1. #41881
    I am Murloc! Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    The problem with Shadowlands was not the setting. At least, it only became a "problem" after 9.1, when people started getting salty about the Jailer sucking and Blizzard lawsuits. Suddenly the setting became a problem.

    When SL was announced, no one had a problem with the setting. People were hyped to see the Hell landscape of the Warcraft universe, people were hyped to see the afterlife of the Wild Gods, people were hyped to see the afterlife of the setting. Before SL was announced, the vast majority of people and leaks wanted an Afterlife-based expansion, with the continuation of the Death storyline involving Sylvanas, Lich King, and Bwonsamdi.

    The problem with SL was not the setting, it was the boring trash main villain. I guarantee you that SL would have been far better received if Sylvanas/Arthas/Yogg-Saron were the main villains insetad of the random asspulled Jailer.
    Oh absolutely. The Jailer was so bad even Taliesin spoke highly of Final Fantasy XIV in his Shadowlands vids. And Denathrius was actually popular despite having no interesting motivation besides power-hungry baddy, cause he was a charismatic vampire lord.
    Zovaal looked, sounded, and acted boring and we only got a reason to care about his diabolical plan in the very last patch when it turned out it will involve Azeroth's World Soul somehow.

    It was a disaster. Granted the patch cadence did not help either.

    Thing is, I don't find the incarnates all that interesting either. I don't fucking care what iridikron wants to do. Knaifu? Yes. Azshara? Yes. Denathrius? Also yes. Alternate Universe Illidan who became the Lich King? Yes. Expansion 2 of Stone Dragon I don't care about trying to punish the Titans I also don't care about? I'll pass.

  2. #41882
    Quote Originally Posted by Harbour View Post
    Anyone else isnt fascinated with the prospect of Odyn being the focus (or one of the) of another expansion, as well as framing Titans as the bad guys?
    We had him as the boss twice in Legion and then he appeared occasionally here and there.
    He never gave the 'big bad' vibe.
    More like 'local grumpy asshole we had to deal with occasionally but who would help against bigger and way more sinister foes'.

    And obvious framing Titans as the villains would DEhype me.
    I liked them in Legion and they were fine dudes in the Legion's end cutscene. I dont want to fight them at all, and i dont think the story and lore properly made me feel that what they did to primal habitants of Azeroth was very bad and warrant taking measures now, 2000000000gazillions years later, right after they SAVED US ALL.

    Where i lead with that - every leak with Odyn being big bad and Titans being big bads is a fake and bullshit.
    It just sounds terrible as the premise for an expansion, there I said it. Especially after Dragonflight. It‘s just retreading known ground. Same NPCs, same stories, same snooze fest.

    Khaz Algar / Avaloren as an expansion premise is just too weak coming after an expansion that‘s been received pretty poorly by the (former) playerbase when it comes to setting and agenda. It would be just another step down and that’s really not something WoW can or should do right now. The next expansion needs to be pompous.
    Last edited by Nyel; 2023-10-30 at 12:51 PM.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  3. #41883
    Quote Originally Posted by Delever View Post
    Dunno man the algarian stormrider is the one that's looking pretty damn real. The rest could all be fakes but they ve definitely slipped up a bit .
    The Algarian Stormrider has been datamined and confirmed by many sources including Marlamin himself, so it's the only certainty we have about 11.0

  4. #41884
    Quote Originally Posted by Pheraz View Post
    Kinda offtopic to the current discussion but still fitting the topic of this thread

    Let's assume that all leaks are fake. Which could mean that blizzard finally managed to not give out any unencrypted art or press kit before the announcement. Which.... Is about time, isn't it?
    There's no way around doing so.

    Blizzard doesn't own clothing and merch factories so they have to send that information and those designs out to manufactures to make merch for Blizzcon. They have to send the commercial art out to professional printers for fliers and things, they have to prep big news sites like PC gamer, IGN and Kotaku with press stuff before hand, so that they can have articles (likely with interviews) written and out right have announcement.

    It's difficult to ensure that everyone in all those other companies is on the up and up.

  5. #41885
    Quote Originally Posted by NikolaiShade View Post
    The Algarian Stormrider has been datamined and confirmed by many sources including Marlamin himself, so it's the only certainty we have about 11.0
    I mean, we know it is real, it being for the 11.0 preorder, while I think is likely, is technically conjecture still. Never treat datamining as 100% confirmed.

  6. #41886
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delever View Post
    They could very well confirm it in the reveal. Just like they ve done with a lot of other expansions. I don't think blizzard ever confirmed that there was a zereth mortis either where progenitors creater Minecraft versions of things before they gave them life. Or that there are 4 covenants ruling the shadowlands.
    But Blizzard wouldn't need to confirm it at reveal. We would already know that Avaloren is on the other side of Azeroth if that were the case. Further, "the other side of Azeroth" doesn't mean anything if you don't know what's on the other side of Azeroth, or heard nothing about it. If this was legitimate, we'd have some weird rumors or stories about the other side of the world just like in real life when sailors and explorers would talk about the creatures and people they encountered on the other side of Earth during the age of discovery.

    Again, this sounds like an asspull of epic proportions. Heck, you're asspulling as we're going through this conversation.

  7. #41887
    Quote Originally Posted by Wangming View Post
    Oh absolutely. The Jailer was so bad even Taliesin spoke highly of Final Fantasy XIV in his Shadowlands vids. And Denathrius was actually popular despite having no interesting motivation besides power-hungry baddy, cause he was a charismatic vampire lord.
    Zovaal looked, sounded, and acted boring and we only got a reason to care about his diabolical plan in the very last patch when it turned out it will involve Azeroth's World Soul somehow.

    It was a disaster. Granted the patch cadence did not help either.

    Thing is, I don't find the incarnates all that interesting either. I don't fucking care what iridikron wants to do. Knaifu? Yes. Azshara? Yes. Denathrius? Also yes. Alternate Universe Illidan who became the Lich King? Yes. Expansion 2 of Stone Dragon I don't care about trying to punish the Titans I also don't care about? I'll pass.
    Iridrikon was not created to be a popular or beloved villain. Iridrikon was created as a mere means to an end, a catalyst to bring back Azshara, Xal'atath, and the Void in general.

    In a way, he is exactly like AU Gul'dan. AU Gul'dan wasn't created to be popular or beloved villain, he was created as a catalyst to bring Legion back to Azeroth. That he also became popular and beloved was a side bonus, but not the main objective of the writers.

    Come the Legion expansion, and Gul'dan disappears after the prologue and gets killed in the first act of the expansion. He was just a tool, a plot device, and the writers discarded him once he fullfilled his purpose (bringing back the Legion).

    Iridrikon's sole purpose is to facilitate the return of the Void storyline. He has dealings with the Void and is a puppet of the Old Gods, so he will be used to bring forth the Void expansion and then discarded (aka unceremoniously killed early on in a raid like AU Gul'dan).

    If you like Azshara or Xal'atath, then you should be hyped for what Iridrikon does next, because the sole meaning behind his existence is to usher in the Void storyline. Just like the sole meaning behind AU Gul'dan's existence was to usher in the return of the Legion storyline.

  8. #41888
    Quote Originally Posted by Marlamin View Post
    I mean, we know it is real, it being for the 11.0 preorder, while I think is likely, is technically conjecture still. Never treat datamining as 100% confirmed.
    I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  9. #41889
    Quote Originally Posted by SwordartL View Post
    Dude is shill and why no one cares, plays for Dragonflight.
    Bruh stop trying to incite an argument.

  10. #41890
    Quote Originally Posted by Harbour View Post
    I think when people ask what is the reason to visit Avaloren they mean not "What is the plot reason?" but rather "Why would players want to do that?".
    After all throught the plot Blizzard always gave us the kickstart at the pre-patch, but in previous cases besides the plot there was already established interest in visiting new place. People were fine to visit Dragon Isles because they always wanted to visit it.
    The only exception is Pandaria, but i tell you what - since the pandaria avaloren is my least hyped place where i wanted to be.
    I remember back in 2010-2011 when the Pandaria rumours appeared i as well as many other people on forums didnt want to believe that and thought thats the joke.
    And i skipped the whole expansion, coming back only in WoD.
    Avaloren just isnt good place for 11.0. It needs more than just a book to make people (non hardcore lorekeepers) at least interested in visiting it.

    I think for me at least, the draw to Avaloren is not neccessarily the continent/island/whatever itself, rather the mystery of what is on the other side of Azeroth. It's something that's been debated and discussed for ages. It could literally be any type of continent there and I'd be interested to see what it's like.

  11. #41891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.
    I believe Marlamin's point was less "it could be fake" and more that anything datamined has the chance to be changed, be already outdated, be a bug or mislabeled, etc.

  12. #41892
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    I imagine the only way it could be fake is if the name is going to change in a hotfix right before the announcement, which is a massive leap of logic.
    Yeah, I don't think it's fake but that is technically possible, but we'd still be able to confirm it with pre-hotfixed data so nothing really changes there.

    I do think it is possible they will use that strategy going forward though as their systems have been bad at keeping secrets for a while now, similar to when they named mount model filenames as encrypted<number>.m2 so dataminers wouldn't know what they were if the names leaked, not an issue now filenames are gone, but definitely a leaky issue at the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    I believe Marlamin's point was less "it could be fake" and more that anything datamined has the chance to be changed, be already outdated, be a bug or mislabeled, etc.
    My point is that most of what datamining generally misses is context and we have incredibly little context for this mount in particular. The "Heroic Edition:" part obviously means it'll be in a preorder package, but technically speaking, however stupidly remote, there's no guarantee that is for mainline WoW. I think it obviously is for mainline WoW, but as long as it is not public/announced, I like treating things as not 100% confirmed however likely they may be.
    Last edited by Marlamin; 2023-10-30 at 01:02 PM.

  13. #41893
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lanerios View Post
    This really needs a source. You keep spouting it, but there is no basis for it.
    During an interview with Game Front, Lead Quest Designer Dave Kosak, who also was on the panel with Metzen, echoed the sentiments that Mists of Pandaria may seem more light-hearted, but it's just as important to the overall WoW experience as the previous expansion sets. Kosak also said that a playable pandaren race is “by far” the most asked-for World of Warcraft feature among fans.[28]
    https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/His...en_in_Warcraft

  14. #41894
    Quote Originally Posted by Moth Preacher View Post
    Wasn't Odyn right actually lol?

    All the dragons do is corrupting themselves and being drama queens. Like majority of the problems that Dragons solve are caused by the Dragons
    You can say this exact same thing about literally any race in WoW though. Let's just get rid of them all

  15. #41895
    Quote Originally Posted by caliphax View Post
    I think for me at least, the draw to Avaloren is not neccessarily the continent/island/whatever itself, rather the mystery of what is on the other side of Azeroth. It's something that's been debated and discussed for ages. It could literally be any type of continent there and I'd be interested to see what it's like.
    How would Avaloren be different though? To make it a plausible place on the other side of Azeroth it should be completely different from the Azeroth we know - completely different biomes, creatures, climate or whatever. And exactly that it won’t be, because it’s Blizzard and they won’t create an expansion that’s 100% new and fresh. For Avaloren to be a mysterious place they would need to go out of their comfort zone and do something unexpected (e.g. Dragon Isles being a floating continent and not just another archipelago).
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  16. #41896
    what the fuck is up , happy last-monday-before-blizzcon. did i miss anything saucy over the weekend? i assume not, but always worth to check

  17. #41897
    People liked Pandaren yes (many people also hated/hate them).

    But you said Pandaria hada strong lore character to pull us there which is wrong on multiple levels: Chen was not a strong lore character. He barely was a character apart from being a joke character.

    Chen wasn't the link to Pandaria that pulled us into the expansion, he was also just there at the same time as us.

  18. #41898
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwordartL View Post
    There literally was no reason to go to Dragon Isles.

    Like elementals spawned in deserted zones and some arrogant lizzards with wings giving us orders?

    Like wtf
    The reason to go to the Dragon Isles is to visit the homeland of WoW's major draconic characters and explore their history and restore their place on Azeroth. Which is why the expansion was initiated by Wrathion, a very popular WoW character who's main goal has been to re-establish the Black Dragonflight and shake off the legacy of his father since his introduction in Cataclysm.

    But yeah, "no reason".

  19. #41899
    I am Murloc! Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrossNgen View Post
    I have to ask; why AU Gilneans specifically?
    Cause in this universe they are already werewolves.


    Okay here is the pitch.
    In AU Azeroth things work out mostly like in the main timeline. And as the Scourge marches across Lordaeron Genn orders Arugal to find a solution. But instead of Worgen he finds the Venthyr.
    They become vampires.
    Genn decides that he has had enough of conflicts outside his border putting everyone in danger. With the help of the Venthyr and his new sword he opens a portal to Main Azeroth and establishes a colony there with the intent of gathering everyone who is sick of being caught in the Alliance - Horde war crossfire. This would help him bolster his vampire army.
    This new colony happens to be an archipelago that includes Darkmoon Island, displacing the Faire and turning them into a third playable faction. Pretty ironic.

    The whole story against them starts more like a detective story as we find traces of a new cult but escalates into a War against the Alternate Greymanes and Arugal. Alternate Gilneas would be a patch zone that shows the whole area without the Cataclysm blasting half of it.
    After the penultimate raid the Venthyr get Denathrius out of the sword who promptly takes over the vampire army and turns on the remaining Greymanes. They of course have a change of heart.
    In the final battle Denathrius attempts to slay Alternate Liam, but Main Universe Genn, still haunted by a very similar scenario, takes the final blow for him and dies. Denathrius escapes to be a proper villain for the next expansion not just the man behind the man while Liam joins Queen Tess Greymane in Main Azeroth hoping to understand the Gilneans in our timeline, despite not being a Worgen. A worry that Tess is all too familiar with.

    Additionally because the whole detecitve work I mentioned I would add investigation as a profession. Although it would be less of a profession and more a feature that depends on professions. You could gather clues by doing gathering professions and archaeology and use said clues to fill the bar and unlock rewards like mounts or cosmetics. Maybe even daily quest areas.

  20. #41900
    The only thing i'm doing when researching for leaks at this point is refreshing https://crt.sh/?q=blizzard.com every couple of hours and sorting by the most recent, since that is how we got "dragonflight.blizzard.com" leaked.
    Maybe they fuck it up again

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