The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Cheezits]

I think Keeper Civil War is in the cards for 11.0 but they will definitely have some that side with us. I think Thorim is a safe bet as a friend.

[PotHockets]

Okay; I'll make it clear and help you understand

What is a tank's role? To Tank
What is a healer's role? To heal
What is a DPS' role? To deal damage

That's everything covered; so what is the need for a support? Is it to help people survive? Why can't the healer do that? Is it to make people do more damage? Why can't the DPS just to tuned to deal that extra damage anyway?

The reason I'm agaist support as a spec is because in WoW; every spec is a support spec - a DPS doesn't only do damage in WoW, an elemental shaman has tremor totem, a feral druid has stampeding roar, a warrior has rallying cry

Why do we need support specs when historically almost every spec has been designed to support their group in certain niche situations?

Now; knowing Blizzard as we do - if they do move forward with support specs, they aren't going to give something for nothing - other specs will lose things to justify the existence and necessity of a support in your group

My whole point stems from the fact the game has been more than fine for 15 years without support specs; if they add them randomly - well blizzard aren't just going to make every player in the game more powerful without them losing something in the process

If they do add support as a 4th spec in 11.0; mark my words - in a years time we will have QQ threads of X class being mad why Y ability was made support exlusive, in a ideal world of good class design, there would be no need for a support spec

There's no need for any of this. The whole point is fun and support gives a whole group of players something enjoyable and fun. I dont get the appeal but hey good news is I dont have to play it.

[Ashapls]

Is that a DWARF riding the white dragon???

they are rubbing our faces in it.

[D4NNYB0Y]

I don't; but you're missing the point

The more resources they dedicate to support specs; the less resources dedicated to the classic triumvirate of specs that actually fit WoW

The game is 20 years old. I'm thrilled they're finally taking risks and making a major change like this. They are not going to limit Support to one spec. It will have several specs to ensure group compositions do not require an Aug Evoker.

I can empathize that you don't like the role's addition to the game, but as someone who loves playing support but doesn't particularly enjoy healing I can't wait to see what they do with it. Really hoping for a Warlord style support Warrior, a ranged support Paladin, a shield-based support Mage, or a support Rogue.

[Merryck]

Danuser can't make me hate the Titans nor Tyr for giving the dragons better style

[PotHockets]

I think Keeper Civil War is in the cards for 11.0 but they will definitely have some that side with us. I think Thorim is a safe bet as a friend.

Thorim is a bro he'd definitely be on our side, probably Freya too. I would have thought Tyr would be the one Keeper to always have our backs but he's sus af and I dont trust him.

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Danuser can't make me hate the Titans nor Tyr for giving the dragons better style

Danuser wasn't in charge during Legion when Odyn made it painfully obvious that the Titans and Keepers are not benevolent in any way shape or form and their prerogative does not include givng a shit about the mortal races.

[Myrrh]

"if able"
translates to
"when i am done photoshopping my AI result.

Yeah, I can't imagine this guy has ongoing access to stuff. Not that they were particularly believable anyway, but kinda tipped their hand here.

I think the direction this thread is taking is good, because any employee that reads this will end up leaking something just to stop people from tearing each other apart.

Maybe if there are no credible leaks, it's time to speculate and scheme on a possible leak itself rather than the content.
My bet is someone is going to order starbucks with the new expansion name, instead of writing it on the cup the barista will write it on blizzardwatch.

I must be losing my goddamn mind, because I visualised this as a barista inscribing the leak directly onto the flesh of a very confused blizzardwatch contributor who just wanted to order their pumpkin spice latte.

[Hitei]

Well I genuinely gave you my point of view in good faith but you're going to be obtuse because you have no real argument; you know very well what point I'm making here

Pointing out the very obvious flaw in your logic is being obtuse?

You tried to argue that support isn't necessary because you can tune other roles to just do more. I pointed out to you that none of the roles are necessary because you can tune all of them out of existence. Your point was never valid. Sorry, did you want me to just nod along and pretend your line of reasoning wasn't fundamentally flawed?

The game hasn't gone 15 years without support specs, because several of the game's specs were support heavy DPS in early expansions. You can pretend otherwise, but spriests were still there, doing lore DPS than regular DPS but pouring out mana to healers and other casters and low consistent healing. Shamans were still there buffing other, better melee DPS to do even more damage. Rets were still there salving so that warlocks could go all out with lower risk of pulling aggro.

Support is a long-standing role in RPGs and games in general, and has a history in this game.

[Zers Editor]

I would have thought Tyr would be the one Keeper to always have our backs but he's sus af and I dont trust him.

Algalon 2.0.

[Baraden]

The game is 20 years old. I'm thrilled they're finally taking risks and making a major change like this. They are not going to limit Support to one spec. It will have several specs to ensure group compositions do not require an Aug Evoker.

I can empathize that you don't like the role's addition to the game, but as someone who loves playing support but doesn't particularly enjoy healing I can't wait to see what they do with it. Really hoping for a Warlord style support Warrior, a ranged support Paladin, a shield-based support Mage, or a support Rogue.

It's not even that I don't like it - I just don't trust blizzard to add a 4th spec type without taking something away from the other three

It's not like I'm suggesting more choice is bad; I just think every class and spec should be a support spec in the sense every class that enhance their group in some way beyond doing their core role

Put it this way; let's say they add support specs - are they going to let DPS keep abilities that traditionally are used to support their group? Rallying Cry, Tremor Tomem, Vampiric Embrace etc? I really don't trust Blizzard would be that charitable

[Merryck]

Thorim is a bro he'd definitely be on our side, probably Freya too. I would have thought Tyr would be the one Keeper to always have our backs but he's sus af and I dont trust him.

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Danuser wasn't in charge during Legion when Odyn made it painfully obvious that the Titans and Keepers are not benevolent in any way shape or form and their prerogative does not include givng a shit about the mortal races.

It was the Titans mission to protect mortal life in the universe as written in Chronicles before Danuser destroyed the credibility of that book. They were explicitly benevolent.

[PotHockets]

It's not even that I don't like it - I just don't trust blizzard to add a 4th spec type without taking something away from the other three

It's not like I'm suggesting more choice is bad; I just think every class and spec should be a support spec in the sense every class that enhance their group in some way beyond doing their core role

Put it this way; let's say they add support specs - are they going to let DPS keep abilities that traditionally are used to support their group? Rallying Cry, Tremor Tomem, Vampiric Embrace etc? I really don't trust Blizzard would be that charitable

You're really bad at describing your argument but now I get what you're trying to get across. I get the concern for it but I think Blizzard has learned their lesson after Locks losing meta and Survival(which I liked). They've been adamant that no current specs will be changed to support.

If it had been a big banner feature of an expansion as opposed to something they clearly want to take the time to get right then I could see the argument but nothing indicates that your worry is going to come close to reality.

Besides all of those abilities you're describing are class talents not spec talents and would already be available for every spec of a class.

[Baraden]

Pointing out the very obvious flaw in your logic is being obtuse?

You tried to argue that support isn't necessary because you can tune other roles to just do more. I pointed out to you that none of the roles are necessary because you can tune all of them out of existence. Your point was never valid. Sorry, did you want me to just nod along and pretend your line of reasoning wasn't fundamentally flawed?

The game hasn't gone 15 years without support specs, because several of the game's specs were support heavy DPS in early expansions. You can pretend otherwise, but spriests were still there, doing lore DPS than regular DPS but pouring out mana to healers and other casters and low consistent healing. Shamans were still there buffing other, better melee DPS to do even more damage. Rets were still there salving so that warlocks could go all out with lower risk of pulling aggro.

Support is a long-standing role in RPGs and games in general, and has a history in this game.

Because when you have an encounter there are 3 jobs, one person has to take the damage, one person has to heal the damage, and one person has to deal the damage

A support only exists to enhance the characters doing those jobs; so why not just have those characters be able to support themselves and their group?

Your examples with spriest and shamans actually prove my point - because Blizzard didn't give the game support specs and instead allowed the other roles to support their group - why do you need a specific support spec if every class can be a support spec? I've already given examples but right now every spec in the game has the potential to give other players either more damage, health, speed, heals etc - that's support

What's going to happen to all the support abilties other roles have if they add these specs?

[PotHockets]

It was the Titans mission to protect mortal life in the universe as written in Chronicles before Danuser destroyed the credibility of that book. They were explicitly benevolent.

Times Change - Roided Out Orc Guy

[Ateo]

I don't think everything can be contributed to Blizzard bad. My job is WFH and my company wanted to do a little get together, even with free food, drinks and games. They had to beg people to attend when previously everyone would have jumped at the chance to not work for the day and get free food and drinks.

We live in a much different world post pandemic.

While very true, this isn't a work sponsored outing and isn't comparable. This was nerd mecca to many people around the world. We can't keep blaming COVID and remote work for everything when something flops.

It simply is blizzard has lost the core fanbase, if this doesn't prove it idk what will. There has never been a year where blizzcon didn't sell out... Until this year.

It isn't covid, it isn't the economy, it's blizzards actions that pushed away their fanbase. If it was truly the economy musicians wouldn't be instantly selling out arenas around the world, but yet here we are seeing blizzcon dying before our eyes.

Blizzard and in turn Blizzcon has lost the wind in its sails. Plain and simple.

People can cope. People can make excuses. But eventually people need to just see the cold hard facts.

-Overwatch is failing in real time
-Retail wow has now had not one but 3 massive flops for expansions in a row and the franchise is being carried purely by nostalgia with WoW classic and now wow hardcore.
-StarCraft is completely dead.
-Wc3 reforged was a massive flop due to development hell and blatant misleading lies from blizzard on what it was going to be(I played the demo at Blizzcon when it was announced and pre-ordered it during the announcement while I sat at main stage, we did not receive what was announced period.)
-Hearthstone is a greedy monetization hell hole that's struggling to stay afloat.
-D2 Remaster has significantly more players than Diablo 4 a game that had what 10 years of hype behind it? The true money maker for the Diablo franchise is Diablo immortal a mobile cash grab game carried by the eastern market.
-HoTS is absolutely flatlined.
-We have another bullshit mobile game cash grab leeching off the Warcraft fanbase coming out as "warcraft rumble"

This is the definition of a company failing to hit the mark and keep its core fanbase happy. Blizzcon for well over a decade was THE premier gaming con. It was more than a trade show to many, but now it's fallen really hard.

We as fans need to be vocal and hopefully Blizzard will open their eyes and fix this shit while they still can, or we can remain silent and sit here in continuously shrinking echo chambers of denial and they will eventually go the route of many other giants who no one can remember.

[Hitei]

It was the Titans mission to protect mortal life in the universe as written in Chronicles before Danuser destroyed the credibility of that book. They were explicitly benevolent.

Too bad Wrath made it really obvious they weren't benevolent.

-snip-

I don't... Do you people think that's the EoA link?

[Catastrophy349]

Things are beginning to get juicy

[ercarp]

So now we have aspects for

White dragons
Black dragons
Red dragons
Yellow dragons
Green dragons
Blue dragons

We still need a pink dragonflight to complete the power rangers color scheme.

What do you mean by this? There's no white dragonflight as far as I know.

[Baraden]

You're really bad at describing your argument but now I get what you're trying to get across. I get the concern for it but I think Blizzard has learned their lesson after Locks losing meta and Survival(which I liked). They've been adamant that no current specs will be changed to support.

If it had been a big banner feature of an expansion as opposed to something they clearly want to take the time to get right then I could see the argument but nothing indicates that your worry is going to come close to reality.

Besides all of those abilities you're describing are class talents not spec talents and would already be available for every spec of a class.

You can't insult me in the first line and expect me to read on; sorry

[PotHockets]

Things are beginning to get juicy

Looks like things are gettin a little spicy for the pepper