The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[huth]

Except we haven't had Thrall on the key art in years, so clearly they've been selling it with other characters in that time frame.

In short, if the next expansion were Elune based, we'd expect to see Tyrande or even Malfurion on the key art, not Thrall.

Also I don't think Algarian Stormrider lends itself well to an Elune concept.

That you'd expect somebody else doesn't change that he's an iconic WarCraft character that can easily just represent the franchise in general.

Don't worry, I seriously doubt that's happening.

Well great, now it's guaranteed.

[Teriz]

This years key art is so toned down, they likely just picked the general mascots to represent each franchise instead of theming it after announcements.
This is the first Blizzcon in 3 years afterall.

Thrall does not have to mean a single thing.
Just as Winston doesn't have to mean a thing.
Or Elise.

Or Lilith, who i'm pretty sure dies in the base campaign.
And i doubt they'll immediately bring her back in the first Expansion.

Wouldn’t it be MORE likely that they’re simply following the same methods that they’ve been doing since at least WoD?

[huth]

Or Lilith, who i'm pretty sure dies in the base campaign.

She takes Diablo's usual spot in the campaign. Though given the story, i wouldn't be surprised if he shows up in a later season as the new final boss.

[Dismayxz]

Really?

Imagine a 30-45 year old dude with a family and stressful job.

15-20 years ago, he and his mates used to play WoW all the time in college, or after school. They ran a raiding guild and defeated C'Thun, Illidan, and Arthas together. But somewhere down the line, things fell apart. A few lost interest during Cataclysm or Mists of Pandaria. One or two kept going through Warlords of Draenor or Legion, but by the time Shadowlands came around most had quit. These days, WoW is just a nostalgic memory to them. They look up videos on YouTube every now and then, listening to the music and getting all teary eyed.

What scenario do you think is the most likely to pique their interests, causing them to look up more information online and possibly even return to the game?

A) Our dude is on lunch break at work and hears somebody mention that there's a new WoW expansion coming: "Return of the Lich King". Or he's just aimlessly browsing YouTube on the toilet and sees an ad with the Lich King's glowing eyes, and a logo with this name.

B) Our dude is on lunch break at work and hears somebody mention that there's a new WoW expansion coming: "Stormbreak". Or he's just aimlessly browsing YouTube on the toilet and sees an ad with some random Iridikron dude he's never heard of, and a logo with this name.

Speaking as a dude who fits right into that demographic (except I'm the only one left of my friends), option A immediately brings a sense of familiarity and nostalgia, while option B just sounds like another expansion in modern WoW. I don't know what it's about, but it doesn't sound like a return to the lore I knew.

"Hot" Take, appealing to people that can't cope with relatively normal change isn't exactly going to better the playerbase or the game. Redirecting Lore for nostalgia's sake isn't exactly better than simply aiming for a change to something more familiar but not outright bringing something back for nothing but "looky here!".

The fact of the matter is that from a marketing perspective your idea is sound, if very frontloaded, but if "Return of the Lich King" is then also mostly a modern expansion still, all that guy just got is -X amounts of dollars better spent elsewhere, because outside of the name and hook of the expansion, nothing else really fits the bill of "what it once was". What you describe literally just sounds like a whole lot of literally depressed old people, which is their problem to solve not escape from. The Game has changed with it's audience to a certain extent and people are going to be left behind on that road, that's to be expected and fine.

If "Return of the Lich King" is not just a name, then all you're more probable to do is trade off portions of the modern base for an influx of jaded old dudes looking for a fix. Which yeah, could be a net positive change numbers wise, or could not.

The name, at the end of the day, should at best be catchy or very simply convey the theme we're heading into. It should not matter this much at all. The story should always move forward at some pace (whether slow or fast) until it reaches it's conclusion, otherwise it's just not worth writing one to begin with. Constantly moving backwards and try to bait jaded old dudes with a quick therapy session isn't really.. the point.

[guro-tchai]

It's more mythological in a sense. I certainly wasn't expecting Cenarius to have a harem of dryads that he can breed every so often.

actually, there's no contradiction. few understand this, but cenaridae are egg-laying sentient mammals.
it is still true that Malorne rode Elune and Cenarius was the issue; it is still true that the most obvious way of cenaridae multiplication is mass-scale incest. the new quest doesn't contradict it, it just says that there's an intermediary phase of their development - a seed, an egg, which comes from a questionable but completely natural process.
this view is supported by the fact that Elune created moonkins - she's got that DNA-editing magic. which also explains why Elune is so notoriously bad with responding to the pleas of her worshippers - most of her time is spent on ensuring that her descendants remain viable and virile, unaffected by the generations of incest.
it's also supported by the fact that a) there's cenaridae in Ardenweald b) Elune and Winter Queen don't get along. the explanation is pretty simple: Malorne, as a Wild God, got ported to Ardenweald on death, and cheated on his lover with her sister - giving the latter an army of loyal henchmen, but shattering their relationships.

[Mace]

Oh please, not another expansion about night elves...

I guess 1 was too much, didn't we get 4 about orcs - who were at the centre of the expansion. TBC, Cata, MoP, WoD were all about orcs, with WoD being the most orcish of them all

I mean Orcs have been the most heavily focused race in wow's life time. Humans are in weird position, they've always been auxiliiary for most of wow, this means they've always got a a lot of screen time but they've never been the primary focus.

Night elves certainly haven't. only 3 of the Legion zones were about their race. And if you're one of those people who ignore that Suramar is about night elves, that would make only 2 zones - it was a Legion expansion, not a night elf one.

Nah, what you are fed up is about all the topics we make about the half arsed, brief appearances of night elves. When you think about it, that isn't actually much content, just involvement that keeps cropping up - it isn't anywhere near enough to be justified if you could stomach orcs as the centre of 4 expansions.

/shrug

[Ersula]

Wouldn’t it be MORE likely that they’re simply following the same methods that they’ve been doing since at least WoD?

Am I the only person here who thinks them announcing a paid expansion to a game that just came out 4 months ago would be very bad? Most people who bought it are disappointed with it, imagine asking them to pay more.

I'd guess if the Alliance race getting focus in 11.0 is dwarves, the horde equivalent will be Orcs or Goblins.

[Revamp Man]

So unlike WoD to Legion where the connection was actually established, there's Azerite & the sword, where the connection isn't actually established until the following expansion comes out? That doesn't help us predict anything. (IE: The dark portal randomly opening was as random in TBC as it was in WoD, Why the alliance is attacking lordaeron, what syvlanas was doing, what azerite is, etc.)

Yes
Ignore the main story of the expansion
Ignore the Sylvanas story completely

[Dismayxz]

actually, there's no contradiction. few understand this, but cenaridae are egg-laying sentient mammals.
it is still true that Malorne rode Elune and Cenarius was the issue; it is still true that the most obvious way of cenaridae multiplication is mass-scale incest. the new quest doesn't contradict it, it just says that there's an intermediary phase of their development - a seed, an egg, which comes from a questionable but completely natural process.
this view is supported by the fact that Elune created moonkins - she's got that DNA-editing magic. which also explains why Elune is so notoriously bad with responding to the pleas of her worshippers - most of her time is spent on ensuring that her descendants remain viable and virile, unaffected by the generations of incest.
it's also supported by the fact that a) there's cenaridae in Ardenweald b) Elune and Winter Queen don't get along. the explanation is pretty simple: Malorne, as a Wild God, got ported to Ardenweald on death, and cheated on his lover with her sister - giving the latter an army of loyal henchmen, but shattering their relationships.

What the fuck did I just read

[Berkilak]

TBC, Cata, MoP, WoD were all about orcs,

I wish I was half as limber as you. That’s some impressive stretching.

[Nightshade711]

I don’t buy into the Eclipse leak. It’s far too underwhelming for a “20th anniversary, 10th expansion”.
Same with any “underground elemental expansion” tbh.

[Ersula]

Yes
Ignore the main story of the expansion
Ignore the Sylvanas story completely

You can't just say the connective story tissue is "Sylvanas." "Sylvanas" is not a plot. We had no idea what she was doing in BFA & I'm not entirely sure the writers of BFA did either.

During WoD 6.2, they directly told us the legion was invading, which leads into Legion. But that only applies to that expansion. From Shadowlands, no one could predict the Dragon Aspects would return to their super-secret ancestral homeland. Or from BFA's story, no one could have predicted Sylvanas was working for a secret death god and everyone was going to hell or that she was going to fight the Lich King on top ICC.

[huth]

I wish I was half as limber as you. That’s some impressive stretching.

Well, give him WoD. They were rather more marginal in the other three, though.

[Pinksocking]

I don’t buy into the Eclipse leak. It’s far too underwhelming for a “20th anniversary, 10th expansion”.
Same with any “underground elemental expansion” tbh.

nobody wanna go under the damn ground, its such a weird thing

[Nightshade711]

nobody wanna go under the damn ground, its such a weird thing

Agreed.
Underground hasn’t worked before just like underwater hasn’t worked before. The most they’ll do is some massive crater with open skies like they did Nazjatar.

[Teriz]

Am I the only person here who thinks them announcing a paid expansion to a game that just came out 4 months ago would be very bad? Most people who bought it are disappointed with it, imagine asking them to pay more.

I'd guess if the Alliance race getting focus in 11.0 is dwarves, the horde equivalent will be Orcs or Goblins.

If you're talking about Diablo 4, Blizzard already confirmed annual expansions for the game;

https://www.polygon.com/23861011/dia...ion-every-year

I also doubt that Dwarves are a focus in 11.0. They'll get some story beats, since Khaz Algar is more than likely near their settlements in the Eastern Kingdoms, but I highly doubt that 11.0 is going to be a Dwarf expansion.

[Enrif]

I don’t buy into the Eclipse leak. It’s far too underwhelming for a “20th anniversary, 10th expansion”.
Same with any “underground elemental expansion” tbh.

If, big if, the eclipse leak is a bit credible, it will deal with elune, which is as big as you can get in Warcraft story without going cosmic/first one’s stuff.

I mean, after sargeras, illidan and sylvanas being locked away, arthas gone, thrall becoming a family man, elune is one of the last OG Warcraft things left.

[Ersula]

If you're talking about Diablo 4, Blizzard already confirmed annual expansions for the game;

https://www.polygon.com/23861011/dia...ion-every-year

But paid? The difference here was they were giving away Destiny 2 for free. Diablo 4 cost 50+ dollars.

I also doubt that Dwarves are a focus in 11.0. They'll get some story beats, since Khaz Algar is more than likely near their settlements in the Eastern Kingdoms, but I highly doubt that 11.0 is going to be a Dwarf expansion.

Why do you think Khaz Algar is anywhere near the Eastern Kingdoms? The Tyr Log says the exact opposite...that they are so remote the cultures have had no contact with each other. That means either they're extremely deep underground or separated by an ocean, or both.

Plus its been a long, long time since Dwarves have had focus in the story (Diamond Magni doesn't count as racial representation. Last time we checked on what was going on with dwarves was Cataclysm.)

[Revamp Man]

You can't just say the connective story tissue is "Sylvanas." "Sylvanas" is not a plot. We had no idea what she was doing in BFA & I'm not entirely sure the writers of BFA did either.

During WoD 6.2, they directly told us the legion was invading, which leads into Legion. But that only applies to that expansion. From Shadowlands, no one could predict the Dragon Aspects would return to their super-secret ancestral homeland. Or from BFA's story, no one could have predicted Sylvanas was working for a secret death god and everyone was going to hell or that she was going to fight the Lich King on top ICC.

We know she made a deal
We know she has a master
We know she runs off screaming death will claim our world
We know her betrayal was coming

But yes just say it's Sylvanas

Like how WoD to Legion was literally just Guldan who got tossed into a portal

[Teriz]

But paid? The difference here was they were giving away Destiny 2 for free. Diablo 4 cost 50+ dollars.

I'd imagine that Diablo fans would be used to paying for their expansions at this point, since that was the case for Diablo 3.

Why do you think Khaz Algar is anywhere near the Eastern Kingdoms? The Tyr Log says the exact opposite...that they are so remote the cultures have had no contact with each other. That means either they're extremely deep underground or separated by an ocean, or both.

I believe it's under the Eastern Kingdoms.

Plus its been a long, long time since Dwarves have had focus in the story (Diamond Magni doesn't count as racial representation. Last time we checked on what was going on with dwarves was Cataclysm.)

Yeah, I just don't believe that Dwarves are going to be the alpha and omega of 11.0. They'll probably play a decent role in getting us to wherever we're going, but that's about it. We should also consider how the Horde is going to be getting where they're going, since it is doubtful that the Horde is going to work directly with the Dwarves and vice versa.