1. #22081
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    Why the hell they should force players to learn 20 year history of game?
    The update would be bringing all those zones into the current timeframe of the game. They wouldn't be doing 20 year old content. They wouldn't even be doing 14 year old Cata content.

  2. #22082
    Brewmaster flan1337's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    It get fixed in 11.0 - new player start with evergreen Exile's Reach, then goes to Dragon Isles, then 11.0 content. DF is fresh start in story after time skip. Why the hell they should force players to learn 20 year history of game? What next, force them to play Warcraft 1-3 before to get full picture?

    FF forcing you to play X expansions before you can play with everyone is horrible and totally new player unfriendly. I heard they want to fix it as well and allow skip in future expansion.

    And many of us don't want world revamp to 'fix leveling', cause it doesn't need fixing. We simply want return to old places rebuilded with new technology after 13+ years.
    I didnt say force players to learn 20 years of history? A world revamp would mean players can go 1-70(lets say) in a updated setting and then start at 70 in the new xpack.

    Sure you can start with Dragonflight which is better than SL and BfA as the story starts off slow ,but it also has characters that a new player knows nothing about? My GF recently started WoW and its been a cluster fuck of not explaining anything. So she still needs to "learn 20 years of history" to care about anything.

    Edit: This also mean by your logic is that every xpack will be the new player experience which isn't a healthy way to operate. My opinion - contrary to a lot of WoW players - I do not like my MMO being this niche thing it is now and would like new players to enjoy the game as I do.
    Edit2: While I like exile reach I do think it took away from the awesome nature that WoW had which was each race had its own starting zone.
    Last edited by flan1337; 2023-09-30 at 07:21 PM.

  3. #22083
    Quote Originally Posted by Revamp Man View Post
    If all allied races use a similar skeleton to current races I think the panda skeleton is the last one left
    I think people would love Tuskaar (Pandarian reskin) and Gnoll (New Gnoll models are conspicuously a reskin of Worgen) as allied races but the biggest barrier to that is they would need an actual pretense to join the horde or alliance.

  4. #22084
    Quote Originally Posted by flan1337 View Post
    I didnt say force players to learn 20 years of history? A world revamp would mean players can go 1-70(lets say) in a updated setting and then start at 70 in the new xpack.

    Sure you can start with Dragonflight which is better than SL and BfA as the story starts off slow ,but it also has characters that a new player knows nothing about? My GF recently started WoW and its been a cluster fuck of not explaining anything. So she still needs to "learn 20 years of history" to care about anything.

    Edit: This also mean by your logic is that every xpack will be the new player experience which isn't a healthy way to operate. My opinion - contrary to a lot of WoW players - I do not like my MMO being this niche thing it is now and would like new players to enjoy the game as I do.
    What characters does Dragonflight have that need explaining though?

    Sure, Khadgar is there, but his pre-DF character is pretty much irrelevant in DF, and all the Aspects are old characters, but you learn enough of them from leveling that you aren't missing out on much.

    Meanwhile, BFA Alliance makes no sense whatsoever if you are new. Zandalar is a bit more indepedent, but still lacks the "Why do they distrust us, and who is Sylvanas anyway"

  5. #22085
    Quote Originally Posted by flan1337 View Post
    I didnt say force players to learn 20 years of history? A world revamp would mean players can go 1-70(lets say) in a updated setting and then start at 70 in the new xpack.

    Sure you can start with Dragonflight which is better than SL and BfA as the story starts off slow ,but it also has characters that a new player knows nothing about? My GF recently started WoW and its been a cluster fuck of not explaining anything. So she still needs to "learn 20 years of history" to care about anything.

    Edit: This also mean by your logic is that every xpack will be the new player experience which isn't a healthy way to operate. My opinion - contrary to a lot of WoW players - I do not like my MMO being this niche thing it is now and would like new players to enjoy the game as I do.
    Edit2: While I like exile reach I do think it took away from the awesome nature that WoW had which was each race had its own starting zone.
    Your GF still won't know what the hell is going on nor the history of the game with a world revamp. It is just a task that is too great for Blizzard and their goblins running things. Just look at Shadowlands; that was a great way to go back to a bunch of old characters, their story, lore and what they have meant for the game - but we only got probably not even 5 of them. They didn't even bring back Arthas. That's how terrible they are at weaving in the old lore and stories. They only know how to do new stuff sprinkled with the occasional old stuff that on top of it is often changed from what was originally said about it.

    It is soooo much easier for them to build new zones from scratch than trying to revamp the old world that is a web of story and history. And if they only do a few zones, it's going to be just like the Cataclysm; immensely lackluster.

    And if it's above you to go through the quests, dungeons and raids in the old zones to learn the lore and the stories, how can you claim you care to learn the lore in the first place? You don't. People just want a twitter post containing all the old lore, but that's not how things work. The lore is simply too vast.
    Last edited by Explicit Teemo Nudes; 2023-09-30 at 07:34 PM.

  6. #22086
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    What characters does Dragonflight have that need explaining though?

    Sure, Khadgar is there, but his pre-DF character is pretty much irrelevant in DF, and all the Aspects are old characters, but you learn enough of them from leveling that you aren't missing out on much.

    Meanwhile, BFA Alliance makes no sense whatsoever if you are new. Zandalar is a bit more indepedent, but still lacks the "Why do they distrust us, and who is Sylvanas anyway"
    You are right they do a lot better job for people who don't know who the aspects are compared to BFA which is basically joining a story mid-way. I guess I think for a new person with 0 idea of what warcraft is the story still is pretty left field and asks "why should I care for these characters - because I just met them". Now I am only talking about the dragons I think Ohn'ahran Plains is probably the strongest when it comes to telling a really good story in DF.

  7. #22087
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    Quote Originally Posted by Explicit Teemo Nudes View Post
    Your GF still won't know what the hell is going on nor the history of the game with a world revamp. It is just a task that is too great for Blizzard and their goblins running things. Just look at Shadowlands; that was a great way to go back to a bunch of old characters, their story, lore and what they have meant for the game - but we only got probably not even 5 of them. They didn't even bring back Arthas. That's how terrible they are at weaving in the old lore and stories. They only know how to do new stuff sprinkled with the occasional old stuff that on top of it is often changed from what was originally said about it.

    It is soooo much easier for them to build new zones from scratch than trying to revamp the old world that is a web of story and history. And if they only do a few zones, it's going to be just like the Cataclysm; immensely lackluster.

    And if it's above you to go through the quests, dungeons and raids in the old zones to learn the lore and the stories, how can you claim you care to learn the lore in the first place? You don't. People just want a twitter post containing all the old lore, but that's not how things work. The lore is simply too vast.
    I am not in the camp that players should need to know the full story of WoW to enjoy it that would be nuts and you are right the lore is simply too vast( and boring at times ). I just want a really good 1-80 story for players. Now it could be that Dragonflight and the Next xpact indeed becomes that and has a really good over arching story ,but I think WoW still runs into the issue where when you hit level 70 and have to move onto the next xpact you loose all the post leveling story.

    I am not a game dev or remotely know how to handle story crafting. So the question still stand how do you explain all the major points of DF in the new xpact for new players that aren't going to do DF post leveling content when they are shoved into 11.0.

    Edit: I also roleplay so my want for a #worldrevamp is because I love these classic zones AND want to see them updated, bigger and more beautiful. People on private servers do it - so can blizz.

  8. #22088
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Thrall Key art + Towelliee + Chinese predictor + mount leak + sequel expansion theory pretty much put anything void or light-based to rest. I'm sure there will be void and light elements, but this ship is turning decidedly towards Underground/Elemental expansion.
    What has Towelliee said?

  9. #22089
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    I think people would love Tuskaar (Pandarian reskin) and Gnoll (New Gnoll models are conspicuously a reskin of Worgen) as allied races but the biggest barrier to that is they would need an actual pretense to join the horde or alliance.
    Are Tuskarr actually Pandaren reskins?

  10. #22090
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yusefstrasza View Post
    What has Towelliee said?
    He hinted at an underground expansion.

  11. #22091
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Thrall Key art + Towelliee + Chinese predictor + mount leak + sequel expansion theory pretty much put anything void or light-based to rest. I'm sure there will be void and light elements, but this ship is turning decidedly towards Underground/Elemental expansion.
    The expansion that is going to have Odyn, and referenced the dwarves being affected by something similiar to the Curse of Flesh that is emanated by a fissure after Iridikron stole a Void artifact and dipped with Xalatath is not going to be Void based, but instead Elemental themed based... nothing?
    Last edited by Makorus; 2023-09-30 at 07:48 PM.

  12. #22092
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Are Tuskarr actually Pandaren reskins?
    Yes but both the new Tuskarr & Gnolls only use the male pandarian/worgen skeleton respectively.

  13. #22093
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    It get fixed in 11.0 - new player start with evergreen Exile's Reach, then goes to Dragon Isles, then 11.0 content. DF is fresh start in story after time skip. Why the hell they should force players to learn 20 year history of game? What next, force them to play Warcraft 1-3 before to get full picture?

    FF forcing you to play X expansions before you can play with everyone is horrible and totally new player unfriendly. I heard they want to fix it as well and allow skip in future expansion.

    And many of us don't want world revamp to 'fix leveling', cause it doesn't need fixing. We simply want return to old places rebuilded with new technology after 13+ years.
    Pretty sure @flan1337 example was in regards to their story having a definitve beginning and end.
    Not that Blizzard should force us to do 400 hours of story content before we get to play the game.

    And 11.0 doesn't solve anything.
    They are just moving the Reach a bit to the right.
    All the issues a newcomer faces upon entering Stormwind still persist, from vaguely being directed onto the isles while also being bombarded with every other possible avenue to lvl in, to being locked out of dungeons and having to interact with years old outdated systems that aren't relevant anymore.

    DF starts off less imposing than BfA, but barely 5 minutes into the lvling and you are already interacting with Alexstrazsa and Wrathion and need to have wowpedia ready to understand who those characters are and what exactly they are doing here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Explicit Teemo Nudes View Post
    Your GF still won't know what the hell is going on nor the history of the game with a world revamp.
    No, but immediately understanding the history of the game isn't the point.

    The point is to start of small and then have the world build itself organically around your character while you lvl up.

    Where the player gets to understand the very basics first and not like now, where the player immediately gets to interact with characters that require 3 novels worth of lore to understand, before they get sent into another magic land that requires an additional 3 novels worth of lore to understand.


    Formerly known as Arafal

  14. #22094
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    The expansion that is going to have Odyn,

    Where does the next expansion reference Odyn?

    and referenced the dwarves being affected by something similiar to the Curse of Flesh that is emanated by a fissure

    Earthen, not Dwarves.

    after Iridikron stole a Void artifact and dipped with Xalatath
    That is the current expansion, not the next one.

    is not going to be Void based, but instead Elemental themed based... nothing?
    Based on multiple clues that point in that direction. Including datamined mounts and pets that actually relate to the next expansion, not the current one.

  15. #22095
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Where does the next expansion reference Odyn?




    Earthen, not Dwarves.



    That is the current expansion, not the next one.



    Based on multiple clues that point in that direction. Including datamined mounts and pets that actually relate to the next expansion, not the current one.
    The books which hinted at Avaloren/Khaz Algar literally have Odyn desperately trying to find the places, so much so that he is sending suicide expeditions out just on the off-chance that he might find the "heretics". And what a surprise, who makes a surprise appearance in 10.2 all of a sudden.

    Does it being Earthen even matter? They are being turned into Dwarves. The book literally says that.

    Yeah, it's the current expansion, because 11.0 is going to be a sequel.

    What clues? What pets? The gryphon mount references Elementals how?

    Not 100% sure on it being a Void Expansion or an Anti-Order expansion (depends on the Odyn cutscene in 10.2/Tyr resolution), but it definetely won't be an Elemental expansion (especially when we already had one).

  16. #22096
    How would they explain a full world revamp again?

  17. #22097
    Quote Originally Posted by Terremer View Post
    it triggers me when people compare two skeletons from different animations and say they're the same

    if you see any similarities between the dracthry and the worgen, you'd better go to the ophthalmologist and have your vision tested - you might have cararacts!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    People have tried to say their rig is the worgen rig because they have similar animations, but they are completely unique animation sets (outside of visage).
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    Worgen Skeleton isn't similar to Dracthyr in any way.
    It is similar to the female Worgen one.
    Besides, they turn into humans and vice versa like Worgen.

  18. #22098
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Earthen, not Dwarves.
    You keep saying this like it means anything. The titans in the text refer to actual dwarves as Earthen as well. That is what they call them. They literally refer to "the Earthen" who left Uldaman who call themselves "dwarves".

    You've been hung up on this for pages and pages and I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.

  19. #22099
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fahrad Wagner View Post
    Share the copium brother, our people needs it
    Yeah I'm pretty sure we are done but the expansion does sound potentially interesting. Its definitely by 12.0 though. With Ions comment and the assets it has to be one of the next couple expansions.

  20. #22100
    Quote Originally Posted by Terremer View Post
    it triggers me when people compare two skeletons from different animations and say they're the same

    if you see any similarities between the dracthry and the worgen, you'd better go to the ophthalmologist and have your vision tested - you might have cararacts!
    This same thread spent weeks thinking an AI generated orc that had horns and long ears was supposed to be Fyrakk.

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