The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Varodoc]

Oh absolutely. The Jailer was so bad even Taliesin spoke highly of Final Fantasy XIV in his Shadowlands vids. And Denathrius was actually popular despite having no interesting motivation besides power-hungry baddy, cause he was a charismatic vampire lord.
Zovaal looked, sounded, and acted boring and we only got a reason to care about his diabolical plan in the very last patch when it turned out it will involve Azeroth's World Soul somehow.

It was a disaster. Granted the patch cadence did not help either.

Thing is, I don't find the incarnates all that interesting either. I don't fucking care what iridikron wants to do. Knaifu? Yes. Azshara? Yes. Denathrius? Also yes. Alternate Universe Illidan who became the Lich King? Yes. Expansion 2 of Stone Dragon I don't care about trying to punish the Titans I also don't care about? I'll pass.

Iridrikon was not created to be a popular or beloved villain. Iridrikon was created as a mere means to an end, a catalyst to bring back Azshara, Xal'atath, and the Void in general.

In a way, he is exactly like AU Gul'dan. AU Gul'dan wasn't created to be popular or beloved villain, he was created as a catalyst to bring Legion back to Azeroth. That he also became popular and beloved was a side bonus, but not the main objective of the writers.

Come the Legion expansion, and Gul'dan disappears after the prologue and gets killed in the first act of the expansion. He was just a tool, a plot device, and the writers discarded him once he fullfilled his purpose (bringing back the Legion).

Iridrikon's sole purpose is to facilitate the return of the Void storyline. He has dealings with the Void and is a puppet of the Old Gods, so he will be used to bring forth the Void expansion and then discarded (aka unceremoniously killed early on in a raid like AU Gul'dan).

If you like Azshara or Xal'atath, then you should be hyped for what Iridrikon does next, because the sole meaning behind his existence is to usher in the Void storyline. Just like the sole meaning behind AU Gul'dan's existence was to usher in the return of the Legion storyline.

[Sondrelk]

I mean, we know it is real, it being for the 11.0 preorder, while I think is likely, is technically conjecture still. Never treat datamining as 100% confirmed.

I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.

[Xilurm]

Dude is shill and why no one cares, plays for Dragonflight.

Bruh stop trying to incite an argument.

[caliphax]

I think when people ask what is the reason to visit Avaloren they mean not "What is the plot reason?" but rather "Why would players want to do that?".
After all throught the plot Blizzard always gave us the kickstart at the pre-patch, but in previous cases besides the plot there was already established interest in visiting new place. People were fine to visit Dragon Isles because they always wanted to visit it.
The only exception is Pandaria, but i tell you what - since the pandaria avaloren is my least hyped place where i wanted to be.
I remember back in 2010-2011 when the Pandaria rumours appeared i as well as many other people on forums didnt want to believe that and thought thats the joke.
And i skipped the whole expansion, coming back only in WoD.
Avaloren just isnt good place for 11.0. It needs more than just a book to make people (non hardcore lorekeepers) at least interested in visiting it.

I think for me at least, the draw to Avaloren is not neccessarily the continent/island/whatever itself, rather the mystery of what is on the other side of Azeroth. It's something that's been debated and discussed for ages. It could literally be any type of continent there and I'd be interested to see what it's like.

[Hitei]

I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.

I believe Marlamin's point was less "it could be fake" and more that anything datamined has the chance to be changed, be already outdated, be a bug or mislabeled, etc.

[Marlamin]

I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.

Yeah, I don't think it's fake but that is technically possible, but we'd still be able to confirm it with pre-hotfixed data so nothing really changes there.

I do think it is possible they will use that strategy going forward though as their systems have been bad at keeping secrets for a while now, similar to when they named mount model filenames as encrypted<number>.m2 so dataminers wouldn't know what they were if the names leaked, not an issue now filenames are gone, but definitely a leaky issue at the time.

I believe Marlamin's point was less "it could be fake" and more that anything datamined has the chance to be changed, be already outdated, be a bug or mislabeled, etc.

My point is that most of what datamining generally misses is context and we have incredibly little context for this mount in particular. The "Heroic Edition:" part obviously means it'll be in a preorder package, but technically speaking, however stupidly remote, there's no guarantee that is for mainline WoW. I think it obviously is for mainline WoW, but as long as it is not public/announced, I like treating things as not 100% confirmed however likely they may be.

[Teriz]

This really needs a source. You keep spouting it, but there is no basis for it.

During an interview with Game Front, Lead Quest Designer Dave Kosak, who also was on the panel with Metzen, echoed the sentiments that Mists of Pandaria may seem more light-hearted, but it's just as important to the overall WoW experience as the previous expansion sets. Kosak also said that a playable pandaren race is “by far” the most asked-for World of Warcraft feature among fans.[28]

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/His...en_in_Warcraft

[Scyth]

Wasn't Odyn right actually lol?

All the dragons do is corrupting themselves and being drama queens. Like majority of the problems that Dragons solve are caused by the Dragons

You can say this exact same thing about literally any race in WoW though. Let's just get rid of them all

[Nyel]

I think for me at least, the draw to Avaloren is not neccessarily the continent/island/whatever itself, rather the mystery of what is on the other side of Azeroth. It's something that's been debated and discussed for ages. It could literally be any type of continent there and I'd be interested to see what it's like.

How would Avaloren be different though? To make it a plausible place on the other side of Azeroth it should be completely different from the Azeroth we know - completely different biomes, creatures, climate or whatever. And exactly that it won’t be, because it’s Blizzard and they won’t create an expansion that’s 100% new and fresh. For Avaloren to be a mysterious place they would need to go out of their comfort zone and do something unexpected (e.g. Dragon Isles being a floating continent and not just another archipelago).

[doledippers]

what the fuck is up , happy last-monday-before-blizzcon. did i miss anything saucy over the weekend? i assume not, but always worth to check

[Jaggler]

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/His...en_in_Warcraft

People liked Pandaren yes (many people also hated/hate them).

But you said Pandaria hada strong lore character to pull us there which is wrong on multiple levels: Chen was not a strong lore character. He barely was a character apart from being a joke character.

Chen wasn't the link to Pandaria that pulled us into the expansion, he was also just there at the same time as us.

[Teriz]

There literally was no reason to go to Dragon Isles.

Like elementals spawned in deserted zones and some arrogant lizzards with wings giving us orders?

Like wtf

The reason to go to the Dragon Isles is to visit the homeland of WoW's major draconic characters and explore their history and restore their place on Azeroth. Which is why the expansion was initiated by Wrathion, a very popular WoW character who's main goal has been to re-establish the Black Dragonflight and shake off the legacy of his father since his introduction in Cataclysm.

But yeah, "no reason".

[Wangming]

I have to ask; why AU Gilneans specifically?

Cause in this universe they are already werewolves.


Okay here is the pitch.
In AU Azeroth things work out mostly like in the main timeline. And as the Scourge marches across Lordaeron Genn orders Arugal to find a solution. But instead of Worgen he finds the Venthyr.
They become vampires.
Genn decides that he has had enough of conflicts outside his border putting everyone in danger. With the help of the Venthyr and his new sword he opens a portal to Main Azeroth and establishes a colony there with the intent of gathering everyone who is sick of being caught in the Alliance - Horde war crossfire. This would help him bolster his vampire army.
This new colony happens to be an archipelago that includes Darkmoon Island, displacing the Faire and turning them into a third playable faction. Pretty ironic.

The whole story against them starts more like a detective story as we find traces of a new cult but escalates into a War against the Alternate Greymanes and Arugal. Alternate Gilneas would be a patch zone that shows the whole area without the Cataclysm blasting half of it.
After the penultimate raid the Venthyr get Denathrius out of the sword who promptly takes over the vampire army and turns on the remaining Greymanes. They of course have a change of heart.
In the final battle Denathrius attempts to slay Alternate Liam, but Main Universe Genn, still haunted by a very similar scenario, takes the final blow for him and dies. Denathrius escapes to be a proper villain for the next expansion not just the man behind the man while Liam joins Queen Tess Greymane in Main Azeroth hoping to understand the Gilneans in our timeline, despite not being a Worgen. A worry that Tess is all too familiar with.

Additionally because the whole detecitve work I mentioned I would add investigation as a profession. Although it would be less of a profession and more a feature that depends on professions. You could gather clues by doing gathering professions and archaeology and use said clues to fill the bar and unlock rewards like mounts or cosmetics. Maybe even daily quest areas.

[Beerplz]

The only thing i'm doing when researching for leaks at this point is refreshing https://crt.sh/?q=blizzard.com every couple of hours and sorting by the most recent, since that is how we got "dragonflight.blizzard.com" leaked.
Maybe they fuck it up again

[lanerios]

what the fuck is up , happy last-monday-before-blizzcon. did i miss anything saucy over the weekend? i assume not, but always worth to check

Nothing really

Teriz pushing the Tinker narrative as always in this thread. Every year a few days before blizzcon
Some random discussion about the screenshots yet again
and other random drivel.

Nothing special really

[Teriz]

People liked Pandaren yes (many people also hated/hate them).

But you said Pandaria hada strong lore character to pull us there which is wrong on multiple levels: Chen was not a strong lore character. He barely was a character apart from being a joke character.

Chen wasn't the link to Pandaria that pulled us into the expansion, he was also just there at the same time as us.

Revisionist history at its finest folks.

If Chen wasn't a popular character why did people want a playable Pandaren race? The only playable Pandaren we had for years was Chen. And yeah, they were asked for constantly from vanilla until their final reveal in MoP. That's why Blizzard did the expansion, and that's why Chen was all over it when it was announced.

[caliphax]

How would Avaloren be different though? To make it a plausible place on the other side of Azeroth it should be completely different from the Azeroth we know - completely different biomes, creatures, climate or whatever. And exactly that it won’t be, because it’s Blizzard and they won’t create an expansion that’s 100% new and fresh. For Avaloren to be a mysterious place they would need to go out of their comfort zone and do something unexpected (e.g. Dragon Isles being a floating continent and not just another archipelago).

Well your imagination could run wild. It could be a place where magic manifests itself in different ways. It could be where remnants of the last legion invasion have corrrupted the land. It could be where the Botani fled to and where plantlife is growing.

[lanerios]

The reason to go to the Dragon Isles is to visit the homeland of WoW's major draconic characters and explore their history and restore their place on Azeroth. Which is why the expansion was initiated by Wrathion, a very popular WoW character who's main goal has been to re-establish the Black Dragonflight and shake off the legacy of his father since his introduction in Cataclysm.

But yeah, "no reason".

And again, what prove, what objective data do you have that this expansion cannot in any way end in such a lore situation that we go to X (X being Avaloren, Undermine, The moon, The shed out back, Wallmart, or whatever)? Because you seem so convinced that DF does not have a story hook into the next expansion.

[Harbour]

Because you know almost nothing about Avaloren. Maybe instead of crying how boring Avaloren is, wait until Blizzard tells what's going on there and suggests some reasons why you as the player might be interested in going there.

They better do it before throwing us there. Its just basic logic.
You have to hype up people before throwing them there, and WoW almost always operated on the basis of building up something across few expansions or using big nostalgia before letting us go there.
In other case interest would be just lower, check out how MoP (and at lesser point Cata, because it has main villain from WC2 that was way less known and popular than WC3) went in terms of population.
Dont try to downplay my point to a simple whining, its pretty much reasonable point to have.
And im not against Avaloren as a concept. Im against it being the place for 11.0.
Build it up throught 11.0 (and maybe 12.0), then let us go therein 12.0(13.0). Simple.

Light and Void on other hand have eached the point when they will get overcooked, if Blizzard will wait for longer. I judge by myself obviously - i feel like now is the perfect timing for Light vs Void expansion. Waiting for another couple years through another filler expansion will surely lower my interest as a player.

[Aeula]

If Chen wasn't a popular character why did people want a playable Pandaren race?

Same reason people want playable Tuskarr. Either as a meme or a super niche interest they have. Pandaren were not a popular request at all and MoP did blindside the community when it was first leaked. Even the Blizzard CM team didn't think it was real.