The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Scyth]

Definitely we should get Direct in next few weeks:

- For retail we know only about distant future, pretty rare thing in roadmap era,
- Cata will get last raid in January and some MoP mounts are dataminted - super duper special edition to buy on Direct?
- Vanilla season is slowly ending too, of course to get crowd excited here it would have to be something big for Season 3, so they may skip this one on Direct,
- Warcraft 3 has patch 2.0 datamined, could be some new campaigns (pretty standard practice for modern RTS remasters like AoE or Stronghold).

Of course first week of November would be ideal, because of Blizzcon nostalgia. And I REALLY hope it isn't some pre-recorded "let's pretend we talk" video like DF reveal.

I reckon they'd have announced something already if it was going to be first week of November but hope I'm wrong!
I'm pretty sure it will be a pre-recorded event though.

Also MoP is the only expansion I'm interested from the old ones so I'd love it if they announced a release for it but I doubt they'll do it so early unfortunately. They also just announced they will extend the Firelands patch so people can get their staff legendary so we might get MoP later now.

[Nibelheimy]

We'll probably just fight a subset of more evil-leaning titans and keepers in TLT, probably Amanthul and maybe Kaz Goroth (We already fought Aggramar), and please let us fight Sargeras at last, even if Argus was cool in Legion, I felt cheated.

I'd like to see Amitus as canon as well, the light titan from hearthstone.

I feel like with Metzen back at the head of the chain, he's going to put Sargeras in as final boss of TLT. It's the end of the 'World Soul Saga" and we pretty much know he's coming back at this point, I can't think of a more fitting end for the true end of the first era of WoW.

I'm expecting biiig changes after this saga.

[Golden Yak]

I feel like with Metzen back at the head of the chain, he's going to put Sargeras in as final boss of TLT. It's the end of the 'World Soul Saga" and we pretty much know he's coming back at this point, I can't think of a more fitting end for the true end of the first era of WoW.

I'm expecting biiig changes after this saga.

Either the final boss, or he goes free as the capstone of it. He goes out into the universe all like "Hey, gonna go get my Burning Legion back together. Then we'll see what's what."

He might even be the 'Last Titan', with the rest of the Pantheon going down over the course of TLT (they're likely still Argus/Aggramar-tier since the end of Legion, so they aren't colossal invincible planet-sized god-beings anymore).

I predict that Azeroth will awaken, but choose to remain the Worldsoul in order to preserve the world, and so act as a kind of cosmic immune system repelling major forces like the Pantheon, the Void, etc. from trying to claim her, so the cosmic stuff takes more of a backseat, and we get back to basics focusing on issues closer to home (Arathi Empire looking to take over, etc.)

[Joshuaj]

The Night Fae and other shadowlands factions are part of the powers in it's home realm, they don't represent it in the great dark.

The Illidari are anti Fel they use it to stop Fel's wider aim's as did the blood elf's when they found out.

can't speak on the outcast I don't remember any of there lore.

Bwonsamdi's is an example of the forces doing good in the great dark but even he was suppose to be more shady before he got a great resuspension and blizz changed plans for him.

and ya worshiping the light/order doesn't stop one from being murderous but it's also not the basic out come with groups like the scarlet crusade and Xera being in the minority while almost ever group of the other powers pushing evil aims or using said power to stop it self.

"The Covenants are the powers in their home realm, they don't represent death in the Dark Beyond though"

This is a little weird since the functions of death and dying in the Dark Beyond require the cosmic influence of Death to work it's magic. And Death as an influence is quite literally embodied by and governed by the Eternal Ones. Just because death represents something different in the beyond, that doesn't mean the Eternal Ones and the Covenants don't have an effect on it. The Shadowlands is just where they do most of their stuff.

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I feel like with Metzen back at the head of the chain, he's going to put Sargeras in as final boss of TLT. It's the end of the 'World Soul Saga" and we pretty much know he's coming back at this point, I can't think of a more fitting end for the true end of the first era of WoW.

I'm expecting biiig changes after this saga.

This is a bit weird considering Metzen was working on DF with the rest of the team, and he was one of the big reasons for why guys like Iridikron exist.

Ya know, Iridikron? The guy who's very clearly being set up as the ACTUAL final boss of TLT?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

"The Covenants are the powers in their home realm, they don't represent death in the Dark Beyond though"

This is a little weird since the functions of death and dying in the Dark Beyond require the cosmic influence of Death to work it's magic. And Death as an influence is quite literally embodied by and governed by the Eternal Ones. Just because death represents something different in the beyond, that doesn't mean the Eternal Ones and the Covenants don't have an effect on it. The Shadowlands is just where they do most of their stuff.

Souls in the great dark don’t function the same way as they so in the shadowlands because well people are alive and have body’s.

The SL influence the great dark sure but how the two realms operate is completely different.

[Joshuaj]

Souls in the great dark don’t function the same way as they so in the shadowlands because well people are alive and have body’s.

The SL influence the great dark sure but how the two realms operate is completely different.

Ah, that's what you meant. Yeah, I agree then lol.

[Nibelheimy]

This is a bit weird considering Metzen was working on DF with the rest of the team, and he was one of the big reasons for why guys like Iridikron exist.

Ya know, Iridikron? The guy who's very clearly being set up as the ACTUAL final boss of TLT?

Dragonflight was Danusers baby. Metzen came in late into Dragonflight development. The only reason Iridikron is still alive is because the end boss was switched when Metzen came back, changed the complete ending direction of the planned stories and planned a Saga instead.

[huth]

Ah, that's what you meant. Yeah, I agree then lol.

I don't. Lorgar is just making assertions with no real basis in lore. Souls in the Shadowlands can have bodies too. We've seen plenty of them.

Being alive is a function of a body as well, not of the soul.

[Nathanyel]

Ya know, Iridikron? The guy who's very clearly being set up as the ACTUAL final boss of TLT?

As TLT is also teased to be about the "Titan conspiracy", I doubt he would be the final boss. At best, end boss of the first raid.
Funnier though but also more establishing them as a threat would be if the Titans come to Azeroth, Iridikron goes "muahaha, my plan to lure the Titans here has worked perfectly. Now, I shall have my REVENGE!" and then the Titans just stomp him unceremoniously.

[Nibelheimy]

Either the final boss, or he goes free as the capstone of it. He goes out into the universe all like "Hey, gonna go get my Burning Legion back together. Then we'll see what's what."

He might even be the 'Last Titan', with the rest of the Pantheon going down over the course of TLT (they're likely still Argus/Aggramar-tier since the end of Legion, so they aren't colossal invincible planet-sized god-beings anymore).

I predict that Azeroth will awaken, but choose to remain the Worldsoul in order to preserve the world, and so act as a kind of cosmic immune system repelling major forces like the Pantheon, the Void, etc. from trying to claim her, so the cosmic stuff takes more of a backseat, and we get back to basics focusing on issues closer to home (Arathi Empire looking to take over, etc.)

Agreed on him being the last Titan, its most likely IMO. He either is the end boss, or he goes out into the universe hunting down cosmic level threats so we can remain on the planet and deal with threats on the surface. He could still possibly decide to protect Azeroth instead of destroying it, Illidan's lil chats might have helped.

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As TLT is also teased to be about the "Titan conspiracy", I doubt he would be the final boss. At best, end boss of the first raid.
Funnier though but also more establishing them as a threat would be if the Titans come to Azeroth, Iridikron goes "muahaha, my plan to lure the Titans here has worked perfectly. Now, I shall have my REVENGE!" and then the Titans just stomp him unceremoniously.

I fully believe Iridikron will achieve his goal at least partially. I think the opening saga release cinematic should be a shot of Ulduar, maybe Hi-def Magni/bran sending a transmission into the stars asking for help from the Titans. The titans then emerging from the red star to see a void infested world/Void lord converging near the planet after the events of Midnight. Iridikon emerges from his lair and somehow, kills all of the non-sargeras Titans. Leaving only Sargeras who's yet to appear with Illidan left. That way we can spend the expansion searching through Northrend, Ulduar (which I believe is going to be a lot more involved and important than people think) and other parts of the manifold to discover the 'Titan conspiracy', a way to remove the void influence, and restore balance to the planet. I wouldn't be surprised if Xal'atath knows Sargeras will be late out, she can let him stomp Iridikron and then try and take the dark titan for herself. Whether he lives or dies is 50/50 for me right now. But I'm certain he's going to be the last titan.

Full HD cinema style Sargeras would be pretty sweet if he turns up that early, if not, Iridikron beaming some Titans would still look pretty sweet with that cinematic scale.

[Eldryth]

I agree with Sargeras playing a major role, possibly the final boss.

If the Titans return then he should be free, Metzen teased something happening with his sword in TLT, and most of all, if this Saga is supposed to be the climax to the past 20 years of Warcraft, as he said at Blizzcon, then it makes sense for this era to end with us finally fighting the main antagonist of most of the franchise. Make this a big finale to the story so far, then use the next expansion as the start of a new story, with lower power levels- maybe a Kalimdor revamp leading into the Arathi? (I'm sure that approach would be compared to FFXIV's Dawntrail, but I feel like that story was just executed poorly compared to the earlier expansions, rather than the idea of a fresh start being bad).


Iridikron feels like he's set up to be the end boss for the first or second tier of TLT. Either that, or (less likely) a twist ally. If we knew less about TLT and the overarching Saga, I could have easily seen him as an expansion end boss... but with all the setup for the Titan conspiracy, Sargeras's return, and the Void invasion, he just doesn't seem like a fitting climax to all of this.

[Merryck]

Iridikron is a dungeon boss. Get him out of here.

[MauroDiogo]

On the topic of Beledar: This week we've been told by Archaedas that Beledar is the calcified essence of Azeroth but all the features and signs point to it being more in line with it being Naaru in nature and it coming from offworld.

We've all been playing for a few weeks. Doing all sorts of activities and getting a nice new currency called Resonance Crystals. I think a lot of players, just like me, never paid much attention to it but today I just randomly decided to give it's tooltip some more attention and there's a bit of Lore that I found curious:

"Formed by the energies of the Worldsoul interacting with the stone in and beneath Khaz Algar, these revered objects are used to purchase rewards unlocked from renown."

Assuming the stone they are referring to is Beledar (considering everyone is only just learning about this new crystal on another island), the information there implies that the Stone and the Worldsoul are separate entities and Azeroth is interacting WITH the stone but the stone itself is not naturaly OF/FROM Azeroth.

- Azeroth could be using it to keep herself powered up long enough for us to come to her rescue.
- Azeroth could be SHIELDING it or potentially something inside it.
- The Naaru/Light are known to appear in dreams, visions and speak to people from great distances through Radiant Songs. Azeroth could be taking advantage of that power and speaking to us/Brann/other entities THROUGH Beledar. it just amplifies her voice. SPECIALLY if she's in some sort of facility or Titanic prison/enclosure and she had to find some external means to communicate with us.

This would pair with my theory that following on with the themes of duality, Void & Light that Blizzard keeps emphasising, we might see the counter-part of Xal'atath play a big role in the saga too - T'uure, Beacon of the Naaru. The Holy priest's staff.
My theory is that if that was the case then Beledar could potentially be one of the Light shards sent across the cosmos to infuse planets with the Light but could potentially be used by the Naaru as a BEACON or Waypoint that pinpoints a Prime Worldsoul. But could also be a shard of T'uure itself. The Naaru that sacrificed itself in the battle with Dimensius and exploded in a gigantic Holy Nova. Sending it's own shards flying.

The tooltip for the staff T'uure also mentions Torchbearers lighting the way in the dark. Which perfectly falls in line with the whole theme of Hallowfall and it's people.
And in a metaphorical darkness that represents the Great Beyond, Beledar could be like a Lighthouse or a beacon of Light for the Naaru to follow and locate Azeroth.

[Sondrelk]

On the topic of Beledar: This week we've been told by Archaedas that Beledar is the calcified essence of Azeroth but all the features and signs point to it being more in line with it being Naaru in nature and it coming from offworld.

We've all been playing for a few weeks. Doing all sorts of activities and getting a nice new currency called Resonance Crystals. I think a lot of players, just like me, never paid much attention to it but today I just randomly decided to give it's tooltip some more attention and there's a bit of Lore that I found curious:



Assuming the stone they are referring to is Beledar (considering everyone is only just learning about this new crystal on another island), the information there implies that the Stone and the Worldsoul are separate entities and Azeroth is interacting WITH the stone but the stone itself is not naturaly OF/FROM Azeroth.

- Azeroth could be using it to keep herself powered up long enough for us to come to her rescue.
- Azeroth could be SHIELDING it or potentially something inside it.
- The Naaru/Light are known to appear in dreams, visions and speak to people from great distances through Radiant Songs. Azeroth could be taking advantage of that power and speaking to us/Brann/other entities THROUGH Beledar. it just amplifies her voice. SPECIALLY if she's in some sort of facility or Titanic prison/enclosure and she had to find some external means to communicate with us.

This would pair with my theory that following on with the themes of duality, Void & Light that Blizzard keeps emphasising, we might see the counter-part of Xal'atath play a big role in the saga too - T'uure, Beacon of the Naaru. The Holy priest's staff.
My theory is that if that was the case then Beledar could potentially be one of the Light shards sent across the cosmos to infuse planets with the Light but could potentially be used by the Naaru as a BEACON or Waypoint that pinpoints a Prime Worldsoul. But could also be a shard of T'uure itself. The Naaru that sacrificed itself in the battle with Dimensius and exploded in a gigantic Holy Nova. Sending it's own shards flying.

The tooltip for the staff T'uure also mentions Torchbearers lighting the way in the dark. Which perfectly falls in line with the whole theme of Hallowfall and it's people.
And in a metaphorical darkness that represents the Great Beyond, Beledar could be like a Lighthouse or a beacon of Light for the Naaru to follow and locate Azeroth.

I imagine the way they will go with it is that the Beledar is a hunk of Azerite formed around some strong source of Light magic. Would make sense with what we see, and how it acts. Would also explain why it's called a resonance crystal. The Azerite is literally resonating with the energies of the magic it has cocooned.

[Nathanyel]

I fully believe Iridikron will achieve his goal at least partially. [...]

Oh, for sure, I was merely memeing At any rate, it's likely that (most of) the Titans will die during 13.0, maybe even the last patch of 12.X if they arrive this early, at either the tiny hands of Iridikron or those of the Void Big Bad of Midnight.
The initial main threat of 13.0/1 could then be the Keepers and other Titan-aligned forces on Azeroth going mad over the demise of their masters, striking against the perpetrator, with mortals caught in the crossfire or mistaken as responsible.

Iridikron is a dungeon boss. Get him out of here.

We didn't kill him, we didn't even "defeat" him, merely distracted him enough that Chromie got a shot at the Dark Heart. Iridikron didn't even react to that, because he knew this us fighting him gave Deios enough time to corrupt Proto-Nozdormu, causing Chromie to turn back time to prevent this.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

It's amazing how much people have managed to overrate Iridikron just because of how awful the Jailer was before him. Truly, Zovaal's influence resonates even now.

[Nathanyel]

It's amazing how much people have managed to overrate Iridikron just because of how awful the Jailer was before him. Truly, Zovaal's influence resonates even now.

He was the first antagonist to not underestimate the adventurers, he was different to ALL the overconfident baddies of the past. Even Azshara ultimately failed to use us, because we defeated her before she could 'free' N'Zoth in a way that would've let her kill him. Iridikron realized he had a good chance to fail when taking us head on, but he knew how to truly Xanatos-Gambit us into advancing his goals either way.

[Joshuaj]

Dragonflight was Danusers baby. Metzen came in late into Dragonflight development. The only reason Iridikron is still alive is because the end boss was switched when Metzen came back, changed the complete ending direction of the planned stories and planned a Saga instead.

Just because DF was Danuser's baby, that doesn't mean Metzen didn't work on major parts of it. Ion quite literally states that Metzen had a huge role to play in creating the Incarnates, as well as future expansion villains.

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Also, Metzen didn't really change the ending of DF. Seems his major story contributions started with The War Within.

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I don't. Lorgar is just making assertions with no real basis in lore. Souls in the Shadowlands can have bodies too. We've seen plenty of them.

Being alive is a function of a body as well, not of the soul.

Yes, but there is a slight difference between living in the beyond and "living" in the afterlife.

[huth]

Yes, but there is a slight difference between living in the beyond and "living" in the afterlife.

Only in so far as your enviroment is different. The soul doesn't change materially.

[Jaggler]

Dragonflight was Danusers baby. Metzen came in late into Dragonflight development. The only reason Iridikron is still alive is because the end boss was switched when Metzen came back, changed the complete ending direction of the planned stories and planned a Saga instead.

People really just love spouting random stuff.

There is no reason to believe that the endboss/ending of Dragonflight was changed in a major way.