The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Xilurm]

What reason would be there to skip WoD remix?

[Santandame]

Remix goal is to fill the gap between expansions or patches, it won't be announced as a feature of an expansion.

Fair enough.

I would like the Mage Tower to return with Midnight and even be expanded upon. I think Midnight would be the most fitting return for that. Could even have it be at the Magister’s Terrace which in essence would feel like an evolution of the Mage Tower.

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What reason would be there to skip WoD remix?

That we’re likely to be getting it in TWW and not Midnight.

DF - MoP
TWW - WoD
Midnight - Legion

[Lady Atia]

I hope TWW being content lite bodes well for a lot of heavy hitting features in Midnight. I am concerned though that we might not get Ethereal in Midnight. If we don't get Ethereals in Midnight then I worry we'll never get them. As much as I want a Forest Troll option, them being the lone announced Allied Race like the Earthen, will be very underwhelming.

If the Midnight announcement features:

Allied/New Races - Ethereal, Naga, Amani Trolls
Player Housing
Class Skins
Expanded Timewalking
Legion Remix

Then I think we'd be cooking.

Tbf I think the s1 rogue set basically kills playable Ethereals (for Midnight atleast) as you can use it to basically look quite close to one already thanks to that. And why should they design that if they already know they would do playable Ethereals just one Expansion later? Besides that, I can't really think of many customization options for them, which may be another factor (even though we atleast get a female one in the raid).

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Remix goal is to fill the gap between expansions or patches, it won't be announced as a feature of an expansion.

This. Also I still think the next remix will either be TBC or classic focused (since we already datamined a lot of t1 and tbc recolours, and they could use it to give us an HD ashes of alar mount). MoP remix showed that "modern" expansions work quite well with the format, so even if the older expansion would flop more they can still go back to do Legion or Shadowlands later (because Shadowlands in remix format would actually be good since it would be compressed and give us three very good raids on top of 10 m+ dungeons). WoD remix can for sure work too because the WoD raids were also quite good, and the transmog was good too (and they could even give us missing mythic versions of the tier colours) but the mounts were shit there and we don't really have that many unreleased recolours there soooo I rather would see it later.

[Dracullus]

What reason would be there to skip WoD remix?

Nothing. Not only it has better leveling and instances (and Remix is all about these things), but also it would be opportuniy to introduce recolors to all these faction mounts we should get instead of boars. But in current form Remix should remain one per expac thing, grinds are fun if they are not overused.

Imo Midnight main feature will be housing, Last Titan - Tinker (titan themed) and class content again. As for more minor stuff, I would expect account-wide professions, likely 2nd try on delves (TWW is first iteration, very likely they will fuck up many things), some deep changes to raids to make it as attractive as M+.

I don't think we should consider races as big feature, it's just skin.

And I don't understand why people expect revolution while game is doing great (beside story - which is thing we hope most to improve in TWW and saga in general). You do deep changes when game is bleeding.

[Lady Atia]

Nothing. Not only it has better leveling and instances (and Remix is all about these things), but also it would be opportuniy to introduce recolors to all these faction mounts we should get instead of boars. But in current form Remix should remain one per expac thing, grinds are fun if they are not overused.

Imo Midnight main feature will be housing, Last Titan - Tinker (titan themed) and class content again. As for more minor stuff, I would expect account-wide professions, likely 2nd try on delves (TWW is first iteration, very likely they will fuck up many things), some deep changes to raids to make it as attractive as M+.

I don't think we should consider races as big feature, it's just skin.

And I don't understand why people expect revolution while game is doing great (beside story - which is thing we hope most to improve in TWW and saga in general). You do deep changes when game is bleeding.

Tbf, the only recolours I remember that could be interesting are the ravager and dreadraven mounts. Maybe another take at a felgronn (because it's always straight up dumb to give specific types or colours of mounts to gladiators only). Most stuff from MoP was just there sitting in the data, only the achievement rewards were actually new recolours.

Legion has a lot of stormdrakes that were gladiator only, aswell as the eagle, felbats, ur'zuls, the four horseman steeds, felstalkers and they could finally free certain class mounts from being spec-coded. Maybe give us a nightmare dragon and nightmare bear to round it up.

BfA has growgs, bees, longboys without AH function, pterrordaxes, un-armoured hipos (which were only used for one pvp mount), the never implemented pvp hyena. Maybe give us un-armoured BfA protodrakes although I'm not sure how much work that would be as they prolly aren't skinned under the gladiator armour.

[ImTheMizAwesome]

WoD would work great as remix event, the overall fun and feeling i bet would be even greater in shorter event than when it was current expansion.

As for TWW, i find it kinda boring after watching previews and streams, i didn't bought it yet and probably won't now on release, i will wait until they add +30 days of gametime to basic edition, like they did with DF like month after release but not sure yet.
Probably it will also depend for me, on what will be available in trading post as monthly reward.

Hero talents visuals for classes i play are hardly there, the fantasy blizzard talked about is also hardly there, it was one of the features i was waiting for the most, so meh.

Delves i didn't care much about before alpha went live and after watching some videos besides some cool cosmetics and mount, the gameplay is not that great.

Midnight and Last titan these im already waiting for much more, without even knowing the new gameplay stuff they will have included.

[Santandame]

What is the appeal of remix anyway? Is it the levelling? I checked out remix this weekend and I got a priest to 62 in about 5 hours and I didn’t finish a single zone. I did about 2 chapters in Jade Forest, two in Valley, and a handful of quests in Dread Wastes. Surely you’d get more of a complete Pandaria levelling experience on retail?

If it’s just for the cosmetics then fair enough. But it very much feels like a whirlwind race with very little experience of the actual content. Great for levelling quick though.

[Sondrelk]

What is the appeal of remix anyway? Is it the levelling? I checked out remix this weekend and I got a priest to 62 in about 5 hours and I didn’t finish a single zone. I did about 2 chapters in Jade Forest, two in Valley, and a handful of quests in Dread Wastes. Surely you’d get more of a complete Pandaria levelling experience on retail?

If it’s just for the cosmetics then fair enough. But it very much feels like a whirlwind race with very little experience of the actual content. Great for levelling quick though.

It's something different.
Sure, you could go into MoP raids on Retail and crush bosses easily and skip all of that annoying gear upgrading and such, but there is a psychological benefit to actually having a reason to go there.
Timerunning gives absolute tons of transmog, mounts, and in general a much easier way to gain the rewards of a specific expansion. All neatly wrapped up in a contained package, making the experience feel much more like Classic-lite compared to regular Timewalking.

In short, it's mostly the psychological effect of constraining the player to MoP along with loads of other people, which makes it feel like you are actually progressing and experiencing the content of the expansion, even if the power level of everyone involved makes it a shallow replica of the actual MoP.

[Scyth]

What is the appeal of remix anyway? Is it the levelling? I checked out remix this weekend and I got a priest to 62 in about 5 hours and I didn’t finish a single zone. I did about 2 chapters in Jade Forest, two in Valley, and a handful of quests in Dread Wastes. Surely you’d get more of a complete Pandaria levelling experience on retail?

If it’s just for the cosmetics then fair enough. But it very much feels like a whirlwind race with very little experience of the actual content. Great for levelling quick though.

First character I leveled in remix I did mostly through questing and as someone who never played MoP it was really fun.

But cosmetics are the main appeal I guess and there's a ton of them. Zones are great and the raids are fun too and it's fun to feel OP lol

[Darkarath]

Yeah I am enjoying Remix, but if it were not for the cosmetics, I would barely touch it. I guess that for people that did not play MoP it is a cool addition, but if they do another one, they would have to add something more to it, as the excitement for a new "feature" will not be there.

My hope is that MoP Remix is a one time thing, an experiment to eventually evolve Timewalking as a whole in Retail.

[SkyTides]

I'd be up for WoD remix - the levelling campaign was really good and there's plenty of models they can use as recolors for rewards (since they were so stingy with them at the time)

I am so ready for TWW to start now. I got all the collectables I wanted from Mop remix and was planning on squeezing a month of Dawntrail in, until a big vet bill happened.

On the subject of TWW - I agree it is feature-light. We can only hope DF set a new precedent in adding some big-ish features during its patches (new spec, Trader's Log etc)

[Sondrelk]

Yeah I am enjoying Remix, but if it were not for the cosmetics, I would barely touch it. I guess that for people that did not play MoP it is a cool addition, but if they do another one, they would have to add something more to it, as the excitement for a new "feature" will not be there.

My hope is that MoP Remix is a one time thing, an experiment to eventually evolve Timewalking as a whole in Retail.

It definitely needs the rewards. Though I can think of very few things in WoW which people would do in the complete absence of rewards.

I think the more telling thing here is that there are loads of people who play the gamemode with only a tiny incentive from the rewards. Or keep going even for the tiniest scraps left.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Shorts will be released soon (3 weeks) they will be about
1. Earthen
2. Hallowfall (most about the new DEI character )
3. Nerubian and Xal'atath
According to the source, it will be well written about the Earthen, the other two will be cringe...

Cringe level equal to "Star Wars Acolyte"

I'm a little disappointed, I thought that Alleria and Thrall would get their shorts, zero hype level

And this "source" of yours comes from the posterior, where you promptly pulled this from.

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What reason would be there to skip WoD remix?

Personally, I'd prefer a proper MoP/WoD Classic rather than a limited time event. I don't mind these "Remix" versions though.

[Lady Atia]

It's something different.
Sure, you could go into MoP raids on Retail and crush bosses easily and skip all of that annoying gear upgrading and such, but there is a psychological benefit to actually having a reason to go there.
Timerunning gives absolute tons of transmog, mounts, and in general a much easier way to gain the rewards of a specific expansion. All neatly wrapped up in a contained package, making the experience feel much more like Classic-lite compared to regular Timewalking.

In short, it's mostly the psychological effect of constraining the player to MoP along with loads of other people, which makes it feel like you are actually progressing and experiencing the content of the expansion, even if the power level of everyone involved makes it a shallow replica of the actual MoP.

Also you can get new cosmetics aswell as cosmetics in generel for your retail characters, something you can't do with "classic" titles (which is also the reason I will never touch these).

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It definitely needs the rewards. Though I can think of very few things in WoW which people would do in the complete absence of rewards.

I think the more telling thing here is that there are loads of people who play the gamemode with only a tiny incentive from the rewards. Or keep going even for the tiniest scraps left.

Yeah, remember micro-holidays? The things were someone at Blizzard really thought people would do stuff in WoW without rewards .... and to this day the only micro-holidays I see people talking about are the ones with the tiniest bit of reward (wanderers festival for the pet and the quiraji holiday because you can run aq20 and aq40 with an alt and get some easy xp there lol). All the others were literally a waste of time that no one cares about.

[Santandame]

Yeah, remember micro-holidays? The things were someone at Blizzard really thought people would do stuff in WoW without rewards .... and to this day the only micro-holidays I see people talking about are the ones with the tiniest bit of reward (wanderers festival for the pet and the quiraji holiday because you can run aq20 and aq40 with an alt and get some easy xp there lol). All the others were literally a waste of time that no one cares about.

Disagree with micro holidays. They add some much needed flavour to the world. Even the ones that didn’t have rewards, I’d check out at least once. I’d like to see more of them.

I’m all for as much content, meaningful or trivial, as possible in the old world.

Add world quests to EK/Kalimdor, give us soup style events, micro holidays, expanded time walking etc. They are so wasted currently.

[Teriz]

What? No, that has nothing to do with the issue at all. Sure, I'm considering making a Mage or Warlock Dracthyr when that happens, but I still wouldn't be able to play an Evoker without being forced to use a clown suit in combat.

I know it's an unpopular opinion, but I actually like the dragon form in theory, and I'm fine with the idea behind the barber shop armor. But when you can't even make it match well with the gear that's made specifically for Evokers, it's clear that the current implementation isn't good enough.

I don't know how difficult it'd be to implement, but I think the best way to address this would be to split the Armor Color choice into three color options, so you can choose your own color for each part of the armor instead of picking a premade combination. That way you could just create a mix to fit any set, like- for an example that annoyed me personally a lot- you could choose green and bronze instead of green and silver, so it would actually match the Heroic Amirdrassil set.

It'd also be amazing if they added more unlockable barbershop armor options over time, but I don't see that happening, at least not frequently. It would also help if they let you choose different transmogs for each form. Regardless, the current implementation definitely isn't adequate- it makes it difficult to enjoy a class that I otherwise liked.

You're welcome to that opinion. The point behind this entire discussion though was that even if you're personally not playing the new class, new classes affect the game in a variety of ways. The lack of a new class is definitely a lack of a major new feature for the game. Are they always required? No, but if you're not adding something like a new class, some other new features should be in place to pick up the slack. I'm not seeing that in TWW.

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I actually like Earthen and I’m glad they’re being included. I will play one.

However, anyone arguing that they aren’t a low effort inclusion are just being disingenuous. Just Earthen alone as an allied race was completely underwhelming at launch.

Now if Blizzard had gone down a similar route for allied races in TWW as they did with BfA and we got Earthen, Harronir, and Ascended Nerubians with new customisation options for older races such as Half Elves, skinny humans and some other blatant free wins then that would have been a lot more palatable.

Exactly. It's actually shocking that Harronir and Nerubians haven't already been announced as ARs.

[Ersula]

Exactly. It's actually shocking that Harronir and Nerubians haven't already been announced as ARs.

It's partially that "keep everything secret" mentality Holly Longdale has, partly that the Harronir barely exist in the launch storyline despite being in trailers, and partly sometimes an expansion features a race that for every reason should have been an allied race (Venthyr, Rajani, Tuskaar) but they apparently forget & we never get them.

[Kiivar86]

It has been a while but I don't recall them revealing every single allied race at the get-go, just the initial wave of them. So I wouldn't be surprised by them not announcing others right now too.

Like, that'd be like them going "Vulpera will be an allied race!" before the launch of BfA and most people being "...who?"

Let's have them be introduced first, eh?

[Santandame]

It's partially that "keep everything secret" mentality Holly Longdale has, partly that the Harronir barely exist in the launch storyline despite being in trailers, and partly sometimes an expansion features a race that for every reason should have been an allied race (Venthyr, Rajani, Tuskaar) but they apparently forget & we never get them.

There are so many free wins that Blizzard could have implemented in previous expansions with Allied Races.

8.3 in BfA should have brought the Rajani Mogu at the very least. They’re a pretty highly requested race who would have given something different to the Horde had they been added. There’s clear, distinguished female models and they had a built in “capital” with pretty much anywhere in the Vale from Mogu’shan Palace to the Guo-Lai Halls.

Dragonflight has multiple to choose from in regards to Tuskaar, Gnolls and Drakonids. Centaur too, possibly though I’m not sure about the physics but Dracthyr I suppose throw that argument out of the window.

The Shadowlands races I’m iffy about due to lore reasons, but I’m not a WoW lore head so I will always opt for the rule of cool over sensibilities within the lore so I’d have been all for Kyrian & Venthyr being added.

I was of the belief that the Allied Race system was going to be a a system that Blizzard would add to with each expansion and I find it perplexing that it was abandoned for so long with the first return we get to it years later being the Earthen of all things.

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It has been a while but I don't recall them revealing every single allied race at the get-go, just the initial wave of them. So I wouldn't be surprised by them not announcing others right now too.

Like, that'd be like them going "Vulpera will be an allied race!" before the launch of BfA and most people being "...who?"

Let's have them be introduced first, eh?

Well, at BfA announcement we got Lightforged, Dark Irons, Void Elves, Highmountain, Nightborne and Zandalari announced. Prior to launch, Mag’har were also announced with the knowledge that Zandalari were being pushed back and we’d be getting Kul Tirans with them. So before the expansion even launched that’s 8 races we knew we were getting.

I’m all for the Earthen being included as an allied race, I may even main one. But you can’t deny Earthen of all races as the sole announced race is a completely tepid announcement. If Harronir and the Nerubians are intended to be playable, then there’s no negative to Blizzard saying something like they previously would with something along the lines of “ deep below Khaz Algar, we meet the primal, nature affiliated Harronir, the missing link between the Trolls and Elves, once we gain their trust, they’ll join us in return.” And something similar with liberating the Nerubians. It would have created far more hype as evidenced by the thread discussing this.

It’s not like the Harronir are intended to be a mystery. They’re in the cgi trailer with their presumed leader being one of the primary characters of the story.

Blizzard announcing the Vulpera as a playable allied race and the fans going “…who?” is no different to Blizzard announcing the Draenei, Pandaren and Dracthyr with the fans not knowing who or what they are.

[Makorus]

The Earthen are the only race we probably help and deal with in the launch window though.

It literally wouldn't make sense to have any other Allied Race yet. We don't really liberate or help the Nerubians until after the raid, and we barely interact with the Harronir.

Obviously Harronir are going to be an Allied Race, I still am not sold on Nerubians, but even if they were, it wouldn't be at launch.

They never said there wouldn't be any more Allied Races, just that "there is nothing more to announce".