The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Vakir]

- Instead of getting a completely new theme every expansion, we'll keep building on the Worldsoul Saga with the Void as the ultimate enemy. It's like when Peter Jackson took The Hobbit and made three films out of one story, or when every movie franchise over the past decade has stretched their final film into two or three films to make more money.

That's...not a great comparison.

The Hobbit was a literal children's book Tolkein put together for his son. The original plan was 2 films under del Toro before New Line stepped in and even that may have been pushing it.

If you're planning from the start for something to be 3 parts, it's a lot more feasible, since you aren't making a longer creep version of something that pre-existed.

We'll need to see if this expansion is as large or dense as Dragonflight. If it isn't, then there's clear cause for concern, unless they start phoning it in with Midnight. But that's just speculation at this point. Frankly, the idea of every expansion being self-contained with a maybe-sequel hook that may or may not actually be coherent is part of the problem. It's why SL felt so fucking meandering with Zovaal's final words, and it's why N'Zoth being resolved in one patch felt like a wet fart.

YMMV but I hated the speculation before BlizzCon. It ended up having completely unclear expectations and paranoia and anxiety surrounding exactly this kind of stuff, and it meant that every 2 years we just got hit with "I want THIS flavor bad guy." "Well I want THIS flavor bad guy."

This is kinda what I was talking about a few days ago. You guys were expecting the moon and the stars. You were never getting a full world revamp with 2023 visual fidelity and DF levels of cadence. Not at this stage. Maybe in 14.0. And even then, don't expect things to go smoothly.

Hopefully Midnight isn't only four zones either. Would be nice to have a Silvermoon city zone, an Eversong Woods zone, Isle of Quel'danas, revamped Tirisfal and Plaguelands, and also new original zones like a corrupted Void forest, and then two zones set in a Void world/dimension.

That's gonna mean they're probably much smaller if they're planning the same content cadence. And then dynamic flight ends up pretty bizarre, as it will feel in the old world in 10.2.5. You're gonna plow through like 4 styles in 30 seconds.

[Merryck]

Do you all think that Old Anduin comic is set during Midnight or The Last Titan?

[Cheezits]

Hopefully Midnight isn't only four zones either. Would be nice to have a Silvermoon city zone, an Eversong Woods zone, Isle of Quel'danas, revamped Tirisfal and Plaguelands, and also new original zones like a corrupted Void forest, and then two zones set in a Void world/dimension.

I think they will do Eversong and Ghostlands merged (with SMC), the Amani area as its own zone, Quel'danas tied to some invading portal world, and then some form of the Plaguelands/North Lordaeron. There's your 4 with another variety in them.

Quel'danas may be blocked off at the start as well, so there could be two zones to the south.

[Dracullus]

Btw, isn't it pretty obvious who will return for Quel'Thanas expansion after years of doing dailies? xD

And in general I expect to return of pretty much everyone important during this saga. Also - but ONLY if 13.0 is last wow1 expansion, it wouldn't work if they continue game with level squish - I expect something even more crazy than Artifact weapons, but what will never go away.

I think they will do Eversong and Ghostlands merged (with SMC), the Amani area as its own zone, Quel'danas tied to some portal world, and then some form of the Plaguelands/North Lordaeron. There's your 4 with another variety in them.

They have something to work on in Northrend, but Quel'Thanas expansion will have to made from scratch. With dynamic flying time of small continents is over, even minizones like Forbidden Reach are pretty big.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Do you all think that Old Anduin comic is set during Midnight or The Last Titan?

Midnight since Metzen said that the shadow is finally defeated in Midnight.

[ercarp]

The Last Titan? Vrykul, Titan, Frost Trolls..... Earthen again........ Nerubians again........ uhhhhhhhhhhhhh............

Besides Vrykul it's going to be a lot of stuff we've already seen in the Worldsoul saga plus a retread of Dragonflight races like the Dragons and Tuskarr.

You bring up a good point. The Last Titan is bound to have a lot of thematic overlap with The War Within and Dragonflight. It will be interesting to see what solutions they come up with to balance that.

Although, I'm not even entirely sure if a full-scale revamp of Northrend is in the works based on how much they emphasized Ulduar as the expansion's central location. I mean, what reason would we have to return to Dragonblight or Borean Tundra? Or Icecrown?

It sounds like it's mostly going to be Storm Peaks and an expanded version of Ulduar (perhaps with some hidden new areas we never explored before).

[Worldshaper]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I totally agree they could have kept Midnight and The Last Titan off the list of things discussed this year, sure.

But is it a detriment that they did mention them? I don't think so. In fact, I think says three important things: one, they are definitely planning for at least three new expansions taking us to the end of the decade (instead of nonsense like "WoW 2" or whatever); two, they actually do have a story plan that isn't going to take a side trip into something that ultimately doesn't feel related to the main story (hello Shadowlands); and three, that beyond these three expansions, there will be new stories to tell.

Point three is actually the most important thing for WoW, because it means that new players will be able to jump into WoW after the Worldsong Saga and not have to worry about all the baggage. Hard enough reset for new players, without messing around with anyone who's been around for most or all of the past.

I generally agree with your points, especially about the story.

But to me, as somebody who's been playing all along, 11.0 was supposed to be a massive 20th anniversary expansion (with a potential world revamp), at least the size of Legion. That's what past precedent would tell us, anyway. Tick-tock. Smallish expansion. Big expansion. Smallish expansion. Big expansion. Dragonflight was smallish. It was time for something major. Where is it?

Like, heck yeah, Metzen at the helm of a cohesive story that will span three expansions sounds great. But would I have preferred Metzen at the helm of a single expansion announcement called "The Last Titan", in which we went to Avaloren or Khaz Algar and then progressively got closer to the whole Northrend/Void vs Light/Final Titan showdown over the course of two years? Uh, yes.

[Merryck]

Midnight since Metzen said that the shadow is finally defeated in Midnight.

[IMG]

So multi-decade time skip after The War Within? And we'll be on a Draenei ship in Midnight ... Very interesting. Perhaps we'll even visit Ka'resh on this ship.

[Cheezits]

I can also see them sadly just doing Quel'thalas as a suramar thing with Eversong being pretty small and the rest of the zones being void portals.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

So multi-decade time skip after The War Within? And we'll be on a Draenei ship in Midnight ... Very interesting. Perhaps we'll even visit Ka'resh on this ship.

Time flows faster outside of Azeroth. Alleria and Turalyon were fighting for thousands of years in the Army of the Light. Several decades have passed on AU Draenor with Grom becoming a grey haired old man. Time flows faster in the Shadowlands than in on Azeroth. Anduin is probably going to leave Azeroth and then age up really fast.

[Vakir]

Do you all think that Old Anduin comic is set during Midnight or The Last Titan?

Hopefully neither. It's story poison. Prophecies usually are trash unless maybe they're something bad or unlikely, to speculate "how do we get here?"

Anduin leading the Army of the Light or some-such is the first thing anyone could've anticipated when he became an author darling and important character with agency. Then they just said "hey, you're right" and instant blandness ensued.

[ZyntosAran]

Dynamic Flight for Druid Flight form in TWW confirmed

[ercarp]

I'm really doubting there's going to be a multi-decade time skip after TWW, but it would be cool.

EDIT: But also a bit sad because I don't want everyone to get super old all of a sudden.

[hattahat]

Xal'atath may not be 100% villainous. This is the plot I'm expecting. Azeroth is now in the hands of the Titans, and if this continues, the universe will eventually end with the Titans winning. So the Titans want to protect Azeroth, and they want to protect this timeline with the Bronze dragonflight. That's what Iridikron said in the Infinite Dawn.
We're essentially on the same side as the Titans because we have to protect Azeroth, but Xal'atath is trying to turn the tide. If the Void takes over Azeroth, the Titans will have no choice but to attack Azeroth, and in the process, we may become their enemies. I think that's the kind of irony that could happen in the Last Titan expansion.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I'm really doubting there's going to be a multi-decade time skip after TWW, but it would be cool.

We already had a 5 year timeskip in between Shadowlands and Dragonflight. If we get a 5 year timeskip between Dragonflight and TWW and then Midnight, and throw in Anduin going outside of Azeroth, then he could be an old man by the time of Midnight.

[Vakir]

They already said the Anduin thing was "a possibility," probably because it murders future tension.

[damonskye]

11.0 was supposed to be a massive 20th anniversary expansion (with a potential world revamp)

You can argue that they are acknowledging 20 years with the three-part story of the Worldsoul Saga (Metzen certainly presented it that way.)

The rest is just unrealized expectations. The whole idea of a revamp of the Eastern Kingdoms and Kalimdor was birthed by players. Not by the game developers, by us. Just like the expectations about various new classes (like tinkers), class skins, Avaloren and every other supposed 'leak' -- all things created by the player base. We can't be upset with the developer team when things they never promised aren't delivered.

- - - Updated - - -

Dynamic Flight for Druid Flight form in TWW confirmed

Return to druids smugly harvesting herbs without dismounting again in three, two, one...
(don't @ me, I play a druid too!)

[pacotaco]

Honestly of the whole announcement, the only thing meh to me is the Hero Talents... the list they showed is really underwhelming. I got my hopes up when I heard Far Seer, Dark Ranger, Keeper of the Grove. Thought they were going to cover all the old WC3 stuff + some long asked for stuff.

The fuck is Fatebound? Where is Necromancer? Tinker? Spellbreaker? Shadow Hunter? BLADEMASTER? HELLO?

No we got.... Slayer..... Deathstalker?


I wanted these to be more cosmetic/spell FX. It's all boring numerical passives and mechanics.

Let down on this one, sorry.

By the name, Fatebound is probably based on the Outlaw artifact.

[Nymrohd]

I'm really doubting there's going to be a multi-decade time skip after TWW, but it would be cool.

EDIT: But also a bit sad because I don't want everyone to get super old all of a sudden.

You know who is getting super old? Me, waiting for the same features for two decades to be added to this game.

[Khaza-R]

They already said the Anduin thing was "a possibility," probably because it murders future tension.

Tbf, I think that's easy to hand wave away after the Dawn of the Infinites. Unless I'm mistaken we've now deviated from the "true timeline" so old prophecies might be out the window.