1. #5981
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    You wouldn’t know the Draenei are “space goats” unless someone told you. No one needs to tell you that Ethereals are an other world species.
    Nobody would look at the Ethereals and say they’re alien unless they were told. At most they’d say they’re ghosts, just magical beings, and/or a kind of mummy. Even with their technology.

    A light invasion is almost certainly going to have these running/flying around.



    According to you the “casual gamer” can’t tell the difference between black & purple… so I’m pretty sure those same people would think it’s an alien invasion.
    Last edited by Nightshade711; 2023-05-18 at 11:56 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

  2. #5982
    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    Not interested in a Light vs. Void expansion at all in the near future.

    Give us Tel’Abim as a continent with Arabic and West Asia influences. Deserts, jungles, monastery’s, cities of brass, bustling market places and bazaar’s. Enemies such as Ifrit, Djinn, ghouls etc. Give it a MoP feel, grounded and exploring a new land. Bring in Captain Nightsquall who was mentioned this expansion, as well as his dread pirate fleet.

    Or give us Avaloren as another archetypical fantasy world with a different spin as well as new races.

    Keep things grounded please.
    If they've the writing skills that made MoP it hasn't shown at all in DF.
    MoP had a depth that isn't existent in DF.
    Otherwise, hell yes to Tel’Abim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    Nobody would look at the Ethereals and say they’re alien unless they were told. At most they’d say they’re ghosts, just magical beings, and/or a kind of mummy. Even with their technology.

    A light invasion is almost certainly going to have these running/flying around.



    According to you the “casual gamer” can’t tell the difference between black & purple… so I’m pretty sure those same people would think it’s an alien invasion.
    Well no, because we’re used to Draenei technology. Again, we’ve had Draenei as a playable race for almost 20 years.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    Not interested in a Light vs. Void expansion at all in the near future.

    Give us Tel’Abim as a continent with Arabic and West Asia influences. Deserts, jungles, monastery’s, cities of brass, bustling market places and bazaar’s. Enemies such as Ifrit, Djinn, ghouls etc. Give it a MoP feel, grounded and exploring a new land. Bring in Captain Nightsquall who was mentioned this expansion, as well as his dread pirate fleet.

    Or give us Avaloren as another archetypical fantasy world with a different spin as well as new races.

    Keep things grounded please.
    If you want to go that grounded, we could always do an Undermine expansion.

  4. #5984
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    Not interested in a Light vs. Void expansion at all in the near future.

    Give us Tel’Abim as a continent with Arabic and West Asia influences. Deserts, jungles, monastery’s, cities of brass, bustling market places and bazaar’s. Enemies such as Ifrit, Djinn, ghouls etc. Give it a MoP feel, grounded and exploring a new land. Bring in Captain Nightsquall who was mentioned this expansion, as well as his dread pirate fleet.

    Or give us Avaloren as another archetypical fantasy world with a different spin as well as new races.

    Keep things grounded please.
    Don’t get me wrong I would love another grounded expansion. Ideally I would like somewhat of a world revamp expansion for the 20th anniversary.

    They could merge a lot of the zones into their in-canon regions (Lordaeron, Quel’thalas, Khaz Modan.) and slowly do it over the course of the expansion.
    However, for something like that a new class. (Tinker, or some other WC3 class) & races (Naga and Mok'nathal?) would’ve been cool, but no shot we’d be getting both of those so soon after DF.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

  5. #5985
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Well no, because we’re used to Draenei technology. Again, we’ve had Draenei as a playable race for almost 20 years.
    But this is the """Casual Gamer""" we’re talking about. According to you the casual gamer that can’t tell the difference between death and void, and we’ve been dealing with both of those for longer than Draenei.

    Surely those """Casual Gamers""" would wonder why there are aliens invading their game with their mech suits and space ships.
    Last edited by Nightshade711; 2023-05-18 at 12:12 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

  6. #5986
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    But this is the """Casual Gamer""" we’re talking about. According to you the casual gamer that can’t tell the difference between death and void, and we’ve been dealing with both of those for longer than Draenei.
    Surely those """Casual Gamers""" would wonder why there are aliens invading their game with their mech suits and spade ships.
    Um, some casual gamers play as Draenei themselves, so they don't view the Draenei or their tech as alien. Again, you're talking about a race that's been playable in WoW for almost 20 years.

  7. #5987
    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmicpreds View Post
    Besides, WoW went Cosmic in its first expac lmao
    I see tbc overall as big a mistake as that silly cosmic chart.
    But to be fair alot of the original lore was just wrong to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Um, some casual gamers play as Draenei themselves, so they don't view the Draenei or their tech as alien. Again, you're talking about a race that's been playable in WoW for almost 20 years.
    Weird, you don’t really see any Draenei technology like the mechs or flying space ships. The casual gamer might not know that the Exodar is a space ship… especially if you do Exile’s reach.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    Weird, you don’t really see any Draenei technology like the mechs or flying space ships. The casual gamer might not know that the Exodar is a space ship… especially if you do Exile’s reach.
    If they do Exile's Reach. I'm willing to bet that the majority of casuals have been playing WoW before Shadowlands, so they played the Draenei starting zone.

  10. #5990
    Quote Originally Posted by Santandame View Post
    continent with Arabic and West Asia influences.
    india themed continent seems long overdue

  11. #5991
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Um, some casual gamers play as Draenei themselves, so they don't view the Draenei or their tech as alien. Again, you're talking about a race that's been playable in WoW for almost 20 years.
    So casuals have varying levels of observational clarity depending on what serves your current claim best?

  12. #5992
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    I see tbc overall as big a mistake as that silly cosmic chart.
    But to be fair alot of the original lore was just wrong to me.
    Don’t get me wrong BC lore was all over the place… but I would love an expansion sort of like that again where the cosmic conflict is something happening in the background.

    If we get a soft “void” expansion like the Shadowguard/Void Ethereals invading, we could get that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    If they do Exile's Reach. I'm willing to bet that the majority of casuals have been playing WoW before Shadowlands, so they played the Draenei starting zone.
    If you skip the intro & don’t read quest text like most casual gamers you’re probably going to miss that the Exodar is a space ship.

    Besides your logic makes no sense. Casual gamers won’t know the difference between death and void (where both have been around longer than the Draenei), but they’d instantly know that flying mech suits & working space ships aren’t alien?
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

  13. #5993
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    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    So casuals have varying levels of observational clarity depending on what serves your current claim best?
    So you honestly think someone (casual or not) playing WoW for 5-10 years is going to view a race that’s been available for play that entire span of time as “alien”?

  14. #5994
    Titans should have remained a mystery for far longer than it did.
    Legion expac wouldn't have been created as "soon." The ground game should have kept running. "Legion" and "the Burning Crusade" might be combined. The Draenei and Ethereals, with their advanced tech and abilities (looking into psychic abilities of a sort) would play well to balance out the destructive power of the Legion.

  15. #5995
    Quote Originally Posted by Scyth View Post
    As cliche as it might be I'd actually love to have light-themed villains so wouldn't be against Yrel or whoever else being the main villains of the next xpac.
    I'd love for it if only for the aesthetics of the gear and enemies. It'd be nice to fight something not elemental, undead, or crude iron.

  16. #5996
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    So you honestly think someone (casual or not) playing WoW for 5-10 years is going to view a race that’s been available for this play that entire span of time as “alien”?
    Given that the Draenei literally are aliens with alien technology, yes.
    But this is getting derailed.

    There’s little to no chance Blizzard brings back Yrel, despite the speculation. If Murozond was an actual final boss then maybe I could see him pulling a sneaky, but it’s clear that he is being dealt with.

    At most I’d see a "LiGhT BaD" thing happening after a void expansion. Or they continue the “the light and void are horrors in each others eyes” plot from the Legion audiobook and we choose a side.
    For villains for the The “zealous light” would probably just be something like the reformed Scarlet Crusade. The void would be the Void Ethereals/Shadowguard.
    Last edited by Nightshade711; 2023-05-18 at 01:03 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    If you skip the intro & don’t read quest text like most casual gamers you’re probably going to miss that the Exodar is a space ship.
    Even if you skip the text, there’s Draenei tech all over the place and throughout the leveling experience. The point is that Draenei tech isn’t going to be viewed as alien to WoW players. They’ve been playable for too long for that to happen.

    Besides your logic makes no sense. Casual gamers won’t know the difference between death and void (where both have been around longer than the Draenei), but they’d instantly know that flying mech suits & working space ships aren’t alien?
    You really think it’s illogical that someone will just lump shadow stuff together and not see a nuance between the two? You really believe it’s illogical that a casual player wouldn’t view Draenei as alien, but view a floating energy mummy that uses energy weapons as alien/cosmic? C’mon now.

    Also, mechs and flying suits have been around since WC3, and Draenei aren’t the only race that uses them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    There’s little to no chance Blizzard brings back Yrel, despite the speculation. If Murozond was an actual final boss then maybe I could see him pulling a sneaky, but it’s clear that he is being dealt with.
    Little to no chance that a well known light-aligned villain can come back in an expansion where rumors of light and dark are possible themes?

    Seriously?

  18. #5998
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Even if you skip the text, there’s Draenei tech all over the place and throughout the leveling experience. The point is that Draenei tech isn’t going to be viewed as alien to WoW players. They’ve been playable for too long for that to happen.
    Wasn’t one of the big complaints about Legion (especially Argus) was that it was too “Sci-fi” with all the alien mech suits & space ships?

    You really think it’s illogical that someone will just lump shadow stuff together and not see a nuance between the two?
    Yes. Because visually they’re completely different. Don’t need to read any lore to tell the difference between purple tentacle void & black chains and skulls.

    You really believe it’s illogical that a casual player wouldn’t view Draenei as alien, but view a floating energy mummy that uses energy weapons as alien/cosmic? C’mon now.
    It’s illogical to think that a casual player wouldn’t think the Draenei space ships & mechs are alien, when according to you a casual player can’t tell two very visually distinct kinds of magic/forces apart.

    And no, an Ethereal doesn’t look alien in the slightest. They look more like ghosts or mummies that would probably fit visually in places like Uldum. Like this.


    Also, mechs and flying suits have been around since WC3, and Draenei aren’t the only race that uses them.
    All of those were mechanical and steampunk. Unlike the sci-fi esque energy-based mechs & weapons.

    Little to no chance that a well known light-aligned villain can come back in an expansion where rumors of light and dark are possible themes?

    Seriously?
    Yes.
    Yrel being a villain isn’t that well known outside of the forums and speculation. Given that she only shows up in a very quick and short scenario to unlock an allied race that a very small fraction of the players play.

    What makes more sense. A villain that pops up for at most 30 minutes of gameplay (that most don’t experience) to never be heard of again… or well known villains from classic, such as the Scarlet Crusade?

    Besides, Yrel has no way to get to Azeroth. She doesn’t have the Hourglass to reopen the way to our timeline.
    Last edited by Nightshade711; 2023-05-18 at 01:24 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Chen isn't a Monk
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Uh Demon Hunters literally had an ability called Spellbreaker.

  19. #5999
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Even if you skip the text, there’s Draenei tech all over the place and throughout the leveling experience. The point is that Draenei tech isn’t going to be viewed as alien to WoW players. They’ve been playable for too long for that to happen.
    As some one who has been playing since TBC Draenei tech is incredibly alien to the rest of wow.

    Hard light constructs, space ships, beaming people down, orbital lasers, advance combat mechs, ect.

    In TBC they got a bit more leeway due to every thing being a wreck and them not having alot of functioning tech but from Wod-legion they totally feel like an advance alien race not a fantasy one like the rest of wows races.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade711 View Post
    Wasn’t one of the big complaints about Legion (especially Argus) was that it was too “Sci-fi” with all the alien mech suits & space ships?
    Yeah, seven years ago on Argus. A Yrel invasion would take place on Azeroth, and since AU Draenor will be dead or destroyed, we’ll be on Azeroth the entire expansion. Probably on Avaloren.

    Yes. Because visually they’re completely different. Don’t need to read any lore to tell the difference between purple tentacle void & black chains and skulls.
    We fought Faceless Ones in Northrend during WotLK. They didn’t stand out at all from the undead thematics. Why? Because it’s all shadow magic.


    It’s illogical to think that a casual player wouldn’t think the Draenei space ships & mechs are alien, when according to you a casual player can’t tell two very visually distinct kinds of magic/forces apart.
    Nearly 20 years of playing a race will do that to people.

    And no, an Ethereal doesn’t look alien in the slightest. They look more like ghosts or mummies that would probably fit visually in places like Uldum. Like this.
    That’s simply your bias showing. Again, you’re talking about a race who looks nothing like other WoW races. It’s nonsense to say a floating energy creature that uses energy weapons doesn’t look alien in a game with Orcs and Elves.



    Yes.
    Yrel being a villain isn’t that well known outside of the forums and speculation. Given that she only shows up in a very quick and short scenario to unlock an allied race that a very small fraction of the players play.
    Uh Yrel appears throughout Blizzard media. She also appeared in Hearthstone, and Heroes of the Storm.

    What makes more sense. A villain that pops up for at most 30 minutes of gameplay (that most don’t experience) to never be heard of again… or well known villains from classic, such as the Scarlet Crusade?
    Uh Yrel. She’s WAY more popular than a bunch of Scarlet Crusaders. It’s not even close.

    Besides, Yrel has no way to get to Azeroth. She doesn’t have the Hourglass to reopen the way to our timeline.
    Yeah, because Blizzard couldn’t take care of that “problem” with a single sentence of lore.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    As some one who has been playing since TBC Draenei tech is incredibly alien to the rest of wow.

    Hard light constructs, space ships, beaming people down, orbital lasers, advance combat mechs, ect.

    In TBC they got a bit more leeway due to every thing being a wreck and them not having alot of functioning tech but from Wod-legion they totally feel like an advance alien race not a fantasy one like the rest of wows races.
    And I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm saying that due to familiarity with the race, its not as "alien" as these guys;



    They don't even have faces.

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