The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[milkmustache]

People aren't even speculating at this point, they're just fantasizing what they want.

To start a speculation, you need in-game evidence to add to the substance.

But in a nutshell it's just I want A, B and C to happen.

Having Class Order halls about you've got about as much chance as a Chuck Norris class anytime soon. Ion has only namedropped Legion because Legion Remix is due not too in the distant future

I would typically agree, but Class Order Halls were part of a focus on the Blizzard survey from a few months ago, far before Legion Remix held any water.

[Merryck]

I don't see the point of class halls when we're getting our own houses.

[milkmustache]

I don't see the point of class halls when we're getting our own houses.

Class Halls aren't about personal expression and customization, they're about the class fantasy and depicting a story for that class. They'd have to have a different approach as we've abandoned the missions table type of situation, but we won't be designing a class hall, just living within the order via quests and weeklies.

If what you mean is that bringing back Class Order Halls while we have Housing will further deplete capital city population, then I understand that and partially agree.

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I don't think Order Halls in their Legion iteration need to return.

Instead, refresh all the Capital cities and ensure at least one of them on each faction has got something to offer for each class. Whether that's a little Warlock hideout like the Slaughtered Lamb or whatever it's called in Stormwind, or a corner of the Stormwind Cathedral reserved for Paladin stuff.

I don't totally disagree, but the big part about Class Order Halls was that they were united forces of that class, regardless of faction. At the moment, Tauren Paladins wouldn't be able to enter the Stormwind Cathedral, and so forth. I think there could definitely be a new approach to them, but dividing them amongst factions may not be feasible.

It'd be fun to integrate them into the expansion zone in my opinion. So if in The Last Titan, mages in the Nexus, warriors in Utgarde, death knights in Icecrown and so forth. Not necessarily instanced areas, but similar delve technology of seamless phasing so it feels integrated in the zones.

[Xilurm]

Genuine question. Why do people care about having a big city population? Are you actually talking to anyone there? I'm on Silvermoon EU, biggest Alliance server in Europe and everyone in Stormwind and Dornogal and previously Valdrakken is just sitting there. People aren't interact with each other at all and general chat is dead silent. Only trade gets spammed in its usual light speed fashion.

[milkmustache]

Beyond the novelty of it all, I don't think the homogenisation of class flavour in Order Halla was a good thing, though.

Sunwalker Paladins being forced into the same template as Knights of the Silver Hand is detrimental to the lore. And, frankly, as a fan of conventional Paladin lore I didn't particularly enjoy mingling with Tauren, Blood Elves, etc.

I definitely agree here. Maybe there's a middleground they can do? Different experiences for different class/race combos? Probably too much work lol.

Genuine question. Why do people care about having a big city population? Are you actually talking to anyone there? I'm on Silvermoon EU, biggest Alliance server in Europe and everyone in Stormwind and Dornogal and previously Valdrakken is just sitting there. People aren't interact with each other at all and general chat is dead silent. Only trade gets spammed in its usual light speed fashion.

I think (personally) it's because of the MMO feel. It's all feeling, really. Even if they're sitting, I love seeing a lively city, it's part of what makes this game so awesome.

[PenguinChan]

Genuine question. Why do people care about having a big city population? Are you actually talking to anyone there? I'm on Silvermoon EU, biggest Alliance server in Europe and everyone in Stormwind and Dornogal and previously Valdrakken is just sitting there. People aren't interact with each other at all and general chat is dead silent. Only trade gets spammed in its usual light speed fashion.

Because seeing other players in an MMORPG is rather nice, it’s a subconscious thing but other people being around makes the game ‘feel’ alive and bustling. Just because you aren’t interacting doesn’t mean others aren’t—don’t forget people often whisper or go into whisper after saying hi to someone.

Also if your MMORPG looks empty people won’t feel inclined to stay subbed and quit. This isn’t true for everyone obviously but it’s definitely a common sentiment.

[Xilurm]

I think (personally) it's because of the MMO feel. It's all feeling, really. Even if they're sitting, I love seeing a lively city, it's part of what makes this game so awesome.

That makes sense. Personally I don't really care, I prefer coming across players outside of cities so we can actually do something.

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Because seeing other players in an MMORPG is rather nice, it’s a subconscious thing but other people being around makes the game ‘feel’ alive and bustling. Just because you aren’t interacting doesn’t mean others aren’t—don’t forget people often whisper or go into whisper after saying hi to someone.

Also if your MMORPG looks empty people won’t feel inclined to stay subbed and quit. This isn’t true for everyone obviously but it’s definitely a common sentiment.

It is. I hate how quiet general chat is though. I've tried typing something multiple times but no one really talks about anything, which is so weird to me. That didn't use to happen before.

[Mackud]

I would typically agree, but Class Order Halls were part of a focus on the Blizzard survey from a few months ago, far before Legion Remix held any water.

Fair enough but realistic expectations is needed also. The game so far is being run on a pretty low budget, it's the 2nd .5 patch in a row with re-used assets, we've had a major patch contain 1 questline, an undertuned raid, some pets and mounts to collect and that's it. They even appeared to run out of budget to make the new delve companion they promised so much. It's not Warlords of Draenor bad or Shadowlands bad but it's still bad.

I think it sets the tone what to expect, they should be called Temu Class Order halls where they'll just say it's somewhere to AFK because Dalaran doesn't exist anymore.

It is a very negative tone but we're not being spoiled for content at all and it will drive away players overtime more than appeal to them.

Not the only MMO driving away players, FF14 is currently on its Shadowland-esque content drought and they've tried advertising the fact the game is going back to the Final Fantasy 9 city of Alexandria with General Beatrix being the raid boss, any 90's Final Fantasy player would normally have erection problems reminiscing the old FF's but the tone has been like cool, whatever, because they know the game is being ran like shit.

[PenguinChan]

That makes sense. Personally I don't really care, I prefer coming across players outside of cities so we can actually do something.

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It is. I hate how quiet general chat is though. I've tried typing something multiple times but no one really talks about anything, which is so weird to me. That didn't use to happen before.

Discord. Battle.net dms, guild chats and whispers. WoW isn’t many people’s primary social game or more accurately they have the people they like to talk to in DMs or on a discord server lol. People do talk but imagine if EVERYONE began using general / say chat, jesus christ it would be unusable.

[Xilurm]

Discord. Battle.net dms, guild chats and whispers. WoW isn’t many people’s primary social game or more accurately they have the people they like to talk to in DMs or on a discord server lol. People do talk but imagine if EVERYONE began using general / say chat, jesus christ it would be unusable.

Well General chat used to be like that back in the day (and when I say back in the day I mean WoD because when I quit then and came back for SL it had already stopped) and there was usually always a conversation going on every time I visited a capital city. Guess it must've slowly phased out.

[PenguinChan]

Well General chat used to be like that back in the day (and when I say back in the day I mean WoD because when I quit then and came back for SL it had already stopped) and there was usually always a conversation going on every time I visited a capital city. Guess it must've slowly phased out.

Don’t forget that Blizzard made it reaaaaalllly easy to report players and they actually do punish people for talking about rancid shit. So I’m assuming the safe space mentality has also affected public speaking.

[Hitei]

Guess the shamans, druids, rogues, monks and evoker can get recked, as there is no place for them in quel'thalas.

Exactly. How did you unironically type this but don't then see how TLT is not a good reason to bring back class halls?

You literally told warlocks, rogues, demon hunters, monks, shamans, hunters, and priests (who are now just discount paladins) to all get fucked. That is what I have been saying this entire time. There's only good places for a couple classes and the rest you're just throwing random crap like "K3" or "Tuskarr" or "a ziggurat that has nothing to do with your class" at them. Quel'thalas has places for more classes, so if you were going to make the argument that "there's lots of good class locations so class halls should come back" (which isn't true of any of the three WSS expansions) it should at least be for Midnight, not TLT.

Because at least in Midnight, you could put shamans and druids with that shamanistic pseduo druidic troll race, and rogues can go in the already existed since BC seedy back alley area of Silvermoon. And now you are leaving two classes out in the cold instead of seven of them.

[Enrif]

Exactly. How did you unironically type this but don't then see how TLT is not a good reason to bring back class halls?

You literally told warlocks, rogues, demon hunters, monks, shamans, hunters, and priests (who are now just discount paladins) to all get fucked. That is what I have been saying this entire time. There's only good places for a couple classes and the rest you're just throwing random crap like "K3" or "Tuskarr" or "a ziggurat that has nothing to do with your class" at them. Quel'thalas has places for more classes, so if you were going to make the argument that "there's lots of good class locations so class halls should come back" (which isn't true of any of the three WSS expansions) it should at least be for Midnight, not TLT.

Because at least in Midnight, you could put shamans and druids with that shamanistic pseduo druidic troll race, and rogues can go in the already existed since BC seedy back alley area of Silvermoon. And now you are leaving two classes out in the cold instead of seven of them.

compared to quel'thalas, Northrend is far more varried. And lumping 3 or 4 classes to "troll dudes", while all the rest is "elf dudes" is less class centric, and more bending class identity to fit trolls and elves.

In northrend, most classes can stay true to their class identity without being forced to confirm to 2 race ideas. Or do you really think "troll shaman oder hall", "troll druid order hall", troll warrior order hall", "elf paladin order hall", "elf mage order hall", "elf warlock order hall" etc is really people want?

Other already pointed out some of the issues of the old order halls, like tauran paladins being tied to the silver hand.
Northrend would have different options. Paladins at the Argent Tournament Grounds would solve their biggest issue they had in Legion, as the Argent Tournament was about all the different races and their representation, which fits much better for tauran, zandalari, dark iron, draenie, lightforged, earthen paladins.

And this would hold true for the other locations. You may dislike K3 for rogues, but it makes sense, as it is likely the location that makes sense for cunning rogues to hang out. If not thjat, there were also pirates in Northrend, so there is a connection for outlaw rogues too.

I give that demon hunter and warlock are the only two classes that don't fit well. But since Wrath we had Legion, so perhaps there is some demon stuff now in Northrend.

[Darkarath]

I think that the place of the Order Halls, if they ever come back, is the least important aspect of the system by far.

Give me an evergreen system, continuously updated with class-specific cosmetics, companions questlines, class questlines and a cool customizable place, wherever it might be.

[Hitei]

compared to quel'thalas, Northrend is far more varried. And lumping 3 or 4 classes to "troll dudes", while all the rest is "elf dudes" is less class centric, and more bending class identity to fit trolls and elves.

In northrend, most classes can stay true to their class identity without being forced to confirm to 2 race ideas. Or do you really think "troll shaman oder hall", "troll druid order hall", troll warrior order hall", "elf paladin order hall", "elf mage order hall", "elf warlock order hall" etc is really people want?

It's what they want more than... Tuskarr monk order hall? and Snow goblin rogue order hall? Warlocks are now pretend necromancers? Shamans sit around with a bunch of dwarves who have nothing to do with shamans. You're complaining about warriors getting Valhalla, "instead of an arena" (despite the fact that there was literally an arena in their class hall), because it was too Titan-y, but you want Demon Hunters to stand around the titan keeper shrines? Ah yes, all very "true to their class identity", I'm glad we managed to avoid Elves or Trolls.

And this would hold true for the other locations. You may dislike K3 for rogues, but it makes sense, as it is likely the location that makes sense for cunning rogues to hang out.

No, as a rogue player, it really, really, really doesn't. It's a tinker town that has absolutely nothing to do with rogues, in the middle of absolutely nowhere. Why would cunning rogues be hanging out in a town with a bunch of explosions going off nearby, mechs stomping around and a flashing beacon light advertising "HEY THERE'S A TOWN HERE"? How the hell does K3, a landlocked mountain town, have a connection to outlaw rogues "because there are pirates in a completely different zone on the other side of the continent"? I'm not sure you could pick a less sensical location for rogues to be at. They'd unironically be better off just finding a random cave to build a base in.

It is a terrible continent for class halls.

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I think that the place of the Order Halls, if they ever come back, is the least important aspect of the system by far.

Give me an evergreen system, continuously updated with class-specific cosmetics, companions questlines, class questlines and a cool customizable place, wherever it might be.

You can make all of those without order halls. Rogues, warlocks and DH all have little quests in TWW. We get class-specific cosmetics frequently. We are getting an infinitely more customizable place next expansion.

[Darkarath]

You can make all of those without order halls. Rogues, warlocks and DH all have little quests in TWW. We get class-specific cosmetics frequently. We are getting an infinitely more customizable place next expansion.

I have a questline in TWW? I am a DH. I haven't noticed :S

Anyway, I agree that with Housing coming, the main point of Class Order Halls, which is having a cool place that you can share with other players of your same class, will be far less attractive, as most people will be just chilling in their house.

I still think that they can have a place in WoW, though.

[Nymrohd]

I think that the place of the Order Halls, if they ever come back, is the least important aspect of the system by far.

Give me an evergreen system, continuously updated with class-specific cosmetics, companions questlines, class questlines and a cool customizable place, wherever it might be.

Very much agreed. Order Halls if they'd come back, should not be an expansion specific system. They should be hubs for class customization.

Also classes that have varied origins should not have Order Halls that are bound to a specific theme. No Silver Hand for all Paladins for instance, give them e.g. a Knight Tournament ground (Argent Tournament re-imagined anyone?)

[Hitei]

I have a questline in TWW? I am a DH. I haven't noticed :S

Anyway, I agree that with Housing coming, the main point of Class Order Halls, which is having a cool place that you can share with other players of your same class, will be far less attractive, as most people will be just chilling in their house.

I still think that they can have a place in WoW, though.

DH and warlock have a quest in Ringing Deeps to track down a demon. Rogues have a series of quests about stealing candles from the earthen for kobolds. Mages have a quest where the conjure food for the inn. Paladins and priests have a quest about blessing homes with incense.

[Enrif]

It is a terrible continent for class halls.

that's your opinion. I can clearly see how it works pretty well.

And if you are so hung up, about a few specific ideas.
Rogues, can go either: K3, Northsea Pirates, Ahn'kahet, Valiance Keep (if it becomes faction neutral). All of these makes perfect sense.
Shaman, can go either: Frost Giant, Frostborne, Crystal Song Forest (it had varied elementals in that area), Zul'drak
Druids, can go either: Grizzlemaw, Ursocs Den, or anywhere in Scholazar Basin
Warlocks, can go either: Any of the necropolies, Bloodmoon Isle, Temple City of En'kilah, something that might have been there from the legion invasion

there are multiple fit. It doesn't matter if they don't fit your specific idea of a class order hall

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DH and warlock have a quest in Ringing Deeps to track down a demon. Rogues have a series of quests about stealing candles from the earthen for kobolds. Mages have a quest where the conjure food for the inn. Paladins and priests have a quest about blessing homes with incense.

there is also a quest for evokers to heat a forge

[Xilurm]

DH and warlock have a quest in Ringing Deeps to track down a demon. Rogues have a series of quests about stealing candles from the earthen for kobolds. Mages have a quest where the conjure food for the inn. Paladins and priests have a quest about blessing homes with incense.

I love that stuff so much. Gives life to the RPG aspect of the game.