The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Dvalin]

We got this from a Gamerant article, it's a full quote:

"We’re giving our world builders some free rein to expand. Those areas may be geographically larger than they were. That’ll give them more opportunities to introduce some of the smaller points of interest where you’ll have a culture or a local tribe and give them the ability to have storylines that center on that. We don’t want people to feel like, oh, wait a minute, it’s that same place I know. It’s gonna feel like the same place; it’s just that it is literally going to be a little bit larger than what you’ve experienced. Flight being much more accessible, we need to have a larger landmass for people to be able to explore.”

People expecting a 'revamp' or more than Quel'thalas at launch of Midnight will be sorely disappointed, as they'll do a deep-dive into that subcontinent instead. Other interviews also mentioned '4 zones at launch, just like the War Within'.

[Khaza-R]

We got this from a Gamerant article, it's a full quote:

"We’re giving our world builders some free rein to expand. Those areas may be geographically larger than they were. That’ll give them more opportunities to introduce some of the smaller points of interest where you’ll have a culture or a local tribe and give them the ability to have storylines that center on that. We don’t want people to feel like, oh, wait a minute, it’s that same place I know. It’s gonna feel like the same place; it’s just that it is literally going to be a little bit larger than what you’ve experienced. Flight being much more accessible, we need to have a larger landmass for people to be able to explore.”

People expecting a 'revamp' or more than Quel'thalas at launch of Midnight will be sorely disappointed, as they'll do a deep-dive into that subcontinent instead. Other interviews also mentioned '4 zones at launch, just like the War Within'.

While I get why people are desperate for an EK revamp, I think the approach they are going with is way more interesting. Rescaling Quel'thalas hopefully means towns and settlements actually feel like people live there and not just a collection of 3 buildings. Hopefully it sets a good precedent for when they eventually do get to rebuilding the old continents

[Sondrelk]

While I get why people are desperate for an EK revamp, I think the approach they are going with is way more interesting. Rescaling Quel'thalas hopefully means towns and settlements actually feel like people live there and not just a collection of 3 buildings. Hopefully it sets a good precedent for when they eventually do get to rebuilding the old continents

It's good in theory. But it also more or less scuttles any hope of revamps of specific zones.
If Quel'thalas is scales up to a full expansion, then just having the Forsaken zones be updated would take a full expansion. And that in turn means some zones would probably be left out completely. Not to mention how long it would take to even get to expansions with other old zones to begin with. How long will players who love the Dark Iron zones have to wait if it takes 5-6 expansions at the minimum just to update all of EK?

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I am still holding out hope for Midnight being northern EK. Yes, it would means some areas are small. But not every zone needs to be Suramar in terms of scale. Jintha'alor in the Hinterlands is already pretty damn big. And quite a lot of size could be achieved with better use of the existing space. Not to mention using the various areas of dead space in older zones, like all the mountains between zones.

[Khaza-R]

It's good in theory. But it also more or less scuttles any hope of revamps of specific zones.
If Quel'thalas is scales up to a full expansion, then just having the Forsaken zones be updated would take a full expansion. And that in turn means some zones would probably be left out completely. Not to mention how long it would take to even get to expansions with other old zones to begin with. How long will players who love the Dark Iron zones have to wait if it takes 5-6 expansions at the minimum just to update all of EK?

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I am still holding out hope for Midnight being northern EK. Yes, it would means some areas are small. But not every zone needs to be Suramar in terms of scale. Jintha'alor in the Hinterlands is already pretty damn big. And quite a lot of size could be achieved with better use of the existing space. Not to mention using the various areas of dead space in older zones, like all the mountains between zones.

Zones would of had to been consolidated and the map effectively re-drawn anyway though. We are far, far removed from origins of this game and when you needed 40 zones for leveling. So there will probably be some amount of rescaling and also merging of old zones. Something like the whole of Lordaeron being redrawn into 5 zones seems plausible to me.

The larger roadblock I think is how you fit an expansion around these specific locations while keeping the story interesting and not overly forced? And how do you revamp these pieces fast enough that 12 years hasn't gone by and first zones revamped aren't already showing their age? In truth no matter what way you go about a revamp, it poses a ton of problems they have to figure out.

[Dracullus]

Ok, so you do not have any source and it's all guesses.

All we know for sure is that we re-visit Quel'thalas. That's it.

Personally I think Quel'Thalas and Northrend were picked for first revamp expansions because they are isolated behind loading screens. Imo EK will be revamped together in single expansion - or in 2 expansions with border between Arathi and Wetlands.

My guesses for QT are:
- Silvermoon capital
- Eversong
- zone above Eversong (some kind of cloud city) or Naga underwater zone on the coast
- Ghostlands (Undead theme)
- Amani zone (troll theme) - first raid
- Sunwell island (12.1) - second raid
- Karesh (12.2) - third raid

Also, Plaguelands are Undead + Human theme and we know Midnight will be mostly about Elves and Void, so imo Ghostlands focused on Undead (and specifically about Sylvanas/Undead elves) will be enough.

[Joshuaj]

We got this from a Gamerant article, it's a full quote:

"We’re giving our world builders some free rein to expand. Those areas may be geographically larger than they were. That’ll give them more opportunities to introduce some of the smaller points of interest where you’ll have a culture or a local tribe and give them the ability to have storylines that center on that. We don’t want people to feel like, oh, wait a minute, it’s that same place I know. It’s gonna feel like the same place; it’s just that it is literally going to be a little bit larger than what you’ve experienced. Flight being much more accessible, we need to have a larger landmass for people to be able to explore.”

People expecting a 'revamp' or more than Quel'thalas at launch of Midnight will be sorely disappointed, as they'll do a deep-dive into that subcontinent instead. Other interviews also mentioned '4 zones at launch, just like the War Within'.

Honestly, while I don't think the entirety of the Northern Eastern Kingdoms needs a revamp (Or at least not yet), I do want Blizzard to do something with the Plaguelands, specifically the Northern Eastern Plaguelands.

Revamping and expanding Quel'thalas + remaking the Plaguelands would be a fucking dream and a half.

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Personally I think Quel'Thalas and Northrend were picked for first revamp expansions because they are isolated behind loading screens. Imo EK will be revamped together in single expansion - or in 2 expansions with border between Arathi and Wetlands.

My guesses for QT are:
- Silvermoon capital
- Eversong
- zone above Eversong (some kind of cloud city) or Naga underwater zone on the coast
- Ghostlands (Undead theme)
- Amani zone (troll theme) - first raid
- Sunwell island (12.1) - second raid
- Karesh (12.2) - third raid

Also, Plaguelands are Undead + Human theme and we know Midnight will be mostly about Elves and Void, so imo Ghostlands focused on Undead (and specifically about Sylvanas/Undead elves) will be enough.

That's basically what I think, but for the 12.2 raid, I'd do this:

First half of the raid: Broken Capital of K'aresh, located within the planets core.

Second half of the raid: The Final Battleground of Renilash, where the realms of Light and Shadow clash in a final apocalyptic duel. Dimensius or K'aresh's worldsoul will likely be the final boss, and Dimensius is stopped before he could devour Azeroth's Worldsoul and gain her power. However, like Sargeras and Zovaal, Dimensius is able to strike at Azeroth and either harm her or corrupt her considerably. This damage will kickstart the events of the Last Titan!

Or at least, this is my hope.

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Also, I think the Ghostlands and Plaguelands should be revamped into Shadow and Light themed zones respectively.

Have the Plaguelands get revamped into The Holylands, and have the Ghostlands get revamped into The Darklands.

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That way, you have Eversong Forest, Zul'Aman, the Darklands, and the Holylands! 4 starting zones for Midnight. The Isle of Quel'danas could be Midnights Broken Shore equivalent. Like, it would technically be a zone, but it'll be saved for patch content.

For 12.1, I can see a Naga based shore that takes place on or off the shores of Quel'thalas. The raid for 12.1 can be based around the Sunwell then, with Queen Azshara as the final boss. And if not Azshara, then somebody idfk. I just don't want Azshara as the final boss of Midnight. She's a stupid character who's in way over her head.

[Sondrelk]

Zones would of had to been consolidated and the map effectively re-drawn anyway though. We are far, far removed from origins of this game and when you needed 40 zones for leveling. So there will probably be some amount of rescaling and also merging of old zones. Something like the whole of Lordaeron being redrawn into 5 zones seems plausible to me.

The larger roadblock I think is how you fit an expansion around these specific locations while keeping the story interesting and not overly forced? And how do you revamp these pieces fast enough that 12 years hasn't gone by and first zones revamped aren't already showing their age? In truth no matter what way you go about a revamp, it poses a ton of problems they have to figure out.

That's why I think it's better to update EK and Kalimdor in no more than 6 expansions. And ideally just 4.
Northern EK in Midnight, with Elves, and the legacy of the old 7 kingdoms (forsaken, Scarlet crusade, Arathi, etc), and the Amani as one.
Southern EK with DI Dwarves. Gurubashi and Hakkar, and Defias as one.
Northern Kalimdor with Hyjal, Furbolg, and Orcs.
Southern EK with Nelves, Tauren, and Silithus.

Midnight is probably the one that needs to be that specific area the most. Both the Forsaken and Quel'thalas storyline needs to deal with the Scourge. And that general area is so self contained it's hard to imagine dividing it up in any way. A scourge storyline in Quel'thalas would feel naked without Stratholme.

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Personally I think Quel'Thalas and Northrend were picked for first revamp expansions because they are isolated behind loading screens. Imo EK will be revamped together in single expansion - or in 2 expansions with border between Arathi and Wetlands.

My guesses for QT are:
- Silvermoon capital
- Eversong
- zone above Eversong (some kind of cloud city) or Naga underwater zone on the coast
- Ghostlands (Undead theme)
- Amani zone (troll theme) - first raid
- Sunwell island (12.1) - second raid
- Karesh (12.2) - third raid

Also, Plaguelands are Undead + Human theme and we know Midnight will be mostly about Elves and Void, so imo Ghostlands focused on Undead (and specifically about Sylvanas/Undead elves) will be enough.

I am going to be honest. That sounds awful. Nothing but elves for two years straight.
And I am going to say what I have always said. Ghostlands is just there to be a halfway decent intro to the Plaguelands, which is the meaty scourge themed zone with all the relevance and lore. Why would people be happy with skirting the edge of Stratholme without actually going there?

Underwater zone is neat and all. But just showcases how little content there really is in a pure Quel'thalas expansion.

Also. No mention of the Forsaken or Arathi? The Arathi are by all accounts an elven tribe given they are all human elf hybrids. So why wouldn't you mention them in the expansion that seems custom built for the light worshipping nation that wants to fight the void?

[Joshuaj]

What? Ion said that Stratholme is part of Midnight's story? Where?

Nowhere I'm pretty sure. I want it to be tho!

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That's why I think it's better to update EK and Kalimdor in no more than 6 expansions. And ideally just 4.
Northern EK in Midnight, with Elves, and the legacy of the old 7 kingdoms (forsaken, Scarlet crusade, Arathi, etc), and the Amani as one.
Southern EK with DI Dwarves. Gurubashi and Hakkar, and Defias as one.
Northern Kalimdor with Hyjal, Furbolg, and Orcs.
Southern EK with Nelves, Tauren, and Silithus.

Midnight is probably the one that needs to be that specific area the most. Both the Forsaken and Quel'thalas storyline needs to deal with the Scourge. And that general area is so self contained it's hard to imagine dividing it up in any way. A scourge storyline in Quel'thalas would feel naked without Stratholme.

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I am going to be honest. That sounds awful. Nothing but elves for two years straight.
And I am going to say what I have always said. Ghostlands is just there to be a halfway decent intro to the Plaguelands, which is the meaty scourge themed zone with all the relevance and lore. Why would people be happy with skirting the edge of Stratholme without actually going there?

Underwater zone is neat and all. But just showcases how little content there really is in a pure Quel'thalas expansion.

Also. No mention of the Forsaken or Arathi? The Arathi are by all accounts an elven tribe given they are all human elf hybrids. So why wouldn't you mention them in the expansion that seems custom built for the light worshipping nation that wants to fight the void?

"Nothing but Elves for 2 years straight"

Now I know damn well you're not new to WoW. There's ALWAYS a main focus regarding each expac. However, that doesn't mean said focus is the ONLY focus. Midnight will likely be Elves + Trolls + Naga + Light and Shadow stuff (With the Naaru, Dimensius, Ethereals, etc). Perfect for a 2 year expac.

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Also, WoW usually expands past the base zones in patch content. Blizzard adding a new show off or on the coasts of Quel'Thalas wouldn't be impossible, like at all.

[Khaza-R]

I completely forgot about the orc assets they found.

Which makes me think. I wonder if that home event that's suppose to be later this year is actually "rebuilding" SW and Orgrimmar. Getting them ready for neighborhoods and housing.

[Sondrelk]

Nowhere I'm pretty sure. I want it to be tho!

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"Nothing but Elves for 2 years straight"

Now I know damn well you're not new to WoW. There's ALWAYS a main focus regarding each expac. However, that doesn't mean said focus is the ONLY focus. Midnight will likely be Elves + Trolls + Naga + Light and Shadow stuff (With the Naaru, Dimensius, Ethereals, etc). Perfect for a 2 year expac.

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Also, WoW usually expands past the base zones in patch content. Blizzard adding a new show off or on the coasts of Quel'Thalas wouldn't be impossible, like at all.

There is more to it than just Elves. But not based on what we have seen in the zones.
It's been a while since I levelled a Blood Elf, but I really don't remember there being much of any tertiary antagonist in those zones. We have the Amani and the Scourge. But behind that I mostly just remember the usual unusually agressive bears, or random murloc camps. Not really anything like the Gnolls or Centaur in DF.

Obviously they could add extra enemies. But that's the key word, add. If they want to expand on small stuff already present or that makes sense, they do kinda have to go further beyond Quel'thalas. Into Lordaeron to deal with Sylvanas and the Forsaken. Or Arathi Highlands or Scarlet Crusade to expand on the Arathi.

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I completely forgot about the orc assets they found.

Which makes me think. I wonder if that home event that's suppose to be later this year is actually "rebuilding" SW and Orgrimmar. Getting them ready for neighborhoods and housing.

Would make sense. With the added focus on the main cities that will come with the houses, there are certainly a lot of rough spots that could do with some polishing. NPCs that have not aged. Or just generally adding a bunch of new NPCs besides stuff like Void Elf rangers that say nothing while following a random patrol route.
And of course pathways to the new housing areas. Something to really tie them into the cities.

[Holdodlig]

The real leaks were the datamined revamp assets we made along the way... or something.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/new-and...-327800?page=2

https://www.wowhead.com/news/updated...-10-2-5-336385

I think at some point they wanted to bring us a World Revamp, but seeing how large the zones now needs to be, they've simply let that idea go away or they're setting this Saga in order to get more time. I wouldn't be surprised if they rebranded WoW into WoW 2 just like they did with Overwatch but keeping your old collection and the same races. Would be great for them if they wishes to bring new players to the game.

[Khaza-R]

Would make sense. With the added focus on the main cities that will come with the houses, there are certainly a lot of rough spots that could do with some polishing. NPCs that have not aged. Or just generally adding a bunch of new NPCs besides stuff like Void Elf rangers that say nothing while following a random patrol route.
And of course pathways to the new housing areas. Something to really tie them into the cities.

I could see it being multiple phases too

Phase 1 : Gather and relocate NPCs to help with reconstruction

Phase 2 : Help build certain projects like at port in Orgimmar or an airyard in SW, etc

Phase 3 : Rewarded a plot of land and a house for your help, community events and collecting various decorations for your house

[Joshuaj]

I think at some point they wanted to bring us a World Revamp, but seeing how large the zones now needs to be, they've simply let that idea go away or they're setting this Saga in order to get more time. I wouldn't be surprised if they rebranded WoW into WoW 2 just like they did with Overwatch but keeping your old collection and the same races. Would be great for them if they wishes to bring new players to the game.

You act like those assets won't be used for Midnight and The Last Titan LMAO

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Ffs, the HD Alliance Inn building just looks an updated version of the Valgarde Tavern, or something like that.

[Sondrelk]

You act like those assets won't be used for Midnight and The Last Titan LMAO

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Ffs, the HD Alliance Inn building just looks an updated version of the Valgarde Tavern, or something like that.

Some of them are also artifacts of early DF development. Alliance currently gets there by boat, but we were at some point told that both the Alliance and Horde would get there by airship, hence why there are airship towers and new airships for both the Alliance and Horde, despite only the Horde using them during DF.

[Reive]

i feel like blizzard is staggering 11.1.5's content because 11.1.7 has basically no content

[Sondrelk]

i feel like blizzard is staggering 11.1.5's content because 11.1.7 has basically no content

Outside the Forbidden Reach and Siren Isle, the .7 patches do seem to be mostly short questlines leading into the next major patch anyways.

[Reive]

Outside the Forbidden Reach and Siren Isle, the .7 patches do seem to be mostly short questlines leading into the next major patch anyways.

10.1.7 had the dreamsurge event. idk if 11.1.7 is going to have something similar. also, mop classic should be released before july 31th. maybe they're taking that into consideration

[milkmustache]

I could see it being multiple phases too

Phase 1 : Gather and relocate NPCs to help with reconstruction

Phase 2 : Help build certain projects like at port in Orgimmar or an airyard in SW, etc

Phase 3 : Rewarded a plot of land and a house for your help, community events and collecting various decorations for your house

This would be an incredible, incredible way to address the introduction of housing. Each phase can have various quests/weeklies that reward whatever currency is currently in play for housing, teach the players building blueprints, etc.

At the end we have already gathered a good amount of furniture and possible currency/resources for housing, access to the neighborhoods and our housing plots, and fully revamped Durotar/Elwynn that we helped build.

Pure head cannon, but man it'd be cool.

[Sondrelk]

10.1.7 had the dreamsurge event. idk if 11.1.7 is going to have something similar. also, mop classic should be released before july 31th. maybe they're taking that into consideration

Fair point. Though Dreamsurges were very anemic anyways. So I wouldnt assume the features in 11.1.5 are being stretched out to compensate. Seems to me like content of that nature would be easy to make.
Of course, if Blizzard isnt having one in 11.1.7 because Dreamsurges were considered kinda trash, then I could see that. There were definite complaints during DF of too many pointless events.

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I could see it being multiple phases too

Phase 1 : Gather and relocate NPCs to help with reconstruction

Phase 2 : Help build certain projects like at port in Orgimmar or an airyard in SW, etc

Phase 3 : Rewarded a plot of land and a house for your help, community events and collecting various decorations for your house

Sounds like a good idea to me. Something substantive to do in the current version of the cities. And which could easily be scrapped during Midnight once housing is properly available and the developers don't want to hear complaints of having to unlock what should be a base feature like transmog.

[Reive]

Fair point. Though Dreamsurges were very anemic anyways. So I wouldnt assume the features in 11.1.5 are being stretched out to compensate. Seems to me like content of that nature would be easy to make.
Of course, if Blizzard isnt having one in 11.1.7 because Dreamsurges were considered kinda trash, then I could see that. There were definite complaints during DF of too many pointless events.

dreamsurges were fine but felt pointless and repetitive after having time rifts in patch 10.1.5. i have this feeling patch 11.1.7 is going to have so little content it could actually be scrapped it if it weren't for the roadmap. mop classic, midnight reveal and patch 11.2 will be the big "hits" of the summer