The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Nymrohd]

If they add a new spec, that means:

A) they have to uproot a Hero tree between 2 specs and add a new hero tree so there are 4 total, or

B) make every Hero tree available as a choice to each spec. That means some tuning for some specs, but some may be hard to work with (like wtf can they do with Oracle to make it work for Shadow?).

I think the 'Every Hero tree for any spec' will be inevitable. But I can't see it happen 1 major patch into TWW. That feels like an end of expansion power up like how we had our Artifact weapons overcapping by the time we invaded Argus or the HoA got giga boosted with M.O.T.H.E.R's help at the end of BFA.

They could just add two Hero Talents that hook on nothing other than the spec or let a Hero Talent hook on three+ specs.

[Sondrelk]

A Capital down the line doesn't work. We saw it with Bel'ameth. No one is there. It was dead when it was current. The only reason people went there was to get the few items cosmetics.

Wasting a perfectly fine Hub just for a bit a gameplay, that can be done in every other part. Like, you can make Isle of Quel'danas into your "city scape adventure zone" instead. Or Deathholme, or Zul Aman, or Tranquillien, or heck even Stratholme people fantasize about.

And delves, dungeons and raids can be still placed inside a Hub city. We had dungeon entrances in Hubs since classic with the Stockade and Ragefire Chasm, or the Violet Hold with Dalaran twice, we had raid entries in Boralus/Dazar'Alor. And we can easily place a delve next to or in the Hub. Still, nothing of that requires a beloved city like Silvermoon to be wasted on a adventure zone.

Bel'ameth could easily be made into a full City though. The only reason we don't seem to have gotten a bank, AH, and all the other stuff there seems more to do with the developers being lazy.

Also, while it might not matter to everyone. Making Silvermoon an expansion hub does mean it effectively stops being a Horde hub like it is now, and instead becomes an expansion hub instead, for which you have to accommodate Alliance as well. Which I know some players won't like.


Still think we are going to get more than just Quel'thalas as zones though. And in that case I think it would be way more fun if we got Gilneas and Lordaeron updated to full cities and used as a split faction hub.

[Woobels]

Out of the loop, haven't played TWW yet. Are there any hints about the location of the 2nd raid of the expansion?

[Cheezits]

Out of the loop, haven't played TWW yet. Are there any hints about the location of the 2nd raid of the expansion?

There are three main teases:

-Undermine
-"The Rootlands", where the Haranir come from (that was the devname for the area_)
-The Worldcore, a titan installation to observe the world soul

IMO the raids will be Undermine and Worldcore with Rootlands as the megadungeon, because another Life and Dream themed raid after DF would be derivative.

[milkmustache]

There are three main teases:

-Undermine
-"The Rootlands", where the Haranir come from (that was the devname for the area_)
-The Worldcore, a titan installation to observe the world soul

IMO the raids will be Undermine and Worldcore with Rootlands as the megadungeon, because another Life and Dream themed raid after DF would be derivative.

Also something with Ethereals down the line. We interrupt the Ethereal boss in Nerub'ar having a secret conversation, which she points out as a secret she must kill us to protect, then when she's defeated she leaves through a portal to meet again. "etherealraid" item names have been datamined, but I believe they coincide with the items dropped by this boss.

Ethereals imminent, maybe not in TWW as a raid or major patch theme, but expect them to continue to be brought up and utilized.

Extra tinfoil says that the Shadowguard Ethereals will be working with whatever cartel Gallywix is running in Undermine.

[Sondrelk]

Out of the loop, haven't played TWW yet. Are there any hints about the location of the 2nd raid of the expansion?

For raid specifically the only strong contender is Undermine, due to a items with data mined names like "Undermineraid".
If you just want general locations and themes for Season 2 then there are two strong contenders.
Undermine of course, due to the aforementioned reasons, as well as Gazlowe being important. Goblins generally being everywhere. Siren Isle being heavy on the Goblin theme. As well as small stuff like one of the developers having a screen with Kezan on it during the Siren Isle reveal.
The other strong option is Rootlands. Primarily due to the Harrinir, who are still largely unexplained. Orweyna who is shaping up to be important in future patches. As well as Rootlands originally being a zone on early dev maps of Khaz Algar back in Alpha and Beta.

Of the two options Undermine seems the most likely for next raid all things considered. It is currently being foreshadowed. Goblin assets are currently being updated. And Goblin characters are getting brand new unique models.

- - - Updated - - -

There are three main teases:

-Undermine
-"The Rootlands", where the Haranir come from (that was the devname for the area_)
-The Worldcore, a titan installation to observe the world soul

IMO the raids will be Undermine and Worldcore with Rootlands as the megadungeon, because another Life and Dream themed raid after DF would be derivative.

I could easily see Rootlands be the zone that leads into the Worldcore. Just skip a nature themed instance entirely.
The Megadungeon could be the Beledar, following DF having the Megadungeon be the important bit of story,and the raid mostly being a side thing.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I'm still expecting a future location to be a yet-to-be-revealed deceased titan's head, that has been hollowed out and repurposed as a base of operations for some big bad also yet-to-be-revealed.

That location could be called... Someplace.

/s

- - - Updated - - -

Out of the loop, haven't played TWW yet. Are there any hints about the location of the 2nd raid of the expansion?

There is a lot of speculation (and hype) around a goblin-centric patch and raid. Perhaps the Undermine.

The "Rootlands" is also a contender with the thought of a separate goblin faction (The Venture Co. or even a returning Gallywix) attempting to excavate/strip mine the "Rootlands" area.

[Woobels]

Thanks for the responses. Undermine does sound exciting, I'd sub for that.

Rootlands is the opposite of exciting to me right now, feel that entire flavor of raid/instance has been overdone.

[Nymrohd]

Thanks for the responses. Undermine does sound exciting, I'd sub for that.

Rootlands is the opposite of exciting to me right now, feel that entire flavor of raid/instance has been overdone.

It has indeed. I do hope they manage to balance it out with another theme. Personally hoping that Rootlands will also be mixed with Titan architecture so it will be an interesting mix.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I still have my hopes pegged to the reveal that the Undermine is the location of the last titan facility we have not seen: Uldaz.

Whether the actual sprawling city of the Undermine is it, or it was built on top of (or around) the facility... or if goblins already discovered it, but not knowing what it actually was, repurposed it into something else.

I was thinking that maybe the last titan facility would be housed where the Arathi Empire is located but with the revelations of the titan's Manifold complex and the Worldcore reveal, it would be interesting to see the final titan facility being connected to those 2.

[Joshuaj]

I still have my hopes pegged to the reveal that the Undermine is the location of the last titan facility we have not seen: Uldaz.

Whether the actual sprawling city of the Undermine is it, or it was built on top of (or around) the facility... or if goblins already discovered it, but not knowing what it actually was, repurposed it into something else.

I was thinking that maybe the last titan facility would be housed where the Arathi Empire is located but with the revelations of the titan's Manifold complex and the Worldcore reveal, it would be interesting to see the final titan facility being connected to those 2.

Hmmm...

What if: Uldaz is a Titan facility the Goblins built the Undermine around, or what if it's the final raid and/or patch zone of the expac?

[Ersula]

Hmmm...

What if: Uldaz is a Titan facility the Goblins built the Undermine around, or what if it's the final raid and/or patch zone of the expac?

If that was the plan then they would have just set the expansion in Undermine. Surely the arc of the expansion was chosen around the significance of Khaz Algar itself, which has not yet been made evident.

Which is why I think it's more likely that Goblins from Undermine will be coming to Khaz Algar, rather than us going to Undermine.

[Nymrohd]

If that was the plan then they would have just set the expansion in Undermine. Surely the arc of the expansion was chosen around the significance of Khaz Algar itself, which has not yet been made evident.

Which is why I think it's more likely that Goblins from Undermine will be coming to Khaz Algar, rather than us going to Undermine.

I assume the point of Khaz Algar is the Coreway and the Beledar.

[Ersula]

I assume the point of Khaz Algar is the Coreway and the Beledar.

Season 1 : Nerubian Palace (Spiders who work for Xalatath)
Season 2 : Rootland Bedrock (Goblins who work for Xalatath)
Season 3 : The Titan Fascility at the Bottom of the Coreway (Corrupted Titan Constructs who work for Xalatath)

The most obvious plotline seems to me that Goblins from Undermine are going to get into the Rootlands immediately start destroying it for resources. A lot of iconic Goblin Shredder imagery, making it different enough aesthetically from 10.2. And it would give Gazlowe story focus, emphasizing how the horde Goblins are different from the Undermine cartels.

[Joshuaj]

If that was the plan then they would have just set the expansion in Undermine. Surely the arc of the expansion was chosen around the significance of Khaz Algar itself, which has not yet been made evident.

Which is why I think it's more likely that Goblins from Undermine will be coming to Khaz Algar, rather than us going to Undermine.

Why not have it both ways?

Also, much of the content is centered around Khaz'Algar. The expansions premise is Underground however. Going to the Undermine, even if for a single megadungeon, would work just fine.

- - - Updated - - -

Season 1 : Nerubian Palace (Spiders who work for Xalatath)
Season 2 : Rootland Bedrock (Goblins who work for Xalatath)
Season 3 : The Titan Fascility at the Bottom of the Coreway (Corrupted Titan Constructs who work for Xalatath)

The most obvious plotline seems to me that Goblins from Undermine are going to get into the Rootlands immediately start destroying it for resources. A lot of iconic Goblin Shredder imagery, making it different enough aesthetically from 10.2. And it would give Gazlowe story focus, emphasizing how the horde Goblins are different from the Undermine cartels.

Yeah this is most likely what's gonna happen.

11.1 being rootlands, and 11.2 being Worldcore stuff.

11.1.5 could be the Undermine tho.

[Enrif]

Bel'ameth could easily be made into a full City though. The only reason we don't seem to have gotten a bank, AH, and all the other stuff there seems more to do with the developers being lazy.

That is a pretty Ignorant perspective. Bel'ameht was added in the last patch of DF. Making it into a Hub had no benefits at that point. The same why Gilneas is not a hub. Sure, in the story both, the Night Elves and Gilneas have a home back, but in the game it resulted in nothing. And they will stay that way. Especially Bel'amath, as i see no future update to that part of the world for the next 20 years, if at all. Gilneas maybe with the actual Eastern Kingdoms revamp.

Also, while it might not matter to everyone. Making Silvermoon an expansion hub does mean it effectively stops being a Horde hub like it is now, and instead becomes an expansion hub instead, for which you have to accommodate Alliance as well. Which I know some players won't like.

No one cares for faction separated hubs. Players want to play together. Even the plot of elven unification would require a neutral hub.

[Nerdslime]

Realistically there are two options for Midnight:

1- Quel'thalas expanded to have 4 zones, all of them above the Plaguelands.
2- A full revamp of every zone above the Thandol Span.

I think that most players dream about option 2, but deep down we know that we will get option 1.

My crazed conspiracy theory copium hot take is that TWW is a placeholder xpac while the extreme majority of the WoW staff are working on the Midnight and TLT trama because of the revamp demands.

My "evidence" is the low effort recycle of the 10.0.5 Onyx Annulet and island gimmick, the incredibly buggy mess of 11.0.5 patch, and the obviously unfinished Hero Talent specs that the xpac launched with and I some cases still has. I feel like this xpac is a fun, pleasant, enjoyable placeholder that most of us are enjoying but not madly in love with, while the majority of the crew funnels efforts into the EK and Northrend revamps, which are tremendous undertakings at any scale (but hopefully the larger scale, your Option 1).

I have a very large tank of hopium and a large tank of copium and I huff them regularly to balance this crazy conspiracy theory daily.

[Bwgmon]

B) make every Hero tree available as a choice to each spec. That means some tuning for some specs, but some may be hard to work with (like wtf can they do with Oracle to make it work for Shadow?)

Feel like a better "how?" case would be a Pack Leader Marksman.

[Makabreska]

Let Blizz maybe actually fix and improve already existing Hero Talents combinations, instead of giving them more work.

[Ersula]

B) make every Hero tree available as a choice to each spec. That means some tuning for some specs, but some may be hard to work with (like wtf can they do with Oracle to make it work for Shadow?).

Well, there's specs where the mechanics make no sense, both mechanically & thematically. Like, Frostfire Arcane might work but why would you want that? Or Shado-pan Mistweaver would have to be recreated from the ground up because nothing it does would improve Monk Healing.

I think they only did Hero Talents this way so every spec has an option of two, as a minimum. Surely if they add a new spec, that spec will simply have two original hero talent trees. There's no downside to having a hero spec not shared between regular specs.