The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Santandame]

I think between SL, DF, and TWW, there was a lot of "make whatever you want" in terms of story and locales with an emphasis on creating new stuff that had some ties to existing Warcraft lore and races, but still had that emphasis on being "new" with an emphasis on trying to add more brand new stuff to the Franchise. You see this in pretty much all of the Shadowlands, some of the Dragon Isles, and most of TWW also being new areas, new races and/or new factions of existing races.

The other two WSS expansions being world revamps in two of the most popular old expansion locales points towards a shift towards not only revamps but "Old Warcraft" which I think is the biggest takeway from Metzen coming back. I'm sure we may still see new factions of old races like Maruukai Centaur and Algari Earthen but not nearly as many as we did for the past few expansions, and fewer complete OCs like Harronir and the Dracthyr.

I think Avaloren is inevitable but I'm curious how it will be designed now.

I’m still of the belief that Avaloren = Avalon, so WoW’s version of Camelot. It’ll be classic, traditional western fantasy if that’s the case. No new OC’s but a lot of established WoW races that will fit the mold. The Arathi capital being similar to Camelot, dragons, ogres, gnolls, witches in the form of the Drust returning with a new coven, feral worgen, giants etc. Quite possible there’s new Titan Keepers there too in the form of Merlin and Morgen Le Fay but I could also see them as Life themed if Nymue from Amirdrassil is anything to go by.

[Auxis]

What's the drop limit on the Token/box thing from the Echoes bosses? I could have sworn it was daily, but I got 3 on 3 DHs yesterday and its definitely been 24 hrs/daily reset and the box isn't dropping. It can't be a weekly thing because I've gotten them multiple days in a row before. Or is it a once per character thing?

[Eldryth]

What's the drop limit on the Token/box thing from the Echoes bosses? I could have sworn it was daily, but I got 3 on 3 DHs yesterday and its definitely been 24 hrs/daily reset and the box isn't dropping. It can't be a weekly thing because I've gotten them multiple days in a row before. Or is it a once per character thing?

I think it's once per week on each character, but I haven't paid enough attention to be completely sure about that.

[Joshuaj]

I think between SL, DF, and TWW, there was a lot of "make whatever you want" in terms of story and locales with an emphasis on creating new stuff that had some ties to existing Warcraft lore and races, but still had that emphasis on being "new" with an emphasis on trying to add more brand new stuff to the Franchise. You see this in pretty much all of the Shadowlands, some of the Dragon Isles, and most of TWW also being new areas, new races and/or new factions of existing races.

The other two WSS expansions being world revamps in two of the most popular old expansion locales points towards a shift towards not only revamps but "Old Warcraft" which I think is the biggest takeway from Metzen coming back. I'm sure we may still see new factions of old races like Maruukai Centaur and Algari Earthen but not nearly as many as we did for the past few expansions, and fewer complete OCs like Harronir and the Dracthyr.

I think Avaloren is inevitable but I'm curious how it will be designed now.

And that's fine. Revamping old world stuff works so long as the story fits with the locales involved. I imagine Metzen also wanted to do this since World of Warcraft was hitting it's 20th anniversary and he wanted this saga to feel like a love letter to the fans.

Also, yeah, Avaloren might just be akin to Avalon but with Warhammer 40k-esc light and faith based stuff mixed with it. Idk if it'll be shown the saga after this one, or 2 sagas later tho. Ngl, would love to see the next saga be based around Order Vs Disorder.

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And when I mean "Disorder", I don't mean whatever is left of the Legion, or Denathrius (a Death lord), making a new demonic army VIA him potentially hiding out within the Nether.

I want a full on Disorder conflict, with Disorder Lords that spread anarchy, with an Outland revamp as the sagas first expac, with Ulduar getting bombed to shit by these chaotic monsters, etc.

[Cheezits]

And when I mean "Disorder", I don't mean whatever is left of the Legion, or Denathrius (a Death lord), making a new demonic army VIA him potentially hiding out within the Nether.

I want a full on Disorder conflict, with Disorder Lords that spread anarchy, with an Outland revamp as the sagas first expac, with Ulduar getting bombed to shit by these chaotic monsters, etc.

If the Void Lords are "dealt with" by taking care of Dimensius in Midnight, and the Titans vs Sargeras beef is retired in TLT, then we will probably shift to a final arc that deals with Azshara and Denathrius: two of the most iconic villains tied to Azeroth (Denathrius through the Nathrezim) that are left. But I'm aware there's a shocking possibility Azshara is slain in Midnight.

The God Emperor of Arathor will probably be another story but the jury's out on if he's a friend or not.

I just realized that despite him most likely to be involved with demons through the Nathrezim, Denathrius could also be linked to the Scourge through his death powers and knowledge of them through the Nathrezim and Zovaal.

[Joshuaj]

If the Void Lords are "dealt with" by taking care of Dimensius in Midnight, and the Titans vs Sargeras beef is retired in TLT, then we will probably shift to a final arc that deals with Azshara and Denathrius: two of the most iconic villains tied to Azeroth (Denathrius through the Nathrezim) that are left. But I'm aware there's a shocking possibility Azshara is slain in Midnight.

The God Emperor of Arathor will probably be another story but the jury's out on if he's a friend or not.

I just realized that despite him most likely to be involved with demons through the Nathrezim, Denathrius could also be linked to the Scourge through his death powers and knowledge of them through the Nathrezim and Zovaal.

Fair, but I just want Disorder Lords man. Denathrius can also be a part of that story, but Disorder just feels so...half baked rn.

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Also, it is possible that Dimensius is gonna be the final boss of Midnight, but I have a crackpot theory. What if the final boss is K'aresh?

[Sondrelk]

Fair, but I just want Disorder Lords man. Denathrius can also be a part of that story, but Disorder just feels so...half baked rn.

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Also, it is possible that Dimensius is gonna be the final boss of Midnight, but I have a crackpot theory. What if the final boss is K'aresh?

K'aresh as the final encounter would be interesting. Though probably a bit too close to how Legion ended with fighting Argus.

[Joshuaj]

K'aresh as the final encounter would be interesting. Though probably a bit too close to how Legion ended with fighting Argus.

Possibly, but IF K'aresh is a Void Creature and not a Titan, it would definitely fit in with the Worldsoul Saga and TLTs narrative in the future.

[micwini]

Pure disorder would be something like Murmur from SLabs I'd imagine

[Cheezits]

Personally I think K'aresh IS Dimensius, a World Soul turned into a Void Lord (which is what Sargeras wanted to make sure wouldn't happen to Azeroth).

Per Wowpedia:

"How the Voidlord found K'aresh is still hotly debated among the surviving ethereals, but the effects of his coming were unmistakable: he opened countless gateways into the Void and the Twisting Nether around the planet, bathing K'aresh in arcane and dark energies. "

This sounds suspiciously like "Ka'resh turned into a Voidlord and nuked his own planet" to me.

This would also tie into the "Nathrezim were the ones turning World Souls into Voidlords" plot which I THINK is still canon as of Chronicle. Kill Dimensius -> Return to Nathrezim plot.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Why should they mention Steve when he is no longer part of the company? Would be absurd and unprofessional lol.

Also yeah, Metzen implied they atleast changed the name of TWW and I guess they had planned to do Avaloren next instead of going back to the old zones initially.

Because if your 10 months into a story and not throwing most of it out to refocus you’d think you would atleast mention the lead of said story and the foundation they set. It’s not like they never mentioned Metzen once he left.

[Joshuaj]

Pure disorder would be something like Murmur from SLabs I'd imagine

That's what I was thinking.

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Personally I think K'aresh IS Dimensius, a World Soul turned into a Void Lord (which is what Sargeras wanted to make sure wouldn't happen to Azeroth).

Per Wowpedia:

"How the Voidlord found K'aresh is still hotly debated among the surviving ethereals, but the effects of his coming were unmistakable: he opened countless gateways into the Void and the Twisting Nether around the planet, bathing K'aresh in arcane and dark energies. "

This sounds suspiciously like "Ka'resh turned into a Voidlord and nuked his own planet" to me.

This would also tie into the "Nathrezim were the ones turning World Souls into Voidlords" plot which I THINK is still canon as of Chronicle. Kill Dimensius -> Return to Nathrezim plot.

That is possible, but based off recent lore, it seems more like Dimensius found K'aresh and succeeded in "claiming it".

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Besides, when Argus became a "titan", it kept it's name. Wouldn't be shocked if K'aresh kept it's name as well.

[username993720]

I imagine by Midnight its 90% Metzens vision by that point.

Let's hope so.

That is my point. Strong community desire to go back to old world will be adressed in Midnight, cause Khaz Algar was already far into production.

And TLT.

But, there are still lore locations unaccounted for.
I don't get why they invent new ones when they have them lying around.

[Enrif]

I still am of the mind, that K'aresh and the current Radiant Song did not originate from World Souls, but light creatures (unless world souls are considered light creatures). We don't know what it was on K'aresh, but i'm thinking something like the Beledar. And that light creature has fallen to Darkness and became Dimensius, which then destroyed the World. And the name Dimensius is not unsimilar to another light creature that became a void creautre. M'uru that became Entropius. Dimensius, Entropius and also in Invalidus from AU Draenor. Their naming convention is the same. A word ending on -ius.

[Joshuaj]

The Light can possess similar songs, sure. But I think the radiant song just works for Worldsouls.

Granted, if it was revealed that the Light manipulated Azeroths song a bit, I wouldn't be shocked either.

[Cheezits]

Mists Remix is confirmed to be coming back again, and maybe some Remix items will be available earlier.

Nice to see it will return, but I hope it comes back with a different Timewalking area as well.

[Dracullus]

Mists Remix is confirmed to be coming back again, and maybe some Remix items will be available earlier.

Nice to see it will return, but I hope it comes back with a different Timewalking area as well.

Specifically MoP Remix? I feel like people got their fill of MoP (especially if they decided to do Classic next year), spaming Remix more often than 1 per expansion feels like mistake too. Imo most elegant way is just WoD Remix in TWW S4 and adding vendor with all Remix exclusive items from MoP era there.

[Sondrelk]

Specifically MoP Remix? I feel like people got their fill of MoP (especially if they decided to do Classic next year), spaming Remix more often than 1 per expansion feels like mistake too. Imo most elegant way is just WoD Remix in TWW S4 and adding vendor with all Remix exclusive items from MoP era there.

Maybe as an option for whenever regular MoP timerunning becomes available. Would only be about one week per 2 and a half months, right?

[Lady Atia]

Maybe as an option for whenever regular MoP timerunning becomes available. Would only be about one week per 2 and a half months, right?

I already said it and I will die on that hill, remixes should be replacing timewalking properly, or atleast running alongside. And I surely hope they keep adding new rewards to it over time.

[hattahat]

In fact, we've already been told that expansions up to Midnight are already planned before Battle for Azeroth.