The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Super Dickmann]

Crossed fingers the writers don't throw the baby with the bathwater on this one. The Alexstrasza quest just seemed like a huge overreaction to me. But we still have plenty of fun ideas to that could be explored.

As said earlier, the main reason this quest was better than the Amber one, which may get the chop as well and get replaced with the one about causing an accident to off Arthas's horse is exactly because it captured the aspect of how banal enabling this kind of evil really would be.

It's not some arch melodrama, you aren't even directly the killer like with Amber, but when the Bronze job consists of fixing all issues with the timeline, for better or worse, then enabling the continuation of your friend's rape and handing out hearthstone cards become the same thing. It kills agency and will eventually desensitize the person doing it. This is also why Chromie not rending her clothes about it was a rare bit of the tone working out - why would she? Doing shit like that is the Bronzes' day job.

Now, this was likely unintentional, but not being able to even allude to it is one of the reasons why as @Santandame and others have already brought up, the Bronze story falls flat. The cost of not being able to follow the logic of what you've set up to its conclusion and milk drama out of it means you're left with a watered down conflict with a knock-on effect on both the protagonists, who go from quirky because obviously, why would you care if you've seen it all, to just being obnoxious and the Infinites as just power-hungry pricks without the blindingly obvious reason why one of the Bronzes might want to stop working on this soulcrushing job.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

"By the end of the Dawn of the Infinite, the Murozond story is finished, for now. However, there will be more quests following the dungeon. And this doesn't mean the end of the Infinite Dragonflight."

Welp, Murozond as final DF boss stonks dropping.

Unfortunate. He's one of the more interesting dragon villains we've had.

[ImTheMizAwesome]

I think at this point one of the incarnates will be the final boss, 10.1.5 is close and i don't think they will go beyond 10.2 as big patches go, but will have something like last patch for SL with fated raids, some questline etc.

[Luck4]

Unfortunate. He's one of the more interesting dragon villains we've had.

Blizz makes huge amounts of content surrounding characters nobody cares about or a large portion hates while scrapping great ones with multiple expansion build-ups in a single patch...

Murozond, Galakrond, and Chromatus are not going to be used in this expansion, and I'm deeply disappointed.

[Santandame]

What do you mean whimsical to the extremes? Did you forget the quests where we were forced to slaughter whelpings at the Waking Shores? Or did you not see Loamm burning whilist many Niffen were killed, primarily by being burned alive there?

Or did you just miss out on all the dead Dragons and chopped up corpses lying about?

- - - Updated - - -



Why is it unfortunate? Nothing implies he's not happening. He could still occur, he just wouldn't be the final boss of DF then. And if he's not occurring, who cares? The Infinites are still going about their shit regardless.

None of which involves the Bronze Dragonflight. Which is who we are discussing.

- - - Updated - - -

Unfortunate. He's one of the more interesting dragon villains we've had.

Agreed. Murozond and the Infinites could easily be played out as one of the best villainous factions in the story. There’s so much to unpack there.

I enjoy Dragonflight for the most part. But as of right now, the Bronze Dragonflight and the Infinites have been reduced to bottom of the barrel.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizz makes huge amounts of content surrounding characters nobody cares about or a large portion hates while scrapping great ones with multiple expansion build-ups in a single patch...

Murozond, Galakrond, and Chromatus are not going to be used in this expansion, and I'm deeply disappointed.

It’s extremely disappointing. An expansion centered around dragons was the time to use those characters. If not use them in Dragonflight, then when?

I’d like to believe the Infinites will get their own dedicated expansion at some point, but if how both themselves and the Bronze are currently being handled is any indication of how they’ll be handled in the future, then I don’t have high hopes.

- - - Updated - - -

What do you mean whimsical to the extremes? Did you forget the quests where we were forced to slaughter whelpings at the Waking Shores? Or did you not see Loamm burning whilist many Niffen were killed, primarily by being burned alive there?

Or did you just miss out on all the dead Dragons and chopped up corpses lying about?

- - - Updated - - -



Why is it unfortunate? Nothing implies he's not happening. He could still occur, he just wouldn't be the final boss of DF then. And if he's not occurring, who cares? The Infinites are still going about their shit regardless.

I feel like you aren’t really reading peoples posts (mine included which you quoted) and seeing the full context of the discussion and are just replying emotionally.

The interview states that Murozond’s story within Dragonflight is finished after the conclusion of the mega dungeon. Himself and the Infinites may show up in future content, but right now, within Dragonflight and Warcraft, their story is on ice.

Him being the final boss of DF is irrelevant. Murozond and the Infinites will not be showing up in the rest of the expansion, period. We don’t know when himself and the Infinites will show up again in future expansions, if at all. All we know is that going forward, that storyline is resolved.

[micwini]

Blizzard once again submitting to wokies. It's insane how much people complain about billionaires and the 0.001% rich, yet they zealously adhere their agenda of weakening the general populace. It sucks to see woke facism go unhinged and it scares me to the bone that people just mindlessly follow this doctrine.

It sucks, but it was very much expected. I'm curious what these "changes" to the writing look like.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizz makes huge amounts of content surrounding characters nobody cares about or a large portion hates while scrapping great ones with multiple expansion build-ups in a single patch...

Murozond, Galakrond, and Chromatus are not going to be used in this expansion, and I'm deeply disappointed.

Depends what you mean with "used". Chromatus is probably off the radar and forgotten, but Galakrond and Murozond are handled in the new dungeon.

[ImTheMizAwesome]

So i was watching MrGM vod doing latest megadungeon and he was getting these quantum weapon items that unlock transmogs from the past and the items he got varied from white grade bows, molten core to items from sepulcher, other people were getting some items from ICC and so on.

It looks similar to system in GW2 with wardrobe unlocks, where the more items you currently have unlocked, actually increases chances for getting stuff that is harder or has lower chance to get because there's smaller pool of transmog you still have to unlock.

Im not really a collector, because i only farm things i like but now i wish i had more stuff unlocked.

[Makabreska]

Unfortunate. He's one of the more interesting dragon villains we've had.

Not really a high praise, considering that:
- Deathwing went mad cuz whispers
- Malygos stopped being mad and went bad cuz reasons
- Ysera went bad cuz Tear of Elune

There is literally nothing interesting for me in a Greek tragedy "escape the fate" Noz story that was foreshadowed 10y+ ago. The fact that he actually escaped it for now is much more interesting.

[Nightshade711]

"By the end of the Dawn of the Infinite, the Murozond story is finished, for now. However, there will be more quests following the dungeon. And this doesn't mean the end of the Infinite Dragonflight."

Welp, Murozond as final DF boss stonks dropping.

Well that’s disappointing.

I was hoping/expecting them to continue the lore we had of Murozond from Cata, not retcon it.

I think having him as a final boss with us seeing the “true end time”, with it revealing whatever the 7th cosmic force is, would have been cool.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Not really a high praise, considering that:
- Deathwing went mad cuz whispers
- Malygos stopped being mad and went bad cuz reasons
- Ysera went bad cuz Tear of Elune

There is literally nothing interesting for me in a Greek tragedy "escape the fate" Noz story that was foreshadowed 10y+ ago. The fact that he actually escaped it for now is much more interesting.

I was thinking more in the implications unaddressed than the implications intended. There's some room for interesting exploration there. For instance, why hasn't Nozdormu seemed to ponder on the fact that it is a particular revelation that irrevocably drives him to become Murozond? Wouldn't it realistically spark a great deal of concern for someone if they knew that their own judgment would lead them to inevitably to do something terrible based on a revelation, and make them wonder what that particular revelation is? If it's all about trying to prevent his death, like it was said to be (and probably intended to be, as I honestly doubt Blizzard thought through the implications), why does he bother doing so while also knowing that this particular course of action leads to a demise of which he is also fully aware anyway? Nozdormu is—at least allegedly—not stupid, so he would realistically have to entertain at least a number of these weighty questions as a result of what he knows.

There is also something appealing to me about the Infinite Dragonflight being—especially now that Blizzard decided to dwell a bit more on precisely how terrible the Bronze Dragonflight's gig is with the Alexstrasza and Kearnan—a set of villains misguided on the basis of very understandable moral objections, yet creating a great host of problems by preferring to reduce evil immediately rather than concern themselves with the long-term consequences of it. I'd like to know what finally made Murozond crack, and how his objectives came in line with those we've seen of the rest of the Infinite Dragonflight.

As I've brought up before, my preference would be if Nozdormu's fate is wholly averted, but Murozond is also retroactively created out of him in the past, creating a kind of "time crash" that permanently alters the prime timeline and turns Nozdormu into a creature with dubious and confusing causality and retroactively deprived of a concrete past, while Murozond inserts himself into reality and creates a concrete being of himself, perhaps even no longer being a villain after that point because assuring his own existence has satisfied his concerns or enabled him to less destructively intervene, or at least settling into a state of random oscillation between villainy and anti-heroism depending on caprice alone. There's so much more to explore with this than we have thus far, and I find it deeply unfortunate that the implications that always come with parachronological funtime are being overlooked entirely.

Dragon Break pls Blizzard

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Well that’s disappointing.

I was hoping/expecting them to continue the lore we had of Murozond from Cata, not retcon it.

I think having him as a final boss with us seeing the “true end time”, with it revealing whatever the 7th cosmic force is, would have been cool.

Thats a lot of presumption, really shouldn't of just went along with that, it lead you to that disappointment. I meaan I wouldn't of minded a Murozond end boss but I guess they have other plans in mind. Extending the Infinite Dragonflight threat IMO is good though.

[Eeram]

I just saw a new Chromie quest line Where we are making sure Varian Valeera and Broll Continue to be slaves and fight to the death for the enjoyment of others? what is this the 1600 Slavery is done and over why are we stilling allowing things like this to go on an happen? seriously someone explain how this disgusting Slavery and forcing people to kill each other for our enjoyment made it into the PTR

[Alanar]

So i was watching MrGM vod doing latest megadungeon and he was getting these quantum weapon items that unlock transmogs from the past and the items he got varied from white grade bows, molten core to items from sepulcher, other people were getting some items from ICC and so on.

It looks similar to system in GW2 with wardrobe unlocks, where the more items you currently have unlocked, actually increases chances for getting stuff that is harder or has lower chance to get because there's smaller pool of transmog you still have to unlock.

Im not really a collector, because i only farm things i like but now i wish i had more stuff unlocked.

That's wonderfull for me . Honestly it's a fair idea.. but, it's really, really not going to be any fun if we would be getting items that you have unlocked already.

- - - Updated - - -

As I've brought up before, my preference would be if Nozdormu's fate is wholly averted, but Murozond is also retroactively created out of him in the past, creating a kind of "time crash" that permanently alters the prime timeline and turns Nozdormu into a creature with dubious and confusing causality and retroactively deprived of a concrete past, while Murozond inserts himself into reality and creates a concrete being of himself, perhaps even no longer being a villain after that point because assuring his own existence has satisfied his concerns or enabled him to less destructively intervene, or at least settling into a state of random oscillation between villainy and anti-heroism depending on caprice alone. There's so much more to explore with this than we have thus far, and I find it deeply unfortunate that the implications that always come with parachronological funtime are being overlooked entirely.

I would like this actually.

[Benedict Donald]

Blizzard once again submitting to wokies. It's insane how much people complain about billionaires and the 0.001% rich, yet they zealously adhere their agenda of weakening the general populace. It sucks to see woke facism go unhinged and it scares me to the bone that people just mindlessly follow this doctrine.

It sucks, but it was very much expected. I'm curious what these "changes" to the writing look like.

Woke=being conscious and aware of (awake to) the society-level oppression African-Americans have to endure.

How is being woke a bad thing again? No using Faux Noise propaganda talking points in your answer either. Russian spies don't have valid opinions anyways.

Being anti-woke is the realm of nazis, neo confederates, and fascists in general. Calling being woke fascism is like Stalin calling America a bunch of commies.

But say you lack self-awareness without saying you lack self-awareness! By all means, show the extent of your Dunning-Kruger effect.

[Revamp Man]

None of which involves the Bronze Dragonflight. Which is who we are discussing.

- - - Updated - - -



Agreed. Murozond and the Infinites could easily be played out as one of the best villainous factions in the story. There’s so much to unpack there.

I enjoy Dragonflight for the most part. But as of right now, the Bronze Dragonflight and the Infinites have been reduced to bottom of the barrel.

- - - Updated - - -



It’s extremely disappointing. An expansion centered around dragons was the time to use those characters. If not use them in Dragonflight, then when?

I’d like to believe the Infinites will get their own dedicated expansion at some point, but if how both themselves and the Bronze are currently being handled is any indication of how they’ll be handled in the future, then I don’t have high hopes.

- - - Updated - - -



I feel like you aren’t really reading peoples posts (mine included which you quoted) and seeing the full context of the discussion and are just replying emotionally.

The interview states that Murozond’s story within Dragonflight is finished after the conclusion of the mega dungeon. Himself and the Infinites may show up in future content, but right now, within Dragonflight and Warcraft, their story is on ice.

Him being the final boss of DF is irrelevant. Murozond and the Infinites will not be showing up in the rest of the expansion, period. We don’t know when himself and the Infinites will show up again in future expansions, if at all. All we know is that going forward, that storyline is resolved.

Take all interviews with a grain of salt
We have seen things stated in them get quickly 180'd

I do think moruzond being an ever existing threat is cool simply due to his nature. He's like Dr. Who in the sense you don't know when in his timeline you've met him or when he'll show up.

[Luck4]

Extending the Infinite Dragonflight threat IMO is good though.

I would agree if Blizzard were using them often to explore past and possible future events, which isn't the case. The last time we had an Infinite Dragonflight dungeon was back in Cataclysm...

Blizzard is probably saving them for a single patch in a bad expansion, as they did with N'zoth and Azshara.

[Black Rider]

I believe the leak season is on when @Scaleface starts giving hints again!

[Fahrad Wagner]

I believe the leak season is on when @Scaleface starts giving hints again!

It usually starts a bit before that, when the first "realistic" leaks start appearing, generally one to two months before announcements/Blizzcon. That being said, most of them are always fake and Scaleface's hints are indeed the ones to look out for :3

[ImTheMizAwesome]

I don't remember, but when exactly blizzcon digital tickets/in game rewards are announced?

[Hitei]

I believe the leak season is on when @Scaleface starts giving hints again!

Hasn't he only ever leaked stuff in the week or two leading up to an announcement? The implication seemed to be that his source was third party, so it's only ever gonna be stuff related to promotional materials sent out right before public announcement.