The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Dragon ANX]

For me, Dragonfight lore is good, but that's about it. There have been no cool and exciting moments and it has been this way since SL, to be honest (SL lore was garbage). I think every good lore has to have some 'touching and soft' moments, but DF has too much of it and basically no 'BRUUUUUUHHHH LET'S GOOOO' moment, which leads to a boring and lethargic feeling.
That is how i and most of my friends are feeling like.

[Catastrophy349]

Let's get this conversation back on track. Where does the story go from here (can be 10.2, 10.2+, or 11.0/11.0+)?

[Merryck]

For me, Dragonfight lore is good, but that's about it. There have been no cool and exciting moments and it has been this way since SL, to be honest (SL lore was garbage). I think every good lore has to have some 'touching and soft' moments, but DF has too much of it and basically no 'BRUUUUUUHHHH LET'S GOOOO' moment, which leads to a boring and lethargic feeling.
That is how i and most of my friends are feeling like.

the snoozer

[Samin]

I mentioned this a little earlier in the thread once wowhead posted the Q'onzu quest line. I'm not sure how long the Q'onzu quest line has been on the PTR. If it was the whole cycle, maybe that person was really clever and spun it together before it was more widely known.

It's a cool idea to think about, though, either way. He returned to the dream and started going by loa instead of Wild God. Maybe he found Trolls / some form of Trolls / Troll ancestor race elsewhere and was dubbed as loa and it's a hint, like the leak suggests with the Troll / Elf common ancestor.

I don't know the leaker also said the dungeon is called "Freezepeak", which is I assume where those freeze peach trees grow. I know Blizzard likes their puns and pop culture references, but I don't think that's it.

[milkmustache]

Let's get this conversation back on track. Where does the story go from here (can be 10.2, 10.2+, or 11.0/11.0+)?

They keep using the term "turning point" in recent interviews, which I'm not sure what the is referring to. Turning point meaning we defeat Fyrakk and the battle against the Primalists (not Incarnates) is won? Or turning point in meaning that there's a big twist at the end of the raid and there's more danger in store for us than there is victory?

[GhostFish]

I mentioned this a little earlier in the thread once wowhead posted the Q'onzu quest line. I'm not sure how long the Q'onzu quest line has been on the PTR. If it was the whole cycle, maybe that person was really clever and spun it together before it was more widely known.

It's a cool idea to think about, though, either way. He returned to the dream and started going by loa instead of Wild God. Maybe he found Trolls / some form of Trolls / Troll ancestor race elsewhere and was dubbed as loa and it's a hint, like the leak suggests with the Troll / Elf common ancestor.

I don't think anything about Q'onzu was present on the PTR back in July, but I could be wrong.

There are other things that Wowhead has dug up that might be relevant, like the "Sentinel of the New Moon".

There's a theory that Q'onzu could be related to Lo'sho - the second moon. A secondary moon god for a secondary moon.
Q'onzu might identify as a loa simply because they are ancient enough that their worshippers were trolls. Q'onzu also may have dug out of the Dream. If they dug out, maybe they came out in Avaloren.

[Sondrelk]

I honestly also feel like they've arrived at a point where WoW has two different demographics. Those who want this retail hype train to keep going and see where it takes us (plus addicted to their collections, friend groups, etc), and those who just want traditional Warcraft content.

Like Ion said in that interview: woopsie, we kinda used all the old content and now we're stuck in a corner (paraphrasing).

In other words, it's now worth splitting up the playerbase, because they can better cater to each segment by doing so. The alternative is alienating one of them, and losing a bunch of subs once Classic hype subsides.

Let there be "World of Warcraft" for those who just want orcs and human smashing skulls in Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms, and "World of Warcraft: Whatever's Next" for those who want to keep moving towards cosmic lore and what not.

That's a bit reductive. There are two distinct halves of the playerbase in terms of what they want, but it's hardly two homogenous masses.
One side wants out there rule of cool stuff like K'aresh. The other wants generally more grounded stuff with focus on characters.
The problem is that you cannot simultaneously cater to both unless you go all the way and develop two sets of expansions concurrently.

Currently they are seemingly going to try to replicate Legion which was a nice compromise. You start with a solid foundation of basic stuff, and then slowly escalate until you have the out there stuff by the end.

[Magistrate]

Real life history?

I'm not fully disagreeing with your thoughts here but there is a certain point when the amount of retconning to surface level and then foundational elements becomes so extensive, and then begins to happen so frequently, that it is difficult for me to become attached to any new story elements, or to want to discuss them.

I don't want to necessarily derail this further, but something that really bothers me is how homogenized the schools of magic have become. It seems like any element or force can have some analogue of resurrection.

I really want the next expansion to be a sort of "let's just hold on a moment and figure out what we're doing here narratively because this is just a bunch of cats running in every direction."

[Ferlion]

I don't think anything about Q'onzu was present on the PTR back in July, but I could be wrong.

There are other things that Wowhead has dug up that might be relevant, like the "Sentinel of the New Moon".

There's a theory that Q'onzu could be related to Lo'sho - the second moon. A secondary moon god for a secondary moon.
Q'onzu might identify as a loa simply because they are ancient enough that their worshippers were trolls. Q'onzu also may have dug out of the Dream. If they dug out, maybe they came out in Avaloren.

I kind of assume that it's just a lucky guess.

"Moon Loa" makes it sound like they are really just worshipping Elune, but non-deep Lore folks wouldn't really know the Trolls don't consider Elune a Loa.

- - - Updated - - -

Let's get this conversation back on track. Where does the story go from here (can be 10.2, 10.2+, or 11.0/11.0+)?

I'm leaning more and more towards Amirdrassil starting the events of a World revamp.

And, well. It also poses an interesting moment where we see the Forces of Life get a solid grip on Azeroth in a way that isn't ordered by the Titans. It could have some pretty neat implications. Maybe the world revamp sets us up for the next continent. Maybe something happens when the Tree shifts into Azeroth and rejuvenates the planet, and it clears Titan safeguards. Like, say, storms keeping people out of a certain area.

[Nathanyel]

that leak reminds me of the original expansion leak list anytime I see K'aresh mentioned.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards...craft/72430500

Originally posted on Allakhazam, that was the first well-crafted fake "leak", with the bonus that it didn't predict a soon-to-be-announced expansion, but instead claimed to be an early expansion progression outline, coming out just after the WotLK announcement so it could retroactively 'predict' BC and WotLK "before changes" (but weirdly included the two starting zones of Northrend, which was a lesson learned from the BC launch)
I actually participated in debunking this, on MMO-C and over there (page six, search for "arguments") and younger me liked to believe I contributed to Reinjin eventually admitting it was fake, a while after Cata was announced, I think.

But it already had all the necessary elements, a mix of educated guesses and what players wanted to see, and people ignoring the obvious hints that it was fake because they liked it.
And since it was written in a way that future expansions would not naturally debunk it ("plans have changed over the years") it was very persistent even after being officially debunked.
Some would swear they had seen that list during Vanilla already, which led to me researching (read: perusing 2-3 articles on) how memory can be very subjective, see the Mandela Effect, and I recall an example of how Reagan told a scene from a movie (not even one he acted in) as his own WW2 memory.

[ercarp]

Am I the only one here who's more or less completely in the dark about the storyline of Dragonflight?

I didn't even know who Iridikron was until earlier today. I had to look it up.

I'm super excited for 11.0 but I haven't had much interest in keeping up with the overarching story of Dragonflight. I did the quests for all of the zones in 10.0 and I enjoyed them, but past that, I have no idea what's going on.

[Merryck]

I kind of assume that it's just a lucky guess.

"Moon Loa" makes it sound like they are really just worshipping Elune, but non-deep Lore folks wouldn't really know the Trolls don't consider Elune a Loa.

- - - Updated - - -



I'm leaning more and more towards Amirdrassil starting the events of a World revamp.

And, well. It also poses an interesting moment where we see the Forces of Life get a solid grip on Azeroth in a way that isn't ordered by the Titans. It could have some pretty neat implications. Maybe the world revamp sets us up for the next continent. Maybe something happens when the Tree shifts into Azeroth and rejuvenates the planet, and it clears Titan safeguards. Like, say, storms keeping people out of a certain area.

You don't want the forces of life taking over Azeroth. That's how you get super Botani.

[GhostFish]

I kind of assume that it's just a lucky guess.

"Moon Loa" makes it sound like they are really just worshipping Elune, but non-deep Lore folks wouldn't really know the Trolls don't consider Elune a Loa.

There are the Lun'alai.

[Merryck]

Am I the only one here who's more or less completely in the dark about the storyline of Dragonflight?

I didn't even know who Iridikron was until earlier today. I had to look it up.

I'm super excited for 11.0 but I haven't had much interest in keeping up with the overarching story of Dragonflight. I did the quests for all of the zones in 10.0 and I enjoyed them, but past that, I have no idea what's going on.

Most of the story is hidden behind side quests, like the Tyr stuff.

[Azalar]

You don't want the forces of life taking over Azeroth. That's how you get super Botani.

We'd get lifeforce if we let the Titans in too, according to Soridormi.

[Reive]

they need to get rid of this "unreliable narrator" crap. there is no worldbuilding if they can pull this shit whenever they want.

[Merryck]

We'd get lifeforce if we let the Titans in too, according to Soridormi.

I forgot about that ... Really strange.

[Azalar]

I forgot about that ... Really strange.

Not entirely strange if you bring Elune and Eonar into the equation and Freya doing Eonar's work on her behalf while Aman'thul isn't watching.

[Ferlion]

There are the Lun'alai.

The Lun'alai are exactly my point. Talk to them and they say it themselves. What they worship isn't a Loa

[Magistrate]

they need to get rid of this "unreliable narrator" crap. there is no worldbuilding if they can pull this shit whenever they want.

Yes this 100%.

I would get pulling this once as a major lore overhaul but it keeps happening.

Plus I will forever be a little upset that Chronicle was sold to us as reliable lore and then 2 books later it's all Titan propaganda, the writing style changed dramatically to reinforce this, and they retroactively said it was true of the rest. I was so hyped for them and bought all of the first ones and then they basically said none of it could be used to support any lore theorizing. Such a let down.