The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[huth]

Sounds more like further confirmation of a future third spec.

It's literally "there's a chance they get more options later".

It's not a confirmation of anything.

Though it's very obviously aimed at classes. Evokers don't really use weapons and Frostbolt is an iconic Mage spell.

[Teriz]

It's literally "there's a chance they get more options later".

It's not a confirmation of anything.

Though it's very obviously aimed at classes. Evokers don't really use weapons and Frostbolt is an iconic Mage spell.

Evokers can equip 1h and 2h Axes, Swords, and Maces. Being able to use 2h weapons is weird for a caster class. Perfectly possible for the third spec to use 2h weapons.

I also took Ion’s meaning of “frostbolt” to be similar to “fireball” in that it’s a generic term for an frost magic projectile. The Blue Dragonflight is capable of utilizing frost-based magic.

[Raetary]

Evokers can equip 1h and 2h Axes, Swords, and Maces. Being able to use 2h weapons is weird for a caster class. Perfectly possible for the third spec to use 2h weapons.

I also took Ion’s meaning of “frostbolt” to be similar to “fireball” in that it’s a generic term for an frost magic projectile. The Blue Dragonflight is capable of utilizing frost-based magic.

Ion's statement was in the context of a question about future race/class combos.
Here's the full summary:

Class Race Combos

They want to make sure there are narrative reasons for races to become classes. But gameplay-wise they are trying to open up more race-class combos, after they take story for narrative continuity.

There is a high likelyhood down the line that Dracthyr can wield weapons and cast Frostbolts.

So no, it's not about a third fucking spec.

[Teriz]

Ion's statement was in the context of a question about future race/class combos.
Here's the full summary:


So no, it's not about a third fucking spec.

Which doesn’t really mean anything. If there is a third spec that does that, and someone asks him about his comments above, he’ll simply point to the third spec and say “ there you go!” Because it’s doing exactly what he described.

There’s WAY too many technical issues for Dracthyr to get more classes. People are complaining about transmog now on Evokers. Imagine Dracthyr Warriors dealing with shield, armor, or weapon clipping. Dracthyr can’t wear cloaks outside of Visage form for a reason.

Dracthyr getting more classes is one of those things you think you want, but you really don’t.

[huth]

Evokers can equip 1h and 2h Axes, Swords, and Maces. Being able to use 2h weapons is weird for a caster class. Perfectly possible for the third spec to use 2h weapons.

I also took Ion’s meaning of “frostbolt” to be similar to “fireball” in that it’s a generic term for an frost magic projectile. The Blue Dragonflight is capable of utilizing frost-based magic.

Can equip. But still don't use. They just hit stuff with their claws.

And no, that's not a valid interpretation. That's like trying to argue "nuclear submarine" could refer to an atom below a ship.

[Raetary]

Which doesn’t really mean anything.

Nope, sorry but that context means everything.

He was asked a question about future race class combos and he gave his answer, which can be summed up as "Yes, just not right now".
You being completely incapable of understanding that simple interaction, does not make it mean anything else.

Imagine Dracthyr Warriors dealing with shield, armor, or weapon clipping.

I don't have to imagine it, i can just open the wowhead dressing room or the in-game dressing room, preview a Dracthyr with a shield and any weapon 1h and then select an animation.

Turns out they already got all the animations that they need, and there are no clipping issues whatsoever.

People are complaining about transmog now on Evokers.
Dracthyr can’t wear cloaks outside of Visage form for a reason.

Yes, and people are going to continue to complain about it regardless, as that's an issue with their model design.
That does not, however, prevent them from gaining access to other classes, it's completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Dracthyr getting more classes is one of those things you think you want, but you really don’t.

[Nightshade711]

Which doesn’t really mean anything. If there is a third spec that does that, and someone asks him about his comments above, he’ll simply point to the third spec and say “ there you go!” Because it’s doing exactly what he described.

You’re delusional if you genuinely think that him saying Dracthyr will/could get more classes down the line means Evoker is getting a third spec.

Besides, they’ve even started adding the animations for other classes already. On the PTR Dracthyr are now rigged for Mage, Priest, Warlock, and Paladin animations.
(And previously they’ve already had most of not all all the animations for Rogue, Warrior, and Hunter.)

There’s WAY too many technical issues for Dracthyr to get more classes. People are complaining about transmog now on Evokers.

Blizzard put themselves in a position where they now have several extra years to work on rigging proper armor to Dracthyr.
Maybe they wanted the extra time to fine tune the rigging and make it not look so bad.
It’s not an impossible task.

Imagine Dracthyr Warriors dealing with shield, armor, or weapon clipping.

If only blizzard thought of this and made it so 2H weapons and anything that goes on your back like some offhands are hidden in Dracthyr form.
Oh wait it’s already a thing.

[Teriz]

Can equip. But still don't use. They just hit stuff with their claws.

Which is my point; we have images of Emberthal, an Evoker, using a polearm/halberd. The third spec is based on Emberthal and whatever she could do before they went into stasis. Seems rather cut and dry.

And no, that's not a valid interpretation. That's like trying to argue "nuclear submarine" could refer to an atom below a ship.

If you take what he’s saying literally, sure. However, he could be saying that you’re going to see Dracthyr wielding weapons and tossing around frost bolts, just not in the way you think.

Because as it stands now, the only playable Dracthyr are Evokers.

- - - Updated - - -

Nope, sorry but that context means everything.

He was asked a question about future race class combos and he gave his answer, which can be summed up as "Yes, just not right now".
You being completely incapable of understanding that simple interaction, does not make it mean anything else.

Again, him saying that Dracthyr wielding weapons and using frostbolt =\= Dracthyr are getting more classes. Especially when the Evoker class is highly likely to get those attributes in the very near future.

I don't have to imagine it, i can just open the wowhead dressing room or the in-game dressing room, preview a Dracthyr with a shield and any weapon 1h and then select an animation.

Turns out they already got all the animations that they need, and there are no clipping issues whatsoever.

Where’s the image of the shield sheathed to the back? Also how is visage form going to work in other classes? Will you stay in visage form regardless of ability, or do you switch into dracthyr form based on what ability you do?

Yes, and people are going to continue to complain about it regardless, as that's an issue with their model design.
That does not, however, prevent them from gaining access to other classes, it's completely irrelevant to the discussion.

I believe it does, since it’s going to be a consistent ask and technical issue thar Blizzard will have to deal with if they do this. If they don’t do it, they won’t have the headache.

- - - Updated - - -

You’re delusional if you genuinely think that him saying Dracthyr will/could get more classes down the line means Evoker is getting a third spec.

You're delusional if you think he actually meant that, and wasn't engaging in typical Blizzard dev doublespeak.

Blizzard put themselves in a position where they now have several extra years to work on rigging proper armor to Dracthyr.
Maybe they wanted the extra time to fine tune the rigging and make it not look so bad.
It’s not an impossible task.

You're not going to fix the issue unless you redo every piece of WoW armor in 3D. They're not going to do that just so 1% of the WoW population can play as a Dracthyr Warrior or Rogue.

If only blizzard thought of this and made it so 2H weapons and anything that goes on your back like some offhands are hidden in Dracthyr form.
Oh wait it’s already a thing.

Yeah, because if there's one thing warriors like is not being able to see their armor and not being able to see weapons sheathed on their back. You honestly believe that a Warrior player is going to enjoy playing a half naked dracthyr whose weapons magically pop out of their hands every time they attack?

[Makorus]

Sounds more like further confirmation of a future third spec.

No.

It means that Dracthyr will get normal classes. Like Mages. You know, the class with Frostbolt.

We have an interview with Ion saying

Now as they emerge in Azeroth and integrate with the Alliance and Horde over time, could they learn to pick up an axe and be a great warrior, quite possibly, but that's not where their story is starting in Dragonflight.

In a different interview, he says

Now as they emerge from that stasis as they integrate into societies that join the Alliance and the Horde and spread throughout the world, could they come to learn how to practice some of the arts of other classes? Is there anything stopping them from learning how to pick up a sword and hit you with it? Not necessarily. That's not where we our story is starting. But it's definitely a space that's open to explore nonetheless.

Then we have a recent interview saying

There is a high likelyhood down the line that Dracthyr can wield weapons and cast Frostbolts.

We also have the developers working on adding the other class animations to Dracthyr.

I dunno how you can take that and twist it into "3rd spec". I highly doubt your Earth-based tank fanfiction spec is gonna cast Frostbolts.

[Nightshade711]

You're delusional if you think he actually meant that, and wasn't engaging in typical Blizzard dev doublespeak.

They also previously specifically said they could “learn how to bladestorm”.
Unless they’re going to make an Evoker spec that involves fighting in Melee/bladestorming and throwing frostbolts… ion’s very clearly talking about warrior/mage.

Which makes sense given how Dracthyr are now rigged with all warrior and mage animations. (As well as Rogue, Paladin, Warlock, Hunter and Priest.)

You're not going to fix the issue unless you redo every piece of WoW armor in 3D. They're not going to do that just so 1% of the WoW population can play as a Dracthyr Warrior or Rogue.

Clearly you don’t know how armor rigging/design works in WoW.
They didn’t have to go and redo every single piece of WoW armor in 3D for Kul Tirans, who were using a new skeleton/rig. And if they did, then clearly it’s a pretty easy task.

Besides, Dracthyr would at a minimum retain their barber shop armor.
Maybe blizzard could add some new barber shop options for plate/leather/cloth wearers if they don’t want to put in the work to rig transmog armor.

Yeah, because if there's one thing warriors like is not being able to see their armor and not being able to see weapons sheathed on their back.
You honestly believe that a Warrior player is going to enjoy playing a half naked dracthyr whose weapons magically pop out of their hands every time they attack?

Almost as if someone who decides to play a Dracthyr warrior would be well aware of the fact that their weapons can be hidden.

[Teriz]

I dunno how you can take that and twist it into "3rd spec". I highly doubt your Earth-based tank fanfiction spec is gonna cast Frostbolts.

Because a third spec solves those asks without the technical issues that would dog Blizzard for years.

Giving Dracthyr to other classes sounds great, until you really think about the myriad problems associated with it.

Also it should be noted that there's plenty of things Blizzard has "thought about doing" that never come to fruition.

- - - Updated - - -

Unless they’re going to make an Evoker spec that involves fighting in Melee/bladestorming and throwing frostbolts… ion’s very clearly talking about warrior/mage.

It's quite possible.

Clearly you don’t know how armor rigging/design works in WoW.
They didn’t have to go and redo every single piece of WoW armor in 3D for Kul Tirans, who were using a new skeleton/rig. And if they did, then clearly it’s a pretty easy task.

Besides, Dracthyr would at a minimum retain their barber shop armor.
Maybe blizzard could add some new barber shop options for plate/leather/cloth wearers if they don’t want to put in the work to rig transmog armor.

So you're saying that Blizzard is going to make ANOTHER Dracthyr skeleton in place of the current one just so that they can play other classes? Why didn't they do that in the first place if giving them other classes was their future goal?

As for Barbershop options in the place of transmog armor, again we have wide community complaints now JUST on Evokers. Imagine other classes complaining about not being able to see their precious looted armor in Dracthyr form.

Almost as if someone who decides to play a Dracthyr warrior would be well aware of the fact that their weapons can be hidden.

C'mon now. We both know that's not how your typical WoW player thinks. The first day this goes live there will be 100 posts on the official forums asking why they can't see their sheathed weapons on their Dracthyr warrior.

[Nymrohd]

Can you not derail every thread with your obsessions?

[Nightshade711]

It's quite possible.

Looks like a bunch of warriors to me.

So you're saying that Blizzard is going to make ANOTHER Dracthyr skeleton in place of the current one just so that they can play other classes? Why didn't they do that in the first place if giving them other classes was their future goal?

Nobody ever said they’d make a new skeleton for Dracthyr.
There’s nothing with the current model that makes it impossible to rig armor to.

As for Barbershop options in the place of transmog armor, again we have wide community complaints now JUST on Evokers. Imagine other classes complaining about not being able to see their precious looted armor in Dracthyr form.

Then it sounds like the perfect fix is to rig armor to Dracthyr. Which they’re probably planning on doing when they add new classes.

[Teriz]

Can you not derail every thread with your obsessions?

I simply said one throw away line and a group of posters swarmed me with their desire for a Dracthyr class. I'm merely responding to the swarm.

- - - Updated - - -

Looks like a bunch of warriors to me.

Emberthal isn't a warrior.

Nobody ever said they’d make a new skeleton for Dracthyr.
There’s nothing with the current model that makes it impossible to rig armor to.

Except those massive wings which prevent proper weapon/shield sheathing, and cloaks. Along with the dracthyr head which causes massive clipping issues with helmets.

Then it sounds like the perfect fix is to rig armor to Dracthyr. Which they’re probably planning on doing when they add new classes.

Are they going to rig old armor to dracthyr as well? What about weapons? Again I highly doubt you're going to get a ton of warrior players feeling immersed in their character when their weapons appear out of nowhere every time they enter combat.

[Makabreska]

I simply said one throw away line and a group of posters swarmed me with their desire for a Dracthyr class. I'm merely responding to the swarm.

And you can like, you know, simply stop responding. But you never choose to.

[Nightshade711]

Emberthal isn't a warrior.

And those Dracthyr aren’t Evokers.

Except those massive wings which prevent proper weapon/shield sheathing, and cloaks. Along with the dracthyr head which causes massive clipping issues with helmets.

Weapons/shields will be hidden as said.
Helmets are a nonissue. If Tauren and Worgen can wear helmets, so can Dracthyr.

Are they going to rig old armor to dracthyr as well? What about weapons? Again I highly doubt you're going to get a ton of warrior players feeling immersed in their character when their weapons appear out of nowhere every time they enter combat.

Weapons are already rigged, especially ones arms/fury warriors would use, so I fail to see the point you’re trying to make there.

And again, you know nothing about how armor rigging works for new races.
They didn’t have to manually go and rig every piece of armor for Kul Tirans and they don’t have any clipping issues.

[Teriz]

And you can like, you know, simply stop responding. But you never choose to.

I never said I had a problem with being swarmed. I simply don't like being blamed for a topic derail when 5 posters are responding to one little throw away remark about the possibility of non-Evoker Dracthyr classes.

[Makabreska]

I never said I had a problem with being swarmed. I simply don't like being blamed for a topic derail when 5 posters are responding to one little throw away remark about the possibility of non-Evoker Dracthyr classes.

But you can still stop this derailment at any moment.

[Teriz]

And those Dracthyr aren’t Evokers.

Emberthal is, and she's standing there holding a bladed weapon.

Weapons/shields will be hidden as said.
Helmets are a nonissue. If Tauren and Worgen can wear helmets, so can Dracthyr.

If they're a non-issue, why can't Dracthyr wear standard helmets currently?

Weapons are already rigged, especially ones arms/fury warriors would use, so I fail to see the point you’re trying to make there.

In the model viewer, have the Dracthyr dual wield 2h weapons, and then have them sheathe. Enjoy the hilarity that ensues.

And again, you know nothing about how armor rigging works for new races.
They didn’t have to manually go and rig every piece of armor for Kul Tirans and they don’t have any clipping issues.

Because they designed Kul Tirans to be different classes. They never designed Dracthyr for that purpose. Which is why you continuously ignore the issue with Visage forms and how they work with non-Evoker classes, since Visage forms were designed with Evoker and Evoker-only in mind.

Also please don't bring up animations being present as proof. Goblins and Worgen had Monk animations for 11 years and they didn't get Monks until a month ago. And that's with NO technical issues involved.

- - - Updated - - -

But you can still stop this derailment at any moment.

Okie dokie.

I'll let them have the last word.

[huth]

I never said I had a problem with being swarmed. I simply don't like being blamed for a topic derail when 5 posters are responding to one little throw away remark about the possibility of non-Evoker Dracthyr classes.

You don't seem to have a problem with brainlessly defending a completely absurd position, either. Your argumentation is literally Flat-Earther level blatant ignorance of any proper rules of logic and discussions and twisting of facts with no regard of how completely unworkable your interpretation is.