WoW dialogue isn't even so much anachronistic as it is plain cheesy—it's very hard to place the exact issue, I confess, but I think the difference is there.

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Also, combine these pages with the interview where Danuser said N'zoths warnings werent about the Janitor at all, but about the same cosmic threat he saw coming, and i think its getting obvious that the Void is trying to corrupt a world soul for the same reason the Janitor did his stuff: they are trying to create a Dark Titan to enslave the universe, so they can survive whatever big bad is coming.

And that would be pretty fckn boring. So all the cosmic forces are trying to usurp the others because they are afraid of some "mysterious" new big bad who we are supposed to be soooooooo scared of...yawn. Every cosmic force is basically becoming the same thing, just in different colours. All of them can corrupt, enslave, resurrect, destroy, transform or whatever else.

I find that very unfortunate. I was holding out hope that the Janitor's big fear was the imminent war between the other Cosmic Forces, which would make his behavior honestly make a fair lick of sense. It would also not require a giant rewrite of the Void's motives, too, because their goal would still be the same—corrupt the Final Titan to win the war and consume everything else.

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Either Blizzard’s lore team dun goofed or once again, the players/community can telegraph Blizzard’s story choices and direction years in advance.

To be fair, they broadcasted that all the way back in Legion when it was mentioned that Xal'Atath could be a remnant of the fifth Old God.

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but im curious what theyll pull out of their hat as an explanation why Xal was scrubbed from the history books of the titans (aka chronicles). Probably something along the lines of "She was so powerful she needed to be erased blah blah"

I'm definitely hoping they don't try to one-up the last few threats again and keep it to "she was an Old God, the other Old Gods wanted to eat every other Old God, and she was the first and only one that was actually killed by the others, but her undying essence remained and was put into the dagger".

[guro-tchai]

there were five old gods since classic. it's the same vanilla book with someone's comments, maybe Nelth's.
besides, it's probably G'huun. he's considered an old god by them, and it's completely natural to present own mistakes as something that's always been there.

[Nymrohd]

It's not the verbosity or the anachronism alone, either—I enjoy FromSoft dialogue and it leans quite heavily into verbose and anachronistic diction. In fact, most of the dialogue I write myself is very anachronistic. Modern WoW dialogue isn't even so much anachronistic as it is plain cheesy—it's very hard to place the exact issue, I confess, but I think the difference is there.

I mean it's not that hard to place. It's just worse writing occasionally saved by good voice actors.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Plenty of people here can to the latter, that's how we know every time that this next expansion will defo have a world revamp.

Being able to predict something doesn't mean its bad.

I mean it's not that hard to place. It's just worse writing occasionally saved by good voice actors.

"Worse writing" This whole forum exaggerates what the game is or how bad it is

[Makorus]

Before everyone loses their shit, the book is NOT new. The new part are the annotations by Neltharion.



The book itself is literally from the WC3 manual, so I wouldn't even analyze that at all.

[Cheezits]

I think they are definitely going to run with the fifth old god thing, it's been insanely likely since day one of Legion with Xal'atath. Them reusing the vanilla book means that they are aware of what it says.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

The book itself is literally from the WC3 manual, so I wouldn't even analyze that at all.

The fact that I didn't realize that initially is a source of incredible embarrassment for me.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Before everyone loses their shit, the book is NOT new. The new part are the annotations by Neltharion.



The book itself is literally from the WC3 manual, so I wouldn't even analyze that at all.

I feel like this is happening alot with dragon flight people seeing old lore and then thinking it’s new and means big things.

[Cheezits]

Between the Baine quest and there model of the totem, I think it's very likely that this is a new weapon for Tauren.

https://twitter.com/stiven_srb/statu...JUaFpbdpw5N5Rw

[Prenderghast]

Between the Baine quest and there model of the totem, I think it's very likely that this is a new weapon for Tauren.

Gosh I hope so. If I could resemble the WC3 tauren swinging a big ol' totem around I think I'd have a new main for life.

[Makorus]

The fact that I didn't realize that initially is a source of incredible embarrassment for me.

To be fair, I forgot that it was from the WC3 Manual as well. I only remembered the OG Books from Vanilla.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Between the Baine quest and there model of the totem, I think it's very likely that this is a new weapon for Tauren.

https://twitter.com/stiven_srb/statu...JUaFpbdpw5N5Rw

Likely just something Blaine him self will use the chance of them setting up abunch of player animations for it seem super slim.

[Cheezits]

Likely just something Blaine him self will use the chance of them setting up abunch of player animations for it seem super slim.

It is currently set up to use 1hander animations, that's why it has the rod built into it. So it can reuse existing animations.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fn4tsLvX...jpg&name=large

I don't think it's just for Baine, I think the quest exists only to reward the weapon at the end. Why would they add a random quest with Baine otherwise?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

It is currently set up to use 1hander animations, that's why it has the rod built into it. So it can reuse existing animations.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fn4tsLvX...jpg&name=large

I don't think it's just for Baine, I think the quest exists only to reward the weapon at the end. Why would they add a random quest with Baine otherwise?

From sounds of it it’s not set for 1 handed animations it can just be put onto them as well as 2 handed animations though that clips.

Back to topic of Tauren Totem. It really matches well with One-Handed Weapon animation, while with 2H anims left hand clips a lot. 1H anims are totally fine with attack / ready and parry. So could be like One hand Mace?

Which doesn’t really mean much as fun fact even guns can be put into animations that don’t fit them with a warrior trying to shoot a gun in legion ending up with them holding it like a bat as it uses the 2 hander animation, no idea if they ever fixed that.

It’s likely like Liadrins sword and shield something just for Baine as it would be a clipping night mare with actual class animations and what ever Baines quest is will just be for story reasons or give some other reward.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

I feel like this is happening alot with dragon flight people seeing old lore and then thinking it’s new and means big things.

If anything, the former is a good thing. It means we'll see more respect for the old lore and less of a tendency to effectively dismiss it as a restriction.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

If anything, the former is a good thing. It means we'll see more respect for the old lore and less of a tendency to effectively dismiss it as a restriction.

That would be Ideal but it's gonna come with a whole lot of whining and people spreading misinformation to go with it.

Like just jumping around links on this I've seen people say that the new book was copied from wowpedia and not the copy in game because wowpeida said they changed it from 5 god to 4 at some point with no citations, Wowpedia is of course just wrong as it often is and if you check the book in game right now it still says five gods.

[Imnotadentist]

The Dungeon Journal, truly the most absolute of sources, especially when the word "destroyed" is used with no adjectives.

Let's also not forget exactly how Outland was destroyed, as well. Surely, consistency with something as absolute as the Dungeon Journal is worth sacrificing one of the most interesting possible new locales for us to explore that already exists in lore.

Oh, also, if we're taking single statements from irrelevant sources as absolute, here's an Ethereal heavily implying that K'Aresh or the remnants thereof at least still has Ethereal inhabitants.

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Yes, the world-destroying power that a few Elves of dubious quality could evidently harness unrestricted. Truly, if even a people as innately destructive and irresponsible as Warcraft Elves can possess the discipline to regulate this power effectively, then we can't possibly imagine that there's anything left of K'Aresh.

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Absolutely agreed. K'Aresh has the potential for several kind of environments we haven't seen yet in Warcraft—I actually drafted an unpublished concept for a K'Aresh expansion, and people far more creative than I am have had a bit of fun with this one (though the former was admittedly more akin to what Varodoc suggested on a lesser scale, since K'Aresh was only part of a growing accumulation of a dreg heap of Void-eaten rocks, but GoldenYak really made something very fun out of the various exotic locales there)

Disregarding my curt statements to my other interlocutor, one idea I always had that would be a fun way of reconciling the threat the Void is meant to represent with having an expansion on K'Aresh would be for the entire thing to be in some kind of massive Eco-Dome (though it would be transparent near the top, of course, so that the sky with the typical Void aesthetics would be visible, with a massive sea of splotchy liquid Void outside of it. It would simultaneously make K'Aresh feel like it would've been even more impressive when it was still in its prime while also establishing exactly how much the Void destroyed the planet. It would also allow for Blizzard to avoid making another "rocks floating in space" expansion and giving Void-eaten planet remnants something of a distinct identity and aesthetic from Outland.

A couple zones I think would be very nice would be a Turkish-style steppe zone that blends into the last lush jungle left on K'Aresh, a massive desert with silver sand innately imbued with Arcane magic by the Ethereals, something like a much worse version of Deadwind Pass that used to be an experimentation ground where the Ethereals exploited more primitive races for soul-trading, a proper "Locus" zone that's exactly as Void-damaged as something can be before it become totally uninhabitable on a physical and spiritual level for mortal races, and the ruins of a massive city that used to be the technological epicenter of K'Aresh.

The thing that really interests me about a K'Aresh expansion is the opportunity for a nice and proper adventure. Plundering tombs and destroyed cities with Ethereal "archaeologists", exploring the side-effects of the Ethereal's greed combined with their advanced technology leading to the exploitation of more primitive races, exploring the culture and society of this race, re-establishing their society on their planet etc. It would be alien, but I don't think that would be a problem if it legitimately felt like a world you wanted to explore instead of a boring theme park of one-note aesthetics like Shadowlands.



Eh, I'm really not a fan of villain batting everybody who's a little harsh on the Alliance side. I've been hoping that Turalyon helps to take the Alliance in a more assertive, albeit not actively warmongering, direction.

Well heres where my "turalyon goes off the deepend" thing comes from
the dudes an exarch, already kind of does not like the Undead, nor the horde for that matter. So I think that Sylvanus ganking Anduin would be like his "final straw" and since Genn really was the only Alliance leader left back with him (and his hatred for the undead), No one would try to stop him.
You could also potentially have Yuriel come from alternate draenor (you know the lady that was literally mass killing the orcs) so that the whole story line from the Allied orc race actually had more to it.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Well heres where my "turalyon goes off the deepend" thing comes from
the dudes an exarch, already kind of does not like the Undead, nor the horde for that matter. So I think that Sylvanus ganking Anduin would be like his "final straw" and since Genn really was the only Alliance leader left back with him (and his hatred for the undead), No one would try to stop him.
You could also potentially have Yuriel come from alternate draenor (you know the lady that was literally mass killing the orcs) so that the whole story line from the Allied orc race actually had more to it.

Turalyon doesn't hate the undead he fully accepts Faol once he senses the light in him in before the storm.