The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Lahis]

Hard pass on Emberthal becoming an Aspect. That character is insufferable to listen too.

She is not even a Dragon. Ebyssian will be aspect and Emberthal his general/advisor/what ever title it might be.

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Even if you take out Wrathion from being the aspect, like what then? Where does the character go from there.

I suppose he would go looking for Anduin.

[Sondrelk]

It's not Wrathion or Sabellian because they don't want one of the sides of players to "lose". Simple as that. They learned enough from BFA.

10.0.7 and 10.1 have Ebonhorn as the front pick with Ebyssian and Emberthal as his generals and Wrathion set up to fuck off and do his own thing because his arc is "I don't NEED to be Aspect and my family is the Talons/Anduin"

This is hardly a BfA situation though? And that is even ignoring that they did have one side be canonically wrong in their choice in BfA. The "choice" is on Wrathion or Sabellian, and it's a choice you make weekly. You could absolutely just make the canonical end that everyone just helped both regardless.

And how is choosing Ebyssian as the aspect not functionally the same as saying Sabellian or Wrathion was the wrong choice anyways?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

It's not Wrathion or Sabellian because they don't want one of the sides of players to "lose". Simple as that. They learned enough from BFA.

10.0.7 and 10.1 have Ebonhorn as the front pick with Ebyssian and Emberthal as his generals and Wrathion set up to fuck off and do his own thing because his arc is "I don't NEED to be Aspect and my family is the Talons/Anduin"

...This isn't even a BFA situation. Neither Sabellian nor Wrathion are beloved as Sylvanas was and well being the lead of a playable faction.

[huth]

She is not even a Dragon. Ebyssian will be aspect and Emberthal his general/advisor/what ever title it might be.

I still prefer Wrathion and Sabellian having to share the position with Ebonhorn as advisor and guy who actually gets stuff done.

And the position gets renamed to Aspect of Incessant Bickering.

[Skildar]

I'd prefer if they stopped with the aspects. They bring nothing of value to the dragon story.

With the guardian of Azeroth it was clear why they were needed and why they got a title, they were infused with power. With the aspects it's always unclear and always a mystery what their responsibilities are, but not in an interesting way.

So let's drop the aspects, drop the oath stones, let the primalist win and not have them do a jailer-deathwing plan of wanting to dominate-kill everyone.

[huth]

With the guardian of Azeroth it was clear why they were needed and why they got a title, they were infused with power. With the aspects it's always unclear and always a mystery what their responsibilities are, but not in an interesting way.

What's mysterious or unclear about them? The explicit charges they got? The clearly stated source of their power? Their position as leaders of their respective flights?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I'd prefer if they stopped with the aspects. They bring nothing of value to the dragon story.

With the guardian of Azeroth it was clear why they were needed and why they got a title, they were infused with power. With the aspects it's always unclear and always a mystery what their responsibilities are, but not in an interesting way.

So let's drop the aspects, drop the oath stones, let the primalist win and not have them do a jailer-deathwing plan of wanting to dominate-kill everyone.

...How about no, thats what Cataclysm turned them into. The Aspects is just a cool unique thing part of the lore.

[Lahis]

Time Travel, Holy Hand Grenade, Murozond - WotLK Classic Patch 3.4.2 Datamining

Now hold on a minute. New Murozond themed items from the future added into Classic WotLK PTR when Dragonflight will have time shenanigans with the Bronze Flight.

Will the events of Dragonflight's Bronze patch affect WoW Classic timeline and split it off into a different timeline where Cataclysm never happens and Blizz can develop new content into the game following the Classic era principles, like how Old School Runescape and Runescape 3 are different games with paraller development and wholly split timelines at this point?

That would be pretty insane event.

[Sondrelk]

Time Travel, Holy Hand Grenade, Murozond - WotLK Classic Patch 3.4.2 Datamining

Now hold on a minute. New Murozond themed items from the future added into Classic WotLK PTR when Dragonflight will have time shenanigans with the Bronze Flight.

Will the events of Dragonflight's Bronze patch affect WoW Classic timeline and split it off into a different timeline where Cataclysm never happens and Blizz can develop new content into the game following the Classic era principles, like how Old School Runescape and Runescape 3 are different games with paraller development and wholly split timelines at this point?

That would be pretty insane event.

It would be an insanely detrimental option. Once you open the options of retconning stuff then there is no going back. Everything is up for grabs.
Besides, as I have said many times before, WotLK and Cataclysm is basically the same expansion in terms of gameplay. The only measurable difference is popularity, and that you can go back to EK and Kalimdor in WotLK, but you can't in Cata.

Besides. What is going to happen with future Classic expansions anyways? Will it just rewrite the ones we have, trying to avoid the narrative pitfalls? Will it try to mix it up to present the veneer of possibility that we won't be fighting Deathwing and N'zoth eventually?

Why should Blizzard stop at remaking WoW from WotLK anyways? What about trying BfA again with Dragonflight mechanics and gameplay, and without the story being shit? Or a version of Shadowlands that went into the bin at the beginning?

Also, wouldnt it be more prudent in that case to remake expansions from Vanilla onwards? Really try to recapture the gameplay that we lost since then? The current gameplay loop of endgame being paramount, and raids being the true essence of PvE started in WotLK anyways, so we wouldnt gain much. If we really wanted a fresh take on WoW expansions then go for Vanilla and it's heavy focus on the open world.


Personally I think it's much more likely that what we see are just basic QoL changes fro WotLK, since the previous fixes to the janky systems were so well regarded.

[Kiivar86]

God I hope not. He is such a non-entity in the running for Aspect. The only thing he has going for him narratively is that he isnt Sabellian or Wrathion.
The argument that he doesnt want it is really misconstrued. He doesnt want it because he thinks he is unfitting. He doesnt want it because it's so outside his character as to be irrelevant. If you want a Black Dragonflight character who "doesnt want it", but who would be a good dark horse candidate then I would go for Emberthal. She is someone who far better fits the hesitant leader archetype.

I do agree but that's why I think its gonna be him.

Also in regards to Emberthal, can a drakthyr even be aspect? Do we know they can or has that not been touched upon? I'm not aware of it in any case.

[Sondrelk]

I do agree but that's why I think its gonna be him.

Also in regards to Emberthal, can a drakthyr even be aspect? Do we know they can or has that not been touched upon? I'm not aware of it in any case.

But why would it be Ebyssian though? Why not the Black Dragon who we give artifacts from the Zskera vaults after he leaves Sabellian? Or even Adamanthia after we free her from the Forbidden Reach?
If we accept that Ebyssians only good trait for Black Aspect is his trait of not being Sabellian or Wrathion then there are loads of other Black Dragons who make just as much sense.

[Kiivar86]

But why would it be Ebyssian though? Why not the Black Dragon who we give artifacts from the Zskera vaults after he leaves Sabellian? Or even Adamanthia after we free her from the Forbidden Reach?
If we accept that Ebyssians only good trait for Black Aspect is his trait of not being Sabellian or Wrathion then there are loads of other Black Dragons who make just as much sense.

Yeah he's basically a non-entity in most aspects (heh, no pun intended) but what he has done is be a guide, a mentor figure, and also one of the three at the forefront as "sons" of Deathwing (symbolically in Wrathion's case, anyway) and the only one of the three sons/heirs who is not jonesing for it. Just feels like its an obvious setup to me.

[huth]

It would be an insanely detrimental option. Once you open the options of retconning stuff then there is no going back. Everything is up for grabs.

Wrong way of thinking about it. You're treating it as a change to what already exists instead of a seperate storyline progressing from a common point in history. It would no longer be connected to the retail story beyond WotLK.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

That idea sounds incredibly silly. Classic being one thing, it going to a different story... please no. Time Traveling shennigans after DF? Sure, go nuts.

[huth]

That idea sounds incredibly silly. Classic being one thing, it going to a different story... please no. Time Traveling shennigans after DF? Sure, go nuts.

Is it really that silly when it has been done successfully before?

[Khaza-R]

Time Travel, Holy Hand Grenade, Murozond - WotLK Classic Patch 3.4.2 Datamining

Now hold on a minute. New Murozond themed items from the future added into Classic WotLK PTR when Dragonflight will have time shenanigans with the Bronze Flight.

Will the events of Dragonflight's Bronze patch affect WoW Classic timeline and split it off into a different timeline where Cataclysm never happens and Blizz can develop new content into the game following the Classic era principles, like how Old School Runescape and Runescape 3 are different games with paraller development and wholly split timelines at this point?

That would be pretty insane event.

I'll believe Classic + when I see it.

I'm thinking this is a more a fun cross-over event meant to poke the 4th wall with Murozond's time travel shenanigans and literally going back into time to classic. Pretty cool regardless.

[draugril]

I do agree but that's why I think its gonna be him.

Also in regards to Emberthal, can a drakthyr even be aspect? Do we know they can or has that not been touched upon? I'm not aware of it in any case.

Thrall filled in. Besides, there aren’t any real barriers to this regardless; if the writers want it to happen, it’s possible.

And even then, Blizzard has been trying hard to sell Dracthyr as dragons. And heirs to Neltharion. I can’t think of anything more apt to cement them as “real” dragons and the reinventors of the black Dragonflight than making her the next Aspect.

[Kiivar86]

Thrall filled in. Besides, there aren’t any real barriers to this regardless; if the writers want it to happen, it’s possible.

And even then, Blizzard has been trying hard to sell Dracthyr as dragons. And heirs to Neltharion. I can’t think of anything more apt to cement them as “real” dragons and the reinventors of the black Dragonflight than making her the next Aspect.

He filled in, but I always took that as more that he was there just to balance things out as they needed someone in Neltharion's place.

True, but we've not had anything saying they can be one, right?

[Teriz]

If I was a betting man, I'd give the odds as such:

5% Sabellian
15% Wrathion
20% Ebonhorn
40% Emberthal
20% Iridikron

Pretty sure the Wrathion/Sabellian dichotomy is entirely a red herring - I personally prefer Sabellian, but if it's one of the two, it'll be Wrathion due to familiarity with the player. Ebonhorn got a new model and a more central role, but he's still not a good leader and seems to be servicing a rising star within the Black Dragonflight - Emberthal. Her narrative, to this point, is the most integral to the overall story of Dragonflight. She is reclaiming the legacy of the Black Dragonflight, but also reinventing what that means. If that isn't a setup for a new Aspect, I don't know what is.

Iridikron is the dark horse candidate. More likely than the red herrings, but Ebonhorn is a mainstay now and would be the safest choice. Emberthal has the logical narrative backing, but given the predisposition to giving us a big "twist" with little to no buildup, he would work the best for that. We've been told how irredeemable he is, but we haven't really seen anything ourselves. Seems like a perfect "Draenor is free!"/"I will never serve!" moment for Dragonflight.

You should probably add Adamanthia to that list. She's older than all of the living black dragons, and she seems to have Ebyssian's temperament after she's freed from the madness of Neltharion's imprisonment.

[draugril]

You should probably add Adamanthia to that list. She's older than all of the living black dragons, and she seems to have Ebyssian's temperament after she's freed from the madness of Neltharion's imprisonment.

She exists to service the Dracthyr narrative. I don’t think it would be productive to simply list all living black dragons as candidates simply because they are living black dragons.