The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Darkarath]

1. The hero talents are an expansion of the existing talent system introduced in DF. I wouldn't consider that a new feature either. We were going to get 10 additional talent points anyway, Blizzard simply found a new way to implement those 10 additional talents. Don't get me wrong, I like the idea, but considering it on par with a brand new talent system is ridiculous.

2.Dragonriding for additional mounts was implemented in Dragonflight. It's not a new feature, but instead a continuation of something we were already getting.

3. An allied race is simply not comparable to a completely new race. Earthen are essentially dwarves with a new model and new racials. Dracthyr were a completely new model and unlike any previous class we had. They were also the first new race completely attached to a new class.

4. Comparing Delves to a new class is laughable. Delves are essentially Scenarios 2.0.

5. I'll give you Warbands as a legitimate new feature.

In the end, the point still stands; TWW is lacking in new features compared to Dragonflight.

Oh, I was not listing the features of DF and TWW as a one-to-one comparison. I was merely naming every new feature or ''new thing''. Although now that I see the format in which I wrote it I understand the confusion.

I agree with most of your criticism, I am especially concerned about Hero Talents, as it is a feature that might make the game worst for certain players and there will not be a way to turn back after they are implemented.

I do not share your opinion about Delves. You might be right, but until we test them properly I will not pass judgment.

Expansions just being new content and not bringing completely new features every time is... fine I think? Like, don't get me wrong, I absolutely love figuring out/digging into new features but I'm not sure it's healthy for the game if they just keep pumping out new features, especially if it creates a bigger load for maintaining them in the future, which already shows its face every time when they do add a new feature either having to disable it in old content entirely or having to add workarounds.

This is a very good point. I always want more evergreen features but WoW is an old game with tons of content. It could be overwhelming.

I am ok with TWW refining current systems, which it is what it seems to be doing. Every time they make an expansion they add Dungeons, Raids, Zones, thousands of quests, QoL improvements, at least a new feature... It is a lot. Keep building on what we have, for example:

- The Timewalking system has so much potential, keep building it. Expand it to raids, cut raids in pieces and make them dungeons, give us reasons to re-explore those all zones and questlines again.
- PvP has been abandoned, but Plunderstorm showed that it could be innovative and successful. More of this, please.
- Professions in general need to be evolved, DF's revamp has to be the first step of years of updates. They NEED to be their own thing, like Dungeons, Raids and PvP, which ATM they are not.
- Warbands are coming, and it is a good system, but already lacking. We know that it is going to be expanded to past expansions. Keep adding account-wide achievements, currencies, and of course, professions.
- Archeology and the Brawler's Guild are coming back as evergreen systems. This is good. Hopefully they get it right this time.
- Regarding races, I guess that I have the impopular opinion that they should have stop adding them a while ago. They keep giving us Allied Races which bring nothing to the the table and could have been Race customizations instead. Which is what they should be doing. Bring every race to the level of customization of Dracthyrs. This should have been done yesterday.

[Zardas]

they didn't even pick a cool one. no one asked for another dwarf reskin.

I did, anything drawven is cool.

[Reive]

I did, anything drawven is cool.

the new dwarf race doesn't even have the classic dwarven accent, they're not cool at all

[KOUNTERPARTS]

they didn't even pick a cool one. no one asked for another dwarf reskin.

Players, both current and former, have been asking for playable Earthen dwarves since WotLK. This is the same lame argument people made against Dark Iron dwarves even though people were asking to play as them since vanilla WoW.

[Zardas]

the new dwarf race doesn't even have the classic dwarven accent, they're not cool at all

I'm gonna have to wait to try them to check I'm affraid.

[Ersula]

Genuine question: Am I supposed to be hyped for one allied race?

Are we forgetting that BfA brought 10 allied races? Why are we fine with only 1 allied race when we used to get 10 in the past?

I at least hope Harronir Elves will be playable in a later patch.

Okay but that was 10 allied race spread out over a 24 month period. (Nightborne, Void elves, Highmountain Tauren & Lightforged Draenei were January 2018 - Mechagnomes & Vulpera where January 2020) assuming TWW follows the the Dragonflight model, we can expect a substantial feature every minor patch. (Since everyone here seems to be counting things like Time Rifts as exciting features, apparently.)

[Skildar]

To me the expectations were about the existing races. It's going to be 10 years since WoD race model rework. The game has aged a lot since then. We've seen what Diablo IV character creation can do, they then have the skills to do more impressive designs while staying true to their craft.

It would have been a great time to show steps toward this. But when you peek at earthen charcater creation you very quickly realize how underwhelming it is compared to the Dracthyr one.

At the same time there has been room for a new type of outdoor PvE gameplay that encourages team ups. But the answer they've found is Delve which shows a weak response to fun activity endgame pillar. I see they've structured into delve the intention of all activities we've had on the Dragon isles. But the end result is that we don't get the fun part of any of those that worked nor do you get the mmo-aspect of these outdoor contents.

If anything delves seem to be a step backward and will end like scenari, island exploration, Thorghast. An expansion feature that doesn't get carried over the next one. It was presented as evergreen but island explorations and the other examples could have very been presented that way either.

An armor and character visual upgrade should be on their priority list for the coming expansions. The game is aging fast and I'm not impressed at all with the latest coat-robes model we got this expansion when FF XIV managed something looking better since ARR (or maybe launch). These coat-robe look really bad on a lot of races (i.e. pandaren), don't have any thickness, have their texture cut (check DF s3 shaman).

[Raetary]

the new dwarf race doesn't even have the classic dwarven accent, they're not cool at all

On the one hand you complain that it's dwarf #3, but then go ahead complaining about them not being classically dwarven enough.
Maybe pick a lane?

I personally find them rather cool.
Getting to play a titanforged is a nice prospect and i find their characterization and world building to be quite compelling.

[FelPlague]

But is it like the Dragonflight one, where the one shown at Blizzcon & the launch cinematic were originally meant to be one cinematic? Seems like the two TWW we have now are the equivalent to the two we got for Dragonflight.

They were never meant to be 1 cinematic, that wouldn't make any sense, how would razageth and the horde/alliance both show up right after the dragon isles were opened?

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they didn't even pick a cool one. no one asked for another dwarf reskin.

Earthen have been a fan favourite ask since wotlk.

[Reive]

On the one hand you complain that it's dwarf #3, but then go ahead complaining about them not being classically dwarven enough.
Maybe pick a lane?

I personally find them rather cool.
Getting to play a titanforged is a nice prospect and i find their characterization and world building to be quite compelling.

what i said in the post you just quoted doesn't contradict what i said about eartherns earlier. they were already lame. the lack of the classic scottish accent just makes them worse.

[FelPlague]

I'm saying that maybe we don't need the number of new features we got in DF, but getting a single AR is pathetic in comparison to what we've gotten in previous expansions.

Ah yes. A single allied race is pathetic compared to the previous expansions where we got 0 new races.

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what i said in the post you just quoted doesn't contradict what i said about eartherns earlier. they were already lame. the lack of the classic scottish accent just makes them worse.

They have a different accent cause idk if you know, but dwarves don't all have to be Scottish, these ones are Russian/Scottish.

[Reive]

Earthen have been a fan favourite ask since wotlk.

the crowd at the blizzcon went wild when they announced them, right?

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They have a different accent cause idk if you know, but dwarves don't all have to be Scottish, these ones are Russian/Scottish.

they have the classic american accent

[Teriz]

It is less effort, but we have seen things that take a lot of effort (Pandaren, Kul Tiran, Dracthyr) be very unpopular, so unpopular in fact that people to this day lie or are mistaken about how much effort went into Kul Tirans to downplay them.

That's not really an excuse though. Simply because something is deemed "unpopular" doesn't mean it shouldn't have been created. There's probably thousands of players who are playing WoW currently who wouldn't be playing if those "unpopular" additions weren't added.

I don't expect any more features for TWW besides Harronir, who will have crazy druid forms, Brawlers Guild introduced in an evergreen form, and maybe Earthen druids.

Which isn't something to harp about, because those things might not happen, and if they do happen, they still pale in comparison to 2 new races at launch, or a new class.

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Ah yes. A single allied race is pathetic compared to the previous expansions where we got 0 new races.

Which expansions are you talking about?

WoD and Shadowlands? Universally considered two of the worst expansions in the franchise?

At least WoD had updated graphics for the existing races.

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Depends on how you play the game. I haven't played Dracthyr yet and I don't thing they had any impact on my experience of the game.

Ultimately, it's pointless to discuss the impact of x or y feature because it all comes down to personnal preferences : personnaly I don't craft and haven't played dracthyr (yet), so those feautres might have not been shiped in DF and my experience would have been the same ; meanwhile I'm very much looking forward to the warband system and delves, as they perfectly aligned to how I play the game. But for someone else, the situation might be a complete opposite, so the impact of each of those features will drastically change if you go look through his personnal perpective of the game.

Despite you not personally playing an Evoker, Evokers have unquestionably effected and changed the game, especially in group content. So while you didn't personally roll the new class, your dungeons, raids, and PvP were undoubtedly effected by their presence, especially with them getting a support spec.

[Hitei]

Players, both current and former, have been asking for playable Earthen dwarves since WotLK. This is the same lame argument people made against Dark Iron dwarves even though people were asking to play as them since vanilla WoW.

People have asked to play as basically every mob in the game. That said, while the original statement was obviously hyperbolic, earthen (and dark irons), have never been even remotely popular asks. Like we won't even talk about being in the running for actual begged for races (ogres, naga, ethereals, vrykul etc.), Earthen don't even beat out more the more obscure and less popular asks like jinyu and hozen, murlocs, dryads, mok'nathal, saberon, botani, furbolgs and so on. Earthen (and I'm not exaggerating here) probably don't even make the top 30 for requested races.

"Players, both current and former, have been asking for playable Earthen dwarves since WotLK" is almost an even more hyperbolic stance than "no one asked for them". The handful of times they've ever even been brought up as a potential or want, it was typically not as a playable race, but in the context of subraces being added along with Dark Iron. They historically weren't even desirable enough to end up in most polls about what people would like added, and when not included, there was never really anyone posting "Hey, you forgot Earthen!".

Earthen have been a fan favourite ask since wotlk.

This is just outright fabrication. They have never been anywhere close to a fan favorite.

[Zardas]

they have the classic american accent

These kind of audio issues are only a "problem" in one specific language, hardly a big issue overall.

Despite you not personally playing an Evoker, Evokers have unquestionably effected and changed the game, especially in group content. So while you didn't personally roll the new class, your dungeons, raids, and PvP were undoubtedly effected by their presence, especially with them getting a support spec.

They have affected the game for those who play them or play with them. Personnaly I mostly play solo and I don't remember ever interacting with one.

Again, it's all a matter of how you play the game. You can't objectively judge the importance of a feature because said importance will drastically change for every player. I personnaly play a lot of pet battles, so for me the removal of the pet limit in 9.1 was one of the biggest feature of all time, yet I'm not gonna say that it is, because I realize that it's not for many players.

[Ersula]

Despite you not personally playing an Evoker, Evokers have unquestionably effected and changed the game, especially in group content. So while you didn't personally roll the new class, your dungeons, raids, and PvP were undoubtedly effected by their presence, especially with them getting a support spec.

If we're counting that then Hero Talents do the same thing on an exponentially higher scale.

[FelPlague]

the crowd at the blizzcon went wild when they announced them, right?

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they have the classic american accent

The same amount people went crazy for most races yep.

Not really.

[Teriz]

These kind of audio issues are only a "problem" in one specific language, hardly a big issue overall.



They have affected the game for those who play them or play with them. Personnaly I mostly play solo and I don't remember ever interacting with one.

Again, it's all a matter of how you play the game. You can't objectively judge the importance of a feature because said importance will drastically change for every player. I personnaly play a lot of pet battles, so for me the removal of the pet limit in 9.1 was one of the biggest feature of all time, yet I'm not gonna say that it is, because I realize that it's not for many players.

So you're saying that throughout the entire course of Dragonflight, you NEVER played a single instance, PvP or raiding?

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If we're counting that then Hero Talents do the same thing on an exponentially higher scale.

Incorrect, because we were getting 10 additional talents for each spec anyway. Blizzard simply took those 10 talents and gave them a thematic based on popular WC concepts.

[BaumanKing]

they have the classic american accent

And this is good. I don't think most players want to hear yet another stereotypical accent that could lead to problematic implications.

[Zardas]

So you're saying that throughout the entire course of Dragonflight, you NEVER played a single instance, PvP or raiding?

I haven't delved (pun intented) into DF much yet, so no raiding. I did a few dungeons, but with the solo system. And I don't do pvp.