The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Eldryth]

I do think Undermine is possible at this point, even though the evidence is vastly exaggerated here. Ultimately, it all comes down to some goblins coming here from Undermine- we can either deal with them locally or have to chase them.

With that said, I feel like there's too much important stuff left in Khaz Algar to see how it could fit in well. The Rootlands definitely should be major patch material, assuming it really is Elun'ahir. There's just too much linked to it for it to be anything less unless they want to completely ignore big plot hooks. The Harronir are one, of course- they have great potential and need to be fleshed out, especially if they really will be an Allied Race. And then there's Eonar and Elune- I don't know if we'd get answers on Elune herself, but at the very least it'd be a great opportunity to flesh out Eonar before the Pantheon comes in TLT (would be nice to get stuff about various Titans leading up to that, but Eonar feels especially important given the speculation that she might side with us over the others). Plus there's Freya and her Freysworn- Freya was sent to watch over Elun'ahir during the war with the Black Empire, and I don't think her followers being close by is a coincidence. It'd be a good chance to flesh them out, explain why the other Earthen seem to have an issue with them, and maybe even make Earthen Druids playable.

If they plan on trying to do that justice, that just leaves room for one other major patch. Which, sure, could be Undermine... but that leads to the question of where the Worldsoul itself fits in to the expansion focused on descending down to it. I know there's been some speculation that we might go there in TLT instead, but that really doesn't feel right to me- that's more of TWW's theme. No matter how I look at it, this should end with us fighting Xal'atath at the Worldsoul.

So it's hard to see how anything else can really fit. I can only think of two real possibilities, given what we know so far. Either the Goblin raid is us defending the Rootlands from them, and the second zone contains the Worldsoul... or the Goblins are an unrelated filler arc, and the Rootlands themselves border the Worldsoul, so we get that in 11.2 with a Worldsoul defense raid. I guess that way, we wouldn't repeat the whole "defending a World Tree" plotline again, but instead team up with them to fight Xal'atath (and establish that Eonar was, in fact, correct to hide the roots from Aman'thul). That route could work, though I'd prefer to not get filler like that when they're supposedly trying to give a more focused long-term narrative, and I liked the idea of going deeper with each new zone.

[Raetary]

I mean, they can always pull a 8.2 and release the Rootlands/Undermine together.

[Dracullus]

I mean, they can always pull a 8.2 and release the Rootlands/Undermine together.

It's no longer BfA/SL when threw anything in big patches. If they have 2 zones for tier 2, it will be split between 11.1 and 0.7/1.5.

[Enrif]

I mean, they can always pull a 8.2 and release the Rootlands/Undermine together.

I think this is the most likely scenario currently, with a ethereal/void/beledar raid being the finale of TWW, Rootlands and Undermine will probably be used in a short timeframe.

For all we know, the rootlands could actually be the antagonist and we have to defend Undermine. This would also alleviate the amirdrassil comparison, as we this time don't defend nature again, but have to stop it.

[Raetary]

It's no longer BfA/SL when threw anything in big patches

Look, something needs to give.

We have 4 major narrative points that are currently being setup post Azj'kahet.

There is the Beledar and its fall to Darkness.
There are the roots protruding into Khaz Algar, getting covered in black blood.
There is Goblin activity in Azj'kahet with a goblinraid file.
And there is the World Soul itself.

We have 2 major patches and, going by DF, 4 minor ones.
There will likely be 1 megadungeon and the final expansion raid will have to be the TWW climax with the world Soul.

This leaves 1 raid and 1 minor location to fill out.

The Rootlands, besides being already super fucking obvious, have had a bit of foreshadowing in DF, have setup with the druid Earthen in Dorne, and have setup with the Harronir questline that explores the black bloods effect and environmental damage.
The place is tied to Freya and Eonar, as well as Elune, so its loaded with major narrative significance.

So, for the life of me (heh) , i can't imagine that not being a major patch location.
Especially not in the context of the titan involvemenet in this whole saga.

Undermine and the gobs however have jackshit to do with any of that, their involvement is purely self centered.
If it wasn't for the goblinraid file, i would've put them as the 10.0.7 zone, but alas they have a presence in a future raid tier, which leads me to believe that a dual zone patch could be likely, with one of the minor patche either being left out or just be filler (Brawlers guild, maybe?)

I think the Beledar will be the megadungeon, with us cleansing/healing the Light creature within and Anduin regaining some of his faith.

Lastly, Xal reaches the Soul chamber and we get our World Soul climax.

[Dracullus]

snip

I think you misread me. I said, if we have Mechagon/Nazjatar situation, Blizzard won't throw them in single let's say 11.1 patch, but split between 11.1 + 11.0.7 or 11.1.5.

Personally yeah, I expect all three: underground goblin area (most likely Undermine), rootlands and core of azeroth (world soul chamber). Maybe goblin/rootlands will be combined, maybe there will be goblin or rootlands megadungeon, maybe 1 zone will be smaller forbidden reach zone.

[Enrif]

And there is the World Soul itself.

There will likely be 1 megadungeon and the final expansion raid will have to be the TWW climax with the world Soul.

Lastly, Xal reaches the Soul chamber and we get our World Soul climax.

Honestly. I'm not so sure about that. The World Soul raid/location might be left for TLT.

If i look at the story we know so far for TWW, we go after the nerubains first, because they work for Xal and attacked Dalaran. But we deal with them in the very first raid. The open plot hooks, as you mentioned, are the black blood roots (evil nature?) and the Beledar. The goblins are a sideshow at most at the moment, but they would tie nicely into the roots stuff due to proximity it seems. Which leaves us with a roots/goblin raid, and a beledar raid. And i think we might loose the beledar raid, and the light being in there turns fully to void, becomes an ally to Xal (or one absorbs the other), and that leads into Midnight.

The world soul, i doubt we deal with it in the very first expansion of the world soul saga. It might be left until TLT, where we "figure out what all these machines do that are slammed into azeroth" and there finally go to the world soul.

[Teriz]

Go back to pre-BfA lore and find me anything about the isles of Kul'Tiras and what existed outside the city.

From the RPG;

Kul Tiras is a large island off Khaz Modan's west coast, between Azeroth and Lordaeron, though is considered a land of this last continent. The unsettled areas are covered with rolling hills and sparse evergreen woods. Kul Tiras is temperate, though subject to sudden ocean storms. The nation is also very windy, which makes zeppelin rides perilous.[13] Kul Tiras' greatest asset is also its greatest danger. Murlocs and naga crawl from the sea to torment sailors and fishermen. Pirates roam the waters preying on merchant vessels.[14]

The nearby islands of Crestfall, immediately off the northeast coast, and farther Tol Barad, in the same direction, are also parts of Kul Tiras. Wild game includes a few forest creatures such as foxes, squirrels, and the occasional black bear. Kul Tiras' shores possess good fishing and provide ample seafood. There are excellent lobster and king crab in Kul Tiras.[13]

The city of Boralus, the town of Drisburg, and the former estate of Duke Falrevere are also found on the island.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Kul_Tiras

Blizzard can easily come out with stuff that exists outside undermine: mines, industries, farms, simply open areas. And if undermine it's a place where we'll invade and attack, we are most likely not going to be settled in there, so that means there will be a settlement outside undermine for us to make our base of operations on.

The thing is any mines, industries, etc. would all be part of Undermine, because such things have always been described as aspects of the city itself.

- - - Updated - - -

Look, something needs to give.

We have 4 major narrative points that are currently being setup post Azj'kahet.

There is the Beledar and its fall to Darkness.
There are the roots protruding into Khaz Algar, getting covered in black blood.
There is Goblin activity in Azj'kahet with a goblinraid file.
And there is the World Soul itself.

We have 2 major patches and, going by DF, 4 minor ones.
There will likely be 1 megadungeon and the final expansion raid will have to be the TWW climax with the world Soul.

This leaves 1 raid and 1 minor location to fill out.

The Rootlands, besides being already super fucking obvious, have had a bit of foreshadowing in DF, have setup with the druid Earthen in Dorne, and have setup with the Harronir questline that explores the black bloods effect and environmental damage.
The place is tied to Freya and Eonar, as well as Elune, so its loaded with major narrative significance.

So, for the life of me (heh) , i can't imagine that not being a major patch location.
Especially not in the context of the titan involvemenet in this whole saga.

Undermine and the gobs however have jackshit to do with any of that, their involvement is purely self centered.
If it wasn't for the goblinraid file, i would've put them as the 10.0.7 zone, but alas they have a presence in a future raid tier, which leads me to believe that a dual zone patch could be likely, with one of the minor patche either being left out or just be filler (Brawlers guild, maybe?)

I think the Beledar will be the megadungeon, with us cleansing/healing the Light creature within and Anduin regaining some of his faith.

Lastly, Xal reaches the Soul chamber and we get our World Soul climax.

Thing is, if there's a Goblin raid, it's going to be in a Goblin zone. We already have Gazlowe in the area, and we know that Gallywix slots well into the expansion due to his ties to the Venture Co and his obvious otherworldly dealings. Further, in terms of major lore locations in WoW, Undermine trumps a random forest zone rather easily.

Also Undermine got foreshadowing in DF and its receiving foreshadowing in TWW as well.

If anything, Rootlands will be a minor patch location (likely 11.0.5 or 11.0.7) and will complete the initial story arc of the expansion, with 11.1 beginning the next one with Undermine, and whatever comes in 11.1.5. Undermine simply has far more evidence as a major patch than the Rootlands, and the core of the evidence comes from the Goblin faction leader being in Khaz Algar, Undermine getting name dropped in Khaz Algar, Undermine being accessible to Khaz Algar in some way, Blizzard putting goblin assets in SoD, and the Goblinraid icon.

- - - Updated - - -

I think you misread me. I said, if we have Mechagon/Nazjatar situation, Blizzard won't throw them in single let's say 11.1 patch, but split between 11.1 + 11.0.7 or 11.1.5.

Personally yeah, I expect all three: underground goblin area (most likely Undermine), rootlands and core of azeroth (world soul chamber). Maybe goblin/rootlands will be combined, maybe there will be goblin or rootlands megadungeon, maybe 1 zone will be smaller forbidden reach zone.

Why wouldn't they simply drop Rootlands in patch 11.0.7 as a max zone like they did Forbidden Reach in 10.0.7?

[Nymrohd]

Ye. I can literally see guys who are notorious Teriz engagers (with his quotes in their sigs and stuff), suddenly coming to this thread simply because he is here and arguing with him for days. This is some fucked up symbiosis going on.

Imo they are worse than him. He will stop the rants after a couple of posts but there are a few posters here who mostly post to engage with him, preferably with screenwide posts that take it sentence by sentence.

- - - Updated - - -

The world soul, i doubt we deal with it in the very first expansion of the world soul saga. It might be left until TLT, where we "figure out what all these machines do that are slammed into azeroth" and there finally go to the world soul.

I think unveiling it now makes more sense given the underground theme, no?

- - - Updated - - -

Look, something needs to give.

We have 4 major narrative points that are currently being setup post Azj'kahet.

There is the Beledar and its fall to Darkness.
There are the roots protruding into Khaz Algar, getting covered in black blood.
There is Goblin activity in Azj'kahet with a goblinraid file.
And there is the World Soul itself.

We have 2 major patches and, going by DF, 4 minor ones.
There will likely be 1 megadungeon and the final expansion raid will have to be the TWW climax with the world Soul.

This leaves 1 raid and 1 minor location to fill out.

The Rootlands, besides being already super fucking obvious, have had a bit of foreshadowing in DF, have setup with the druid Earthen in Dorne, and have setup with the Harronir questline that explores the black bloods effect and environmental damage.
The place is tied to Freya and Eonar, as well as Elune, so its loaded with major narrative significance.

So, for the life of me (heh) , i can't imagine that not being a major patch location.
Especially not in the context of the titan involvemenet in this whole saga.

Undermine and the gobs however have jackshit to do with any of that, their involvement is purely self centered.
If it wasn't for the goblinraid file, i would've put them as the 10.0.7 zone, but alas they have a presence in a future raid tier, which leads me to believe that a dual zone patch could be likely, with one of the minor patche either being left out or just be filler (Brawlers guild, maybe?)

I think the Beledar will be the megadungeon, with us cleansing/healing the Light creature within and Anduin regaining some of his faith.

Lastly, Xal reaches the Soul chamber and we get our World Soul climax.

Also, Undermine would be vastly easier for them to do in an instanced version cause then they can depend on visual illusions to give a sense of size like they did e.g. with Mechagon. The alternative requires them to build a city and cities are probably much harder to do than outdoor spaces (far more buildings, doodads, NPCs)

[micwini]

11.0.7 Rootlands
11.1 Undermine + zone
11.2 World soul center of the earth zone + void/ethereal raid.

Guys, the signs are all there.

[Enrif]

I think unveiling it now makes more sense given the underground theme, no?

Or would it make more sense in the expansion titled "the last titan"? Were World Souls = Titan, Ama'thul calling azeroth the final titan.

[Nymrohd]

Or would it make more sense in the expansion titled "the last titan"? Were World Souls = Titan, Ama'thul calling azeroth the final titan.

I am not saying the World Soul will not feature there. We should go back. But the War Within is literally about Azeroth talking to us so we should at some point go see her.

[Varodoc]

I'm afraid that Undermine will be the main patch content of 10.1.

When that happens, My only request to Blizzard is that they do not forget about the Alliance and give them some material to work with.

This expansion is shaping up to be yet another Orc/Horde-centric expansion, as Thrall is clearly the main character. I don't know how people can look at the trailers we've got and not conclude that Thrall is the main character of TWW.

Yet that doesn't mean that the Alliance can't be given some material to work with, let us not repeat Cataclysm's mistakes. It's a given that the patches will be Horde-centric, but I still hope that Mekkatorque and the Gnomes will be given some material to work with for 10.1.

[Teriz]

Also, Undermine would be vastly easier for them to do in an instanced version cause then they can depend on visual illusions to give a sense of size like they did e.g. with Mechagon. The alternative requires them to build a city and cities are probably much harder to do than outdoor spaces (far more buildings, doodads, NPCs)

Given the amount of effort they put into Zalarek and Emerald Dream zones, I have no issue believing they'll do a full on city zone. They have a lot of Goblin assets from previous expansions that they could reuse if it becomes too resource heavy. They could even toss in a few assets from Mechagon if necessary.

I don't see a scenario where Undermine becomes Gnomeregan 2.0.

- - - Updated - - -

11.0.7 Rootlands
11.1 Undermine zone + Gallywix/Venture Co. raid
11.2 World soul center of the earth zone + void/ethereal raid.

FIFY. That's pretty much how I see it shaping up.

[Enrif]

I am not saying the World Soul will not feature there. We should go back. But the War Within is literally about Azeroth talking to us so we should at some point go see her.

Maybe, maybe not.

I'm still of the theory that the radiant song isn't from azeroth, but from the beledar, and we will only see azeroth in TLT.

[Ielenia]

From the RPG;

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Kul_Tiras

Okay. Where's the mentions about Stormsong Valley or Drustvar? Also notice how the RPG mentions Kul'Tiras as being a single island, and yet we have three (Tirisgarde Sound, Drustvar & Stormsong Valley).

While, yes, you did find stuff about Kul'Tiras, you're missing the overall point of what I'm writing here: Blizzard is not shy about and has always expanded concepts.

To say that they wouldn't do the same for undermine is, at best, illogical.

The thing is any mines, industries, etc. would all be part of Undermine, because such things have always been described as aspects of the city itself.

You accuse others of being obtuse, but it feels like you're intentionally missing the point here (i.e. actually being obtuse).

[Raetary]

and we will only see azeroth in TLT.

That would be completely anticlimactic.

This whole expansion is about Azeroths first contact and our journey to the Core, using the giant air duct in the middle of our expansion hub to get to it.
They have teased the World Soul in all their cinematic promo and more, to then go "nuh uh" and leave her out until, what? another 5-6 years? is not gonna bode well.

Azeroth desperately needs development, people need a personal connection to her character for this saga to pay off.
So far all she's been is a silent plot device that has not a single direct interaction with us, despite us more or less working as her personal bodyguards.

[Enrif]

That would be completely anticlimactic.

I don't think you know what anticlimactic means.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

11.0.7 Rootlands
11.1 Undermine + zone
11.2 World soul center of the earth zone + void/ethereal raid.

Guys, the signs are all there.

I mean its the only way this makes sense unless they intend to put further content amount into a smaller package to counter the "timeframe reduction" topic.

I mean some of these content like Rootlands/Undermine or World Soul Center of Earth Zone could be Megadungeons too.

I'm not really holding my breath for Undermine at this moment in time. It is possible, but I certainly am not sold on it at all anymore with Rootlands.

[Teriz]

Okay. Where's the mentions about Stormsong Valley or Drustvar? Also notice how the RPG mentions Kul'Tiras as being a single island, and yet we have three (Tirisgarde Sound, Drustvar & Stormsong Valley).

While, yes, you did find stuff about Kul'Tiras, you're missing the overall point of what I'm writing here: Blizzard is not shy about and has always expanded concepts.

Which was never my argument. My argument is that Kul'tiras in the RPG was portrayed as an island with costal cities and towns surrounded by wilderness and coasts terrorized by pirates. That's essentially what Kul'tiras became in WoW. Undermine was portrayed as a congested, mercantile tinker city with slums in one corner and lavish pleasure palaces in another. There is no mention of unsettled areas surrounding Undermine or any surrounding areas at all. It's all Undermine.

This is also another example of elements from the "non-canon RPG" being utilized in WoW.

To say that they wouldn't do the same for undermine is, at best, illogical.

I never said they wouldn't. I said that it has never been portrayed as having anything surrounding it since it's a city inside a volcano underneath Kezan. Kul'tiras on the other hand was always portrayed as having a surrounding wilderness and nearby islands that it interacts with (such as Crestfall and Tol'Barand, which also ended up in WoW).

You accuse others of being obtuse, but it feels like you're intentionally missing the point here (i.e. actually being obtuse).

I'm simply stating the facts here.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm afraid that Undermine will be the main patch content of 10.1.

When that happens, My only request to Blizzard is that they do not forget about the Alliance and give them some material to work with.

This expansion is shaping up to be yet another Orc/Horde-centric expansion, as Thrall is clearly the main character. I don't know how people can look at the trailers we've got and not conclude that Thrall is the main character of TWW.

Yet that doesn't mean that the Alliance can't be given some material to work with, let us not repeat Cataclysm's mistakes. It's a given that the patches will be Horde-centric, but I still hope that Mekkatorque and the Gnomes will be given some material to work with for 10.1.

I seriously doubt Mekkatorque is making an appearance in 11.1 if its Undermine. Undermine would essentially be a Horde venture probably involving Gazlowe and Thrall dealing with whatever Gallywix is up to.

Also considering Alleria's dichotomy with Xal'atath, I wouldn't consider this expansion anywhere close to Orc/Horde centric.