1. #22161
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayRule View Post
    Yes, I agree, and that's fine. My original post you responded to for this chain of replies is that I don't know why Terez keeps derailing people with "Earthen = / Dwarves" like it means something. The Dwarves of Khaz Modan are not Earthen, and whatever these Earthen in Khaz Algar became are also not Earthen. Earthen is just their shared progenitor, and I'm not sure what point he's trying to make constantly undercutting conversation to remind us this, when often the response he's saying to this shows they know this too. It really seems like Terez has decided through their misinterpretation that the Khaz Algar race are called Earthen and is feverishly correcting anyone.
    Because Earthen DOESN'T equal dwarves. Earthen are direct titan constructs.

    It'd be like saying that Mechagnomes like Mimiron are the same as playable Gnomes. That isn't the case. Gnomes (and Dwarves) are inflicted by the curse of the flesh. Mimiron and the Earthen in Khaz Algar are NOT. In the case of Khaz Algar they experienced an anomaly that gave them the behaviors of Dwarves but didn't turn them into dwarves physically.

  2. #22162
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    You’re really shifting those goal posts aren’t you. From Yrel invasion to Undermine to Elemental/Underground to Titan/Elemental. I imagine once it’s revealed to be Avaloren/Khaz Algar you’ll find a way to argue that you predicted it.

    A side note, Storm Rider would be an awful expansion name. I’m well up for more Dwarves though.
    Also, @Teriz If this expansion ends up being largely underground, and we dont get Undermine or Tinkers, are you going to give up on that being a thing for a few years?

  3. #22163
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    Also, @Teriz If this expansion ends up being largely underground, and we dont get Undermine or Tinkers, are you going to give up on that being a thing for a few years?
    Certainly, if the expansion clues don't lead in that direction. Keep in mind that I was largely considering a Yrel expansion until Towelliee's statements and more details about the next expansion became clear. Due to 11.0 possibly being an underground expansion, Undermine has a chance of happening next expansion whether we like it or not.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2023-10-01 at 12:08 AM.

  4. #22164
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Certainly, if the expansion clues don't lead in that direction. Keep in mind that I was largely considering a Yrel expansion until Towelliee's statements and more details about the next expansion became clear. Due to 11.0 possibly being an underground expansion, Undermine has a chance of happening next expansion whether we like it or not.
    True its definitely a possibility, and potentially even a patch zone if not launch zone, but id say the chances of getting Undermine go down drastically if 11.0 ends without it being added. It would be at least 2 expansions before we could consider it again imo. Unless 11.0 has just 1 underground zone, then Undermine is still on the table for 12.0 imo. We will see. I do think Undermine as a neutral capital, plus also being like Suramar could be cool. Undermine the city, and then most of the zone is also city but with gangs/mobsters etc and a 10-12 chapter max level campaign. Could be cool. I hope we get it this time even if it seems unlikely.

  5. #22165
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Because Earthen DOESN'T equal dwarves. Earthen are direct titan constructs.

    It'd be like saying that Mechagnomes like Mimiron are the same as playable Gnomes. That isn't the case. Gnomes (and Dwarves) are inflicted by the curse of the flesh. Mimiron and the Earthen in Khaz Algar are NOT. In the case of Khaz Algar they experienced an anomaly that gave them the behaviors of Dwarves but didn't turn them into dwarves physically.
    The book was written at the same time that dwarves didn't exist. They could have become dwarves at this point. They could have become something else

    We know nothing about this place except a book written pre-Sundering. To say it is outdated isn't even getting to the half of it

    I personally don't think its a void expansion or a titan expansion or an elemental expansion or any of that. I think it could be a "Azeroth Awakens" expansion which, per your own words on Dragonflight not counting as elemental, apparently counts as seperate to all that

  6. #22166
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gurkan View Post
    Kind of weird to have Thrall front and center of a Dwarven expansion.
    Makes perfect sense if its a mix of Titan, Old God, and Elementals.

    We have the initial A plot being about Titan and elemental stuff with Xal doing stuff in the background and the patches slowly get more Old Gody.

    Plus if they are killing Smolderon, maybe Ragnaros will be resurrected somehow and Thrall would be needed for that.

    What if the first raid of the expansion is BRD 2.0?

  7. #22167
    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    Makes perfect sense if its a mix of Titan, Old God, and Elementals.

    We have the initial A plot being about Titan and elemental stuff with Xal doing stuff in the background and the patches slowly get more Old Gody.

    Plus if they are killing Smolderon, maybe Ragnaros will be resurrected somehow and Thrall would be needed for that.

    What if the first raid of the expansion is BRD 2.0?
    I think they will very likely go for BRD/Molten Core vibes, especially if its a revamp.

  8. #22168
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Certainly, if the expansion clues don't lead in that direction. Keep in mind that I was largely considering a Yrel expansion until Towelliee's statements and more details about the next expansion became clear. Due to 11.0 possibly being an underground expansion, Undermine has a chance of happening next expansion whether we like it or not.
    What statements did Towelliee give? Did he leak something about the expansion?

  9. #22169
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyojuro View Post
    it can be a world revamp and we discover an dwarven zone maybe underground or even in avaloren called Khaz'Algar.
    Could also be like 2 underground zones and an above zone and part of the leveling happens in a few Azeroth zones too.

  10. #22170
    Quote Originally Posted by Explicit Teemo Nudes View Post
    What statements did Towelliee give? Did he leak something about the expansion?
    He said to expect stuff "under the waves" (against a South Seas expansion) and then said to expect a cave zone.

  11. #22171
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    True its definitely a possibility, and potentially even a patch zone if not launch zone, but id say the chances of getting Undermine go down drastically if 11.0 ends without it being added. It would be at least 2 expansions before we could consider it again imo. Unless 11.0 has just 1 underground zone, then Undermine is still on the table for 12.0 imo. We will see. I do think Undermine as a neutral capital, plus also being like Suramar could be cool. Undermine the city, and then most of the zone is also city but with gangs/mobsters etc and a 10-12 chapter max level campaign. Could be cool. I hope we get it this time even if it seems unlikely.
    Yes, an underground expansion without Undermine would dramatically lower its chances of occurring in the near future. I do think it is an inevitable addition to the game though, due to its strength in lore and its sheer pedigree.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mecheon View Post
    The book was written at the same time that dwarves didn't exist. They could have become dwarves at this point. They could have become something else
    The book actually mentions Dwarves a few times;

    Observational Report: Earthen
    Fellow watchers,

    When you were assigned to observe the state of our titan-forged subjects who, regretfully, fell under the influence of flesh, the keepers could not have anticipated the effort necessary to follow them as they spread throughout the world.

    I shall do my best to ensure your perseverance is recognized. But for now, you are to continue your duties until a new directive is authorized.
    It is apparent from your reports that the degree of transformation in titan-forged subjects is significantly diverse. There is no group in which this variance is more easily observable than the earthen.

    While some have succumbed entirely to the malady, such as the earthen who emerged from Uldaman and called themselves dwarves, others remain resistant--whether in full or in part.

    One particularly notable variant can be found in the earthen contingent dispatched to investigate the fissure detected in Sector AR-938 (for further details, search records related to geological anomalies).

    In the course of their duties, these earthen began to manifest behaviors analogous to those which would one day be apparent in the self-styled dwarves, despite the two groups being separated by vast swaths of time and distance.

    In fact, based on their origin dates, I could identify no corollary at all between these populations.

    Yet while their behaviors, language, and demeanor show many similarities (for example, assigning Sector AR-938 the colloquial name "Khaz Algar"), physiologically the two groups remain distinct.

    Is this distinctiveness due to exposure to the unique qualities of the anomaly, or is there another reason? We require more data before a conclusion can be reached.
    As ever, your aid in this analysis remains invaluable. Remember, we are the eyes of the titans.
    https://www.wowhead.com/item=201920/...report-earthen

  12. #22172
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    The book actually mentions Dwarves a few times;
    Yup, so definitely written post-Sundering too.

  13. #22173
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Because Earthen DOESN'T equal dwarves. Earthen are direct titan constructs.
    Earthen is a supergroup of Dwarves. Dwarves are Earthen. Earthen are not Dwarves. They aren't equal because Earthen also covers beings other than Dwarves, not because Dwarves aren't Earthen.

  14. #22174
    I realllllllllllllllly doubt the main force of the Algarians are going to be Earthen because they aren't interesting enough.

    It will be Earthen plus some kind of "corruption". Hence the green glow on the gryphon.

  15. #22175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    I realllllllllllllllly doubt the main force of the Algarians are going to be Earthen because they aren't interesting enough.

    It will be Earthen plus some kind of "corruption". Hence the green glow on the gryphon.
    I think if you imagine this kinda like evolutions then Earthern is the base. Dwarves and Algerian share the base evolution but are fundamentally different only sharing the base. It then keep batching wher dwarves become more splintered by dark iron, wildhammer etc.

    Algerian might be the same where they might not look like Dwarves which is hard to imagine but the picture someone shared could be it. Something scaly and more beast-like.

  16. #22176
    Also, one reason for a revamp... the gryphon textures in question look like they are for all gryphons, not just the CE one. They look way more like classic gryphons than the MOP ones do.

  17. #22177
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Earthen is a supergroup of Dwarves. Dwarves are Earthen. Earthen are not Dwarves. They aren't equal because Earthen also covers beings other than Dwarves, not because Dwarves aren't Earthen.
    The point is that the Earthen that currently occupy Khaz Algar may be behaviorally and even culturally similar to dwarves, but they're not dwarves.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    I realllllllllllllllly doubt the main force of the Algarians are going to be Earthen because they aren't interesting enough.

    It will be Earthen plus some kind of "corruption". Hence the green glow on the gryphon.
    I doubt the datamined gryphon has anything to do with Khaz Algar.

    I also doubt that Khaz Algar is going to be the central part of this expansion. If I had to guess, I would say that Khaz Algar has the same place in next expansion as the Emerald Dream has in the current expansion.

  18. #22178
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    ETA on the next "leak?" 5 weeks to go!

  19. #22179
    I hope Khaz'Algar is the capital. If its a giant Thor Modan it could be gorgeous and as a Horde main I've spent half as long as I'd have liked in Ironforge, and half as much as it deserves.

    Saying that, I would be more interested to see us coming to them as newcomers, and being relegated to a lower tier/area of the city and unlocking more of it with the renown and storylines. We should work our way into these societies and see them unfold alongside the expansion. Prove ourselves as valuable. Bonus points if Xal'atath is doing the same in another point of the city and we're both trying to earn their favour.

  20. #22180
    at this rate we're going to need 12.0 to get announced and released to convince the world revamp believers that we aren't getting one in 11.0, holy cope

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