1. #5561
    I disagree with the take on Chromie and Dracthyr that some people in this forum have.

    First, overexposure of Chromie, really? She got a short story that I bet that most of the playerbase have not read (which was decent, IMO) and some quests in 10.0 (which were cool with Eternus and the time travel stuff). Not much more. She is still a secondary character, and I neither love it or hate It, but she does not have been overexposed.

    Second, I understand that people might be dissapointed because we have not get (yet) the bulky Drakonids, but I have to commend Blizzard for having the balls to do something original with the Dracthyr. At least for me, they are something new in a fantasy setting, and I think that they have a lot of potential to be a very interesting addition in the future of Warcraft. We will have to wait and see what is their big secret.

    As for the Drakonids, there are several elements in DF that very much point to them eventually becoming an Allied Race IMO.

    Finally, now that we know what 10.1.5 is about, I think that the rest of the patch cycle is clear:

    10.2 will be about the Green Dragonflight.
    10.2.5 will be about the Blue Dragonflight.
    10.3 will be about the Red Dragonflight.

    The Red Dragonflight has not have practically any development until now. I think that their story would focus on the Dragonflights coming together, fighting the Incarnates / Decay.
    Last edited by Darkarath; 2023-05-11 at 08:26 PM.
    Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive.


  2. #5562
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    Fair analysis. I'd hardly put it beyond Blizzard to completely misread their errors in retrospect and overcompensate in response.

    As for Chrome constituting a severe incongruity, that much is what makes her rather insufferable to work around. She's a character that inherently exists to provide comic relief, and it's difficult to attach any further depth to her. It would be plenty entertaining if evil Chromie were employed as, say, a deliberate invocation of a Saturday morning cartoon villain; a villain played entirely for comedy would be nice to see pop up now and again, and it would be a nice way to keep her in-character while still indulging in the typical tendencies of the Infinite Dragonflight.
    The thing is, she was introduced to be incongruous. You found this weird gnome in the middle of a ruin in Andorhal, acting oblivious to the danger around her, giving your weird quests unrelated to the surrounding zombie apocalypse. And that's why it worked. When everything else is like Chromie, what's the point of her?

  3. #5563
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkarath View Post
    10.2 will be about the Green Dragonflight.
    10.2.5 will be about the Blue Dragonflight.
    10.3 will be about the Red Dragonflight.

    The Red Dragonflight has not have practically any development until now. I think that their story would Focus on the Dragonflights coming together, fighting the Incarnates / Decay.
    I think it's also possible that the Blue are 10.1.7 and Red and Green share 10.2. If we fight Iridikron this early (as well as Red and Green sharing similar themes) I'm not sure we will go all the way to 10.3.

  4. #5564
    Assuming we get Tyr's disk in 10.1.5 we should be trying to get him back up by 10.1.7 so 10.2 should very much be about how the Aspects will get back to full power again.

  5. #5565
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    I think it's also possible that the Blue are 10.1.7 and Red and Green share 10.2. If we fight Iridikron this early (as well as Red and Green sharing similar themes) I'm not sure we will go all the way to 10.3.
    I'm willing to bet on a 10.3 until we're explicitly told otherwise or 10.2's reveal wraps up the story, simply because after SL Blizzard would be shooting themselves in the foot if they cut yet another expansion short. DF's silver lining for them has been high retention to make up for comparatively upfront lackluster sales, combined with good word of mouth. A shortened expansion kills that.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  6. #5566
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    I'm willing to bet on a 10.3 until we're explicitly told otherwise or 10.2's reveal wraps up the story, simply because after SL Blizzard would be shooting themselves in the foot if they cut yet another expansion short. DF's silver lining for them has been high retention to make up for comparatively upfront lackluster sales, combined with good word of mouth. A shortened expansion kills that.
    Depends on what is revealed at Blizzcon. And would it really be cut short if it has constant content?

  7. #5567
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    I'm willing to bet on a 10.3 until we're explicitly told otherwise or 10.2's reveal wraps up the story, simply because after SL Blizzard would be shooting themselves in the foot if they cut yet another expansion short. DF's silver lining for them has been high retention to make up for comparatively upfront lackluster sales, combined with good word of mouth. A shortened expansion kills that.
    Ehhh, SL wasn't hated because it was short. I don't think people will retroactively hate DF if it's less patches, including if 10.2 is an Argus style multi-zone patch in the Dream. And ESPECIALLY if 11.0 is something huge people want (revamp, housing, etc)

    I'm also running out of patch zone ideas for 10.3 unless Avaloren is a titan compound nearby or Tel'abim is secretly off the coast.

  8. #5568
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Ehhh, SL wasn't hated because it was short. I don't think people will retroactively hate DF if it's less patches, including if 10.2 is an Argus style multi-zone patch in the Dream. And ESPECIALLY if 11.0 is something huge people want (revamp, housing, etc)
    SL's patch cadence was the dominant component of its failure. Everything else are just barnacles on the longest wait to a first patch combined with that patch being a crappy island zone and a mediocre raid. No amount of scandals would've had a meaningful sales effect if the product itself had anything to distract people with.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  9. #5569
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    SL's patch cadence was the dominant component of its failure. Everything else are just barnacles on the longest wait to a first patch combined with that patch being a crappy island zone and a mediocre raid.
    Right. And patch cadence is great this time around, so if the expansion is smaller/"cut short", it doesn't really matter as long as it ends strong and the next expansion arrives quickly after.

  10. #5570
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Depends on what is revealed at Blizzcon. And would it really be cut short if it has constant content?
    Even assuming a DF-tier announcement to release schedule, that'd see a release around Q3 or Q4 2024, meaning that 10.2 would have to pull its weight for close to a year.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  11. #5571
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    Even assuming a DF-tier announcement to release schedule, that'd see a release around Q3 or Q4 2024, meaning that 10.2 would have to pull its weight for close to a year.
    I think Argus-style Dream (with a Lifelands zone) and a mini patch after that could do hold people over. Especially if the tree is actually involved as there could be a city for people to fuck around with.

    Maybe the Tree is like the symbol for 11.0? Regrowth, new cities/housing etc?

  12. #5572
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Depends on what is revealed at Blizzcon. And would it really be cut short if it has constant content?
    I suppose a weird possibility is 10.2 as the Dragonflight finale, and 10.3 as the Timewalking improvements patch. Either Timewalking improvements, or just general improvements. Raids are similar to the Fated raids in SL, and for content we get loads of world events and improved old zones.

    Not sure how well it would go over the general playerbase. But I would be down for it.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  13. #5573
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Let the expansion be as long as possible. SL length wouldn't bother anyone if the ...well systems weren't what they are and had "New wow" philosophy thats going on.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance #TeamNoBlueHorde

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  14. #5574
    I think that Blizzard would make a huge mistake if from now on WoW's expansions finish in x.2 patches. The story needs to develop properly. I cannot see DF not having a 10.3 patch. It would be a huge dissapointment. There are lots of themes that they could go with in 10.3, and even with this patch at least an Incarnate would survive the expansion IMO.
    Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive.


  15. #5575
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    The thing is, she was introduced to be incongruous. You found this weird gnome in the middle of a ruin in Andorhal, acting oblivious to the danger around her, giving your weird quests unrelated to the surrounding zombie apocalypse. And that's why it worked. When everything else is like Chromie, what's the point of her?
    The issue with that is that in her initial introduction, the tonal and physical incongruity of her presence was played deliberately. Presently, the tonal incongruity is either unintentional or extremely poorly-handled, and the physical incongruity of her presence and the simultaneous sense of mystique and comedy it generates is entirely absent. If anything, your point actually ties into precisely why she doesn't work as well under the current conditions: she doesn't really serve to provide comic relief because the drama of the setting puts her front-and-center (as well as that she's emotionally invested in it to begin with) in an environment that is wholly centered around the Bronze Dragonflight, rather than having them act as stagehands.

    As a matter of slight digression, I do otherwise like the storyline regarding the Bronze and Infinite Dragonflights simply on account of that they're inherently cool concepts; there's something appealing to me about hurtling through time into places where you and the Bronze Dragonflight simply don't belong, operating as stagehands of sorts to preserve the proper flow of time in a theater otherwise concerned with typical, grounded conflicts. I actually think that the setting incongruity, as you mentioned, is key to the success of such a storyline.

  16. #5576
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkarath View Post
    I think that Blizzard would make a huge mistake if from now on their expansions finish in x.2 parches. The story needs to develop properly. I cannot see DF not having a 10.3 patch. It would be a huge dissapointment. There are lots of themes that they could go with in 10.3, and even with this patch at least an Incarnate would survive the expansion IMO.
    I can see there being a 10.3 Titan-y patch with Tyr and Odyn but aside from that? I don't see a lot of story after Iridikron/Vyranoth/Fyrakk? vs the Dream, especially if Decay is brought in through one of them as it can be the ultimate enemy to the Dream.

    I guess if that doesn't result in them becoming aspects again, "how do they become aspects" could be a whole patch story after the Incarnates are beaten. And that could be where Tyr and Odyn appear.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2023-05-11 at 08:40 PM.

  17. #5577
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    I'm willing to bet on a 10.3 until we're explicitly told otherwise or 10.2's reveal wraps up the story, simply because after SL Blizzard would be shooting themselves in the foot if they cut yet another expansion short. DF's silver lining for them has been high retention to make up for comparatively upfront lackluster sales, combined with good word of mouth. A shortened expansion kills that.
    Oddly enough, this seems to be reflective of what happened with Legion: a well-liked expansion is released with high player retention, but which didn't see a remarkable upswing in resubscription. I have to wonder if they'll be able to actually take advantage of it this time and if the positive testimonies regarding this expansion can be combined with a good follow-up.

  18. #5578
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkarath View Post
    I think that Blizzard would make a huge mistake if from now on WoW's expansions finish in x.2 patches. The story needs to develop properly. I cannot see DF not having a 10.3 patch. It would be a huge dissapointment. There are lots of themes that they could go with in 10.3, and even with this patch at least an Incarnate would survive the expansion IMO.
    The game needs it anyways. Thats how the best model goes or well usually. Wrath. THe MoP model IMO was the best. We had Thunder Isle Thunder King and then Soo. Granted three extra new zones I won't whine at. Shortening it even so people aren't in the expansion longer isn't a good idea IMO. It doesn't help.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance #TeamNoBlueHorde

    Warrior-Magi

  19. #5579
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    Oddly enough, this seems to be reflective of what happened with Legion: a well-liked expansion is released with high player retention, but which didn't see a remarkable upswing in resubscription. I have to wonder if they'll be able to actually take advantage of it this time and if the positive testimonies regarding this expansion can be combined with a good follow-up.
    It lead to a shit load of expansion purchases for BFA, so I assume if the hype for the theme of 11.0 is huge (revamp would be big, Light vs Void probably as well due to many lore figures) it will also have a lot of expansion purchases due to good faith from DF if it keeps up.

  20. #5580
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    It lead to a shit load of expansion purchases for BFA, so I assume if the hype for the theme of 11.0 is huge (revamp would be big, Light vs Void probably as well due to many lore figures) it will also have a lot of expansion purchases due to good faith from DF if it keeps up.
    That's precisely what I was thinking: this kind of expansion leads to a good deal of sales of the subsequent expansion—if Legion is not an aberration—and the only reason why I think it didn't set a path for long-term recovery is because BfA was a highly underwhelming and unenjoyable expansion. What I'm concerned about is maintaining the aforementioned good faith through the next expansion.

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