1. #75861
    Pandaren Monk Enrif's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FossilFree View Post
    Voidlords are void lords, and void lords are voidlords. What we see as an "elemental of the void" is just the fragment of their being that the void lord was able to squeeze into our reality.



    https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Dimens..._All-Devouring
    yeah, i like that more and more. All the little voidwalker that warlocks summon, all the voidwalkers out there, just fragments of the true void lords. They are one and many at the same time would be such a different type compared to all the other big boys of the other forces.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    If we somehow do get a void Hunter class, I’ll be the first one to post in this thread to admit my error.
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    I mean, trying to worm out of the way it's the WORLDSOUL saga... yah. It's Azeroth reaching out, not some light fairy.
    Enforcer (Warden/Spellbreaker) Class Idea
    Naga using Worgen Rig Mockup

  2. #75862
    The Lightbringer Valysar's Avatar
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    Realms are offline, a new build is coming (hopefully with musics)

  3. #75863
    Legendary! KOUNTERPARTS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    I love how this book is confirming again and again that Jaina did nothing wrong!
    I love how you keep trying to interject an argument/narrative that nobody here has once said.

    This imaginary and complete fiction exists in your mind only. Please... keep yelling into the void.

  4. #75864
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Chronicles IV also confirms that there were Sunreavers (note plural) that helped steal the Divine Bell from Darnassus.

    I love how this book is confirming again and again that Jaina did nothing wrong!
    Oh, look, more things we already knew and Varodoc blowing it way out of proportion. You really need to work on your confirmation bias.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    It's mostly down to the fact that you don't see any evidence of it - Zereth Mortis has no natural anima, the very bedrock of Death and the Shadowlands themselves. Death's energies largely come from the souls laden with anima that arrive there, which are sent to the various organs of the Shadowlands either via its infinite shard-realms or the Covenant realms. It doesn't come from Zereth Mortis in any observable fashion.
    Which makes sense when it is supposed to be the factory creating the infrastructure, not the power source for the place. I'd question the Chronicle claim of it being the First One, but that's probably one of the reasons they don't speak in absolutes there.

  5. #75865
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    It's mostly down to the fact that you don't see any evidence of it - Zereth Mortis has no natural anima, the very bedrock of Death and the Shadowlands themselves. Death's energies largely come from the souls laden with anima that arrive there, which are sent to the various organs of the Shadowlands either via its infinite shard-realms or the Covenant realms. It doesn't come from Zereth Mortis in any observable fashion.
    Fair enough, tho I imagine it also made the foundations for the power source to be a thing. Zereth Mortis is responsible for the fabric of the afterlife as a whole.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Oh, look, more things we already knew and Varodoc blowing it way out of proportion. You really need to work on your confirmation bias.



    Which makes sense when it is supposed to be the factory creating the infrastructure, not the power source for the place. I'd question the Chronicle claim of it being the First One, but that's probably one of the reasons they don't speak in absolutes there.
    I mean, to be fair here, the Zereths and influences as a whole being extensions of the First Ones has been talked about in SL. Firim mentions how the Progenitors gave a portion of themselves when designing the pattern, and Zereth Mortis is filled with the Progenitor's essences.

    - - - Updated - - -

    https://www.wowhead.com/item=187707/progenitor-essentia

    "An extraordinarily rare remnant of the Progenitors which can be used to craft powerful enhancements. Can be bought and sold on the auction house."

  6. #75866
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuaj View Post
    Metzen didn't write this lol. Also, no, Chronicle is written VIA a Titan "perspective" which just means the Chronicle was document with the viewpoint of the "Titans". Also, Odyn may be a Keeper, but he's also the Titans Prime Designate Keeper on Azeroth and hence carries out their directive to everyone else.
    Metzen wrote the first three Chronicles and Chronicles Vol 4 is announced after Metzen became again Executive Creative Director of the Warcraft universe. Do you honestly believe that Metzen didn't approved every single word written in Chronicles Vol 4? It's his job.

    Shadowlands it's the only part that Metzen wasn't involved with.
    Last edited by Timester; 2024-07-16 at 06:14 PM.

  7. #75867
    Quote Originally Posted by Timester View Post
    Metzen wrote the first three Chronicles and Chronicles Vol 4 is announced after Metzen became again Executive Creative Director of the Warcraft universe. Do you honestly believe that Metzen didn't approved every single word written in Chronicles Vol 4? It's his job.
    You do realize Chronicle 4 was likely being made before Metzen announced his return as executive creative director, right? Even then, the Progenitors being considered "myth" in Chronicle has an in-universe explanation

    - - - Updated - - -

    The very fact the book wasn't written by him screams volumes. Also, Metzen and Danuser worked together on things before Danuser left, so I don't think Metzen is all that against things.

  8. #75868
    Quote Originally Posted by Enrif View Post
    yeah, i like that more and more. All the little voidwalker that warlocks summon, all the voidwalkers out there, just fragments of the true void lords. They are one and many at the same time would be such a different type compared to all the other big boys of the other forces.
    Agreed! It's part of why the void makes for such an interesting antagonist.

  9. #75869
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuaj View Post
    You do realize Chronicle 4 was likely being made before Metzen announced his return as executive creative director, right? Even then, the Progenitors being considered "myth" in Chronicle has an in-universe explanation

    - - - Updated - - -

    The very fact the book wasn't written by him screams volumes. Also, Metzen and Danuser worked together on things before Danuser left, so I don't think Metzen is all that against things.
    I didn't said he is against. Only that Shadowlands' idea of cosmology is being downplayed, as we see in TWiW. They just want to write a game without ticking cosmic boxes.

    If the Chronicles Vol IV is being retold exactly like it happens in-game by a Titan PoV, it pretty much saying "yes, it happened, lets move on".

  10. #75870
    Quote Originally Posted by Timester View Post
    I didn't said he is against. Only that Shadowlands' idea of cosmology is being downplayed, as we see in TWiW. They just want to write a game without ticking cosmic boxes.

    If the Chronicles Vol IV is being retold exactly like it happens in-game by a Titan PoV, it pretty much saying "yes, it happened, lets move on".
    What does TWW downplay?

  11. #75871
    The Lightbringer Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuaj View Post
    What does TWW downplay?
    It didn't, they just added that usually, cosmic forces dip in more elements than just their own, which we already saw in Shadowlands. People are just hating on Shadowlands and see everything that adds on new lore on top as "retcon", see the chronicles IV discussion.
    Last edited by Lady Atia; 2024-07-16 at 07:23 PM.

  12. #75872
    I'm already seeing people mad that they didn't drastically change Shadowlands. They are crazy for that one: like they could bully Blizzard into doing it.

  13. #75873
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    I'm already seeing people mad that they didn't drastically change Shadowlands. They are crazy for that one: like they could bully Blizzard into doing it.
    i'm seeing more people mad at the bfa retcons (which were unnecessary) lmao

  14. #75874
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuaj View Post
    I mean, to be fair here, the Zereths and influences as a whole being extensions of the First Ones has been talked about in SL. Firim mentions how the Progenitors gave a portion of themselves when designing the pattern, and Zereth Mortis is filled with the Progenitor's essences.
    Would you consider a house that incorporates part of your hair into the building to be you? I wouldn't.

  15. #75875
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuaj View Post
    What does TWW downplay?
    "Unlike our ancestors, we don't limit our thinking of the cosmos to monopole elemental phase spaces. A discredited notion rooted in ancient myths from old Arathor. A comforting, if technically incorrect arrangement of the fundamental forces of the cosmos.

    One wonders if such quaint notions would have faded but for creatures like demons and the Old Gods who work primarily through a single energy types. This conflation of culture and dimensional topology holds back so many otherwise promising mages.

    Put simply, the cosmos appears as a hexateron. Imagine a four-sided tetrahedron internally extruded to form a multidimensional solid with twenty planes of existence, fifteen transitory pathways, and six vertices where interferon patterns create monopolar expressions of cosmic forces.

    Singular energy types are unstable according to Ogdaen's law, and thus they bind to one or more secondary elements. The Firelands contains as much magma as it does flame, and why the holy radiance of the Sacred Flame acts as an eternal beacon.

    Enough preamble! Let's get to the fun part! Logic proofs. Let us start with a foundational equation:
    Phi(M1, M2) = k* (Sigma(C1+ C2 + ... + Cn) + Sigma(D1 + D2 + ... + Dn))
    <The rest of this tome consists of 627 more pages of symbolic logic and their proofs. Broken up by the occasional anecdote about mage tower hijinx, the debunking of a historical myth, or a truly terrible dad pun.>"

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    It didn't, they just added that usually, cosmic forces dip in more elements than just their own, which we already saw in Shadowlands. People are just hating on Shadowlands and see everything that adds on new lore on top as "retcon", see the chronicles IV discussion.
    Adding more cosmic debate, especially one that points that cosmic charts are wrong, only dilutes the consistent of the previous debate.
    Last edited by Timester; 2024-07-16 at 07:38 PM.

  16. #75876
    The Lightbringer Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reive View Post
    i'm seeing more people mad at the bfa retcons (which were unnecessary) lmao
    No they weren't lol. BfA was and always will be the biggest lore shitshow ever so any changes to that are always welcome lol. It's also great that the book literally starts with the Sylvanas chapter haha.

  17. #75877
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    No they weren't lol. BfA was and always will be the biggest lore shitshow ever so any changes to that are always welcome lol. It's also great that the book literally starts with the Sylvanas chapter haha.
    The ones they did were unnecessary.

  18. #75878
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    No they weren't lol. BfA was and always will be the biggest lore shitshow ever so any changes to that are always welcome lol. It's also great that the book literally starts with the Sylvanas chapter haha.
    The biggest change, and the one people are most angry about, is that the Talanji and Zul prison escape scenario was changed to be following the Kul Tiras storyline. I don't think it's worth getting angry over but the anger is that it doesn't make a lot of sense, especially how in game you decide to go to Kul Tiras after a cinematic of Talanji escaping.

    The more I think about it, the more I kind of see why they did it- to better justify the Battle for Dazar'alor and why the Alliance invasions of Zandalar worked so much more effectively than the smaller-scale Horde invasions of Kul Tiras. It also explains how Sylvanas had the time to do all her Derek and Ashvane shenanigans.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Reive View Post
    The ones they did were unnecessary.
    I don't think the two island plots could have happened exactly at the same time. But I don't think the time shift they did was necessary either. So they just overshot.
    Last edited by Cheezits; 2024-07-16 at 07:51 PM.

  19. #75879
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    No they weren't lol. BfA was and always will be the biggest lore shitshow ever so any changes to that are always welcome lol. It's also great that the book literally starts with the Sylvanas chapter haha.
    Someone didn’t play The Burning Crusade.

  20. #75880
    Merely a Setback Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Kinda funny to think about, if all the Zandalari stuff happens after all of KT that means the horde attacked Brennadam not because they were already fighting the alliance in the area but as a straight up land grab/just for the slaughter.

    And then Rexxar comes along and acts like it’s Jiana in the wrong like an absolute tool.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

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