The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Nymrohd]

We're not seriously organizing expansions into sagas, retroactively, are we? Why? They weren't planned that way. We know that.

Some people just cannot manage to not see patterns in everything. It is an evolutionary defect.

[BaumanKing]

The focuses are Jaina and Thrall (our Horde and Alliance talking heads), Faerin Lothar, Alleria Windrunner, Renzik the Shiv (which has been released today) and... Locus Walker.

Isn't there too many stories about Alleria already? She had one before TWW, then there was a comic, and now yet another short story before Midnight. Anything about Lor'themar? Or anyone from Quel'Thalas? No?

[Joshuaj]

Hold on a moment guys! I have a question, I just did the Achievement for the Pozznik Standard engine...so why tf don't I have it? Do I have to reach a certain renown for it? or?

Cause if so, then why tf is the Top Speed increase Engine also locked behind renown? Am I seriously stuck with the slow speed engine til then???

[alex wolf]

Personally I think that story is probably more set up for 14.0. A new faction conflict but not one you're forced into, only effects the narrative, not gameplay and maybe you can choose your allegiance regardless of race.

But I think in order for that to happen we need orcs to find their own equivalent of the Arathi Empire. And I don't really see that happening unless there's some other group of orcs out there who escaped Draenor's implosion but are thriving.

what if the theorized ogre continent survived Draenors implosion as well? and is now also a collection of floating rocks out in space

[Enrif]

There's a new Anthology of short stories releasing on November 15th of 2025, called "Crossroads", where these stories "provide deeper insight into the powers at play and the battles still to fight following The War Within." They take place in between 11.0 and 11.1, after Xal'atath's disappearance in Hallowfall.

The focuses are Jaina and Thrall (our Horde and Alliance talking heads), Faerin Lothar, Alleria Windrunner, Renzik the Shiv (which has been released today) and... Locus Walker.

A very interesting set of characters to follow. Everything links up well, especially with the current patch with Renzik, but Locus Walker there is... interesting, to say the least. More interesting, however, is no Orweyna.

Collection releases around 11.2.7, the prologue to Midnight.

I think the Haranir story got cut down, quite heavily for Metzen.

If we look at the past few expnsion:
Legion = Fel, last patch leads into...
BfA = Old Gods, last patch leads into...
SL = Death, last patch is a clean cut.

DF = Elements, last patch leads into..

TWW = Life, but i think Metzen turned that ship around and cut down on the Life aspect (Rootlands, Haranir, Earthen Druids) to instead focus on a clear cut evil with the Void.

I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get a Rootlands zone at all at this point.

Also, all story characters fit into TWW.
Jaina/Thrall = the start of TWW and how we arrive.
Faerin = The surprise story we encounter in TWW
Alleria = the thread that goes through everything
Renzik = Patch 11.1.
Locus Walker = Patch 11.2.

Also. Perhaps Orweyna turns out to be a Villain/ manipulated by Xal? This would be a twist and would fit with the "beware the eyes of green" prophecy.

[Cheezits]

I think both the Arathi and Harranir story got changed due to the saga idea and (likely) pivoting from OCshit to old world stuff. Avaloren being introduced in DF and teased twice, but not appearing for years (unless it is patch content which I strongly don't expect) doesn't make sense but would make sense for a former version of 12.0 that didn't go to Quel'thalas.

Orweyna and Rootlands are still going to happen as she features in launch MSQ, 11.0.7 and 11.1, but as the main story has now changed I can see the Rootlands story being less important now and akin to dealing with N'zoth (now the Black Blood) while Sylvanas (Xal) disappears from the expansion. Hopefully they can give TWW a satisfying little ending in itself so 11.2 doesn't just feel like the Midnight waiting room.

I could see a "titan rebellion" story happening in the early plot as it was set up by DF before Metzen got there but it would've been more tied specifically to Eonar, Life and Elune (hints in the dream, final TWW patch being Life themed again) vs TLT which now seems to more involve Sargeras and Illidan. Dream patch set up that specifically GREEN dragons made it to Avaloren and Faerin teases dragons existing on her continent.

[Khaza-R]

what if the theorized ogre continent survived Draenors implosion as well? and is now also a collection of floating rocks out in space

Now you're cooking. I don't think there was anything special about the portion of Outland that survived that couldn't apply to the Gorian continent. Unless I missed something in the lore.

But imagining a Gorian Empire that survived. Perhaps instead of an Ogre ruling class like we saw in WoD, orcs and ogres instead cooperated and developed into a more advanced Mok'nathal society even in the fringes of the Twisting Nether. Perhaps too parallel to the Arathi Empire?

[Cheezits]

Now you're cooking. I don't think there was anything special about the portion of Outland that survived that couldn't apply to the Gorian continent. Unless I missed something in the lore.

But imagining a Gorian Empire that survived. Perhaps instead of an Ogre ruling class like we saw in WoD, orcs and ogres instead cooperated and developed into a more advanced Mok'nathal society even in the fringes of the Twisting Nether. Perhaps too parallel to the Arathi Empire?

It could be a version of the Apexis Empire from WoD, as I believe we don't know what happened to the main timeline's version. The WoD version exploded due to a war between the Ogres and Arrakoa, but I could also see them recontextualizing that to them being sucked through time/space.

I do think the devs may be sitting on the Apexis as a way to get back into Ogres, Arrakoa and perhaps the Lightbound all at once when the time is right. I can't see them going for Ogrezonia over that potential, but..

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Very late thought but I just realized it's odd that we don't have Alliance and Horde themed campsites for the warband. Maybe it's just because they have to be crossfaction, but maybe they are working on HD versions of Stormwind/Org assets?

[milkmustache]

Very late thought but I just realized it's odd that we don't have Alliance and Horde themed campsites for the warband. Maybe it's just because they have to be crossfaction, but maybe they are working on HD versions of Stormwind/Org assets?

I still think there's incredible potential for the Durotar & Elwynn zones to be revamped into their respective housing zones to allow a similar seamless phasing. This could give us an updated SW & Org as well.

But the realistic side of me thinks maybe they're trying to be overall faction agnostic? They don't want us to view our warbands as Horde or Ally, but neutral? Which I think is their general direction and also sort of ignores what people really want from Horde/Alliance nowadays.

[Darkarath]

I don't see us going back to Outland or Draenor anytime soon. I mean, Outland was already revamped as Draenor, in a way, and it has been implied that both Outland and Draenor are dying out. Maybe as patch content and I find that possibility unlikely.

Blizzard seems more focused on giving us breadcrumbs of potentially two new continents on Azeroth, plus whatever old zones they want to revamp. I guess that Midnight and TLT will be a kind of ''test'' to see if they can keep making new expansions based on old content. I bet that Midnight and TLT will be VERY succesful. Not necessarily because they are revamps but because Midnight brings Housing and TLT will be the end of the WSS. So I guess that Blizzard will indeed keep revamping old zones as new expansions, and I love it.

Nevertheless, I think that they will be introducing new lands from time to time. After Midnight and TLT (two expansions of revamps), I am pretty sure that we will visit a new continent. Probably the Arathi Empire lands, whether if they are in Avaloren or in another place. It will also make sense that after we defeat the Void and the Titans, the Light will feel empowered and try to take over, but we will see... The Legion will also be in a decent shape by then, especially if Sargeras survives TLT, but I believe that they will come back later.

[Khaza-R]

I still think there's incredible potential for the Durotar & Elwynn zones to be revamped into their respective housing zones to allow a similar seamless phasing. This could give us an updated SW & Org as well.

But the realistic side of me thinks maybe they're trying to be overall faction agnostic? They don't want us to view our warbands as Horde or Ally, but neutral? Which I think is their general direction and also sort of ignores what people really want from Horde/Alliance nowadays.

One thought I just had a on Stormwind revamp to make it slightly more realistic but since they share a majority of the same assests a hypothetical Strat megadungeon would double up on a SW revamp outside of a handful of unique buidlings. We don't even know that Strat is on the table for Midnight but its interesting to ponder at least.

I don't see us going back to Outland or Draenor anytime soon. I mean, Outland was already revamped as Draenor, in a way, and it has been implied that both Outland and Draenor are dying out. Maybe as patch content and I find that possibility unlikely.

Blizzard seems more focused on giving us breadcrumbs of potentially two new continents on Azeroth, plus whatever old zones they want to revamp. I guess that Midnight and TLT will be a kind of ''test'' to see if they can keep making new expansions based on old content. I bet that Midnight and TLT will be VERY succesful. Not necessarily because they are revamps but because Midnight brings Housing and TLT will be the end of the WSS. So I guess that Blizzard will indeed keep revamping old zones as new expansions, and I love it.

Nevertheless, I think that they will be introducing new lands from time to time. After Midnight and TLT (two expansions of revamps), I am pretty sure that we will visit a new continent. Probably the Arathi Empire lands, whether if they are in Avaloren or in another place. It will also make sense that after we defeat the Void and the Titans, the Light will feel empowered and try to take over, but we will see... The Legion will also be in a decent shape by then, especially if Sargeras survives TLT, but I believe that they will come back later.

I don't disagree at all. I think returning to Outland would be incredibly unlikely (but cool). I just don't see where they could possible fit it in during the WSS when its already jammed full. Also nothing saying they had to stay on Outland. They could of fled to a entirely new world as well.

I think we were more discussing the hypothetical of a group surviving from Draenor. Advancing and not being just ragtag refugees. Just like how the Arathi were introduced in TWW despite no signs of us going to Avaloren soon. I think its possible we could simply be introduced to this concept maybe while dealing with K'aresh.

[Cheezits]

One thought I just had a on Stormwind revamp to make it slightly more realistic but since they share a majority of the same assests a hypothetical Strat megadungeon would double up on a SW revamp outside of a handful of unique buidlings. We don't even know that Strat is on the table for Midnight but its interesting to ponder at least.

There are so many updated yet unused human assets in the files that it makes me think there has to be some extent of human representation in the next few years, be it Stormwind, Lordaeron being a part of Midnight's zone contents, or both. There's a possibility that it's for Borean Tundra in TLT but...

I do think Stratholme and Deatholme have a major chance to be a part of Midnight to touch on the scourge themes and give Calia and the Forsaken something to do, it would also be an easy way to add new themes to the expansion to diversify it beyond Troll, Elf and Void.

Troll, Elf, Forsaken and Void (Ethereals?) would fit the four launch renown idea as well.

[milkmustache]

There are so many updated yet unused human assets in the files that it makes me think there has to be some extent of human representation in the next few years, be it Stormwind, Lordaeron being a part of Midnight's zone contents, or both. There's a possibility that it's for Borean Tundra in TLT but...

I want to agree with you, but seeing there's also a similar amount of unused orc assets, I'm inclined to believe they're for the housing system.

[Cheezits]

I want to agree with you, but seeing there's also a similar amount of unused orc assets, I'm inclined to believe they're for the housing system.

The orc assets are more general structures and fences/stairs while the human assets are 1:1 with existing world props: there is an HD barn, inn, and watchtower model. They could technically be furniture items you can place outdoors but they feel more like things that will be used in the world.

[Worldshaper]

Huh. Hearthstone dropped this. Tortollan... Titan... something... city right inside the Un'goro crater. Commence tinfoil mode!

[Joshuaj]

Huh. Hearthstone dropped this. Tortollan... Titan... something... city right inside the Un'goro crater. Commence tinfoil mode!

What's there to speculate? It's a Titan city in Hearthstone. Nothing shocking about that.

At best, you can maybe make comments on the pillars looking like they're empowered by Azerite, or the hexagonal pattern of the city, but that's it.

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The orc assets are more general structures and fences/stairs while the human assets are 1:1 with existing world props: there is an HD barn, inn, and watchtower model. They could technically be furniture items you can place outdoors but they feel more like things that will be used in the world.

Are you suggesting they MIGHT be revamping the starting zones of WoW? Assuming they aren't doing a full world revamp right off the bat of course?

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I don't see us going back to Outland or Draenor anytime soon. I mean, Outland was already revamped as Draenor, in a way, and it has been implied that both Outland and Draenor are dying out. Maybe as patch content and I find that possibility unlikely.

Blizzard seems more focused on giving us breadcrumbs of potentially two new continents on Azeroth, plus whatever old zones they want to revamp. I guess that Midnight and TLT will be a kind of ''test'' to see if they can keep making new expansions based on old content. I bet that Midnight and TLT will be VERY succesful. Not necessarily because they are revamps but because Midnight brings Housing and TLT will be the end of the WSS. So I guess that Blizzard will indeed keep revamping old zones as new expansions, and I love it.

Nevertheless, I think that they will be introducing new lands from time to time. After Midnight and TLT (two expansions of revamps), I am pretty sure that we will visit a new continent. Probably the Arathi Empire lands, whether if they are in Avaloren or in another place. It will also make sense that after we defeat the Void and the Titans, the Light will feel empowered and try to take over, but we will see... The Legion will also be in a decent shape by then, especially if Sargeras survives TLT, but I believe that they will come back later.

"Outland was already revamped as Draenor in a way"

That's not at all connected, and you know it.

[Cheezits]

Are you suggesting they MIGHT be revamping the starting zones of WoW? Assuming they aren't doing a full world revamp right off the bat of course?

I think a revamp of Stormwind and Orgrimmar, and some areas surrounding them to match the new housing zones, may be happening versus a whole world revamp or full revamp of all the starting zones. Maybe a new NPE that covers all the races that live nearby those areas, though I don't like that idea and would much prefer racial starting zones to come back.

[Darkarath]

"Outland was already revamped as Draenor in a way"

That's not at all connected, and you know it.

Draenor and Outland are not connected? I won't even bother.

Sure, encourage Blizzard to do a third version of the same continent.

[Worldshaper]

What's there to speculate? It's a Titan city in Hearthstone. Nothing shocking about that.

At best, you can maybe make comments on the pillars looking like they're empowered by Azerite, or the hexagonal pattern of the city, but that's it.

People speculate about Amitus all the time.

And Gadgetzan the way it looks in HS.

And and Y'shaarj before he was in WoW.

And the Ancient One.

The idea of a city suddenly existing within Un'goro Crater is tantalising, and why it looks the way it does.

[Joshuaj]

Draenor and Outland are not connected? I won't even bother.

Sure, encourage Blizzard to do a third version of the same continent.

It's an AU version of what Outland used to look like. That's it.

Goregrond doesn't look like Blades Edge, there is no Netherstorm on Draenor, SMV is a forest on Draenor compared to Outland, and don't get me started on Tanaan Jungle.

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People speculate about Amitus all the time.

And Gadgetzan the way it looks in HS.

And and Y'shaarj before he was in WoW.

And the Ancient One.

The idea of a city suddenly existing within Un'goro Crater is tantalising, and why it looks the way it does.

Cause Amitus is a Hearthstone original that may or may not be in the Canon eventually, Gadgetzen is SUPPOSED to look like it's Hearthstone counterpart in the canon, Y'Shaarj's design was shown in HS the same way N'Zoth's was (which is cool imo), and the Ancient One is a unique entity that may or may not be in the canon.

We knew the Titans had a whole Manifold plan going on in the canon. I just don't see what's so fascinating about this city in particular. Though, I'd love to see what your thoughts are on it.

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Seriously. I'm intrigued.

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I think a revamp of Stormwind and Orgrimmar, and some areas surrounding them to match the new housing zones, may be happening versus a whole world revamp or full revamp of all the starting zones. Maybe a new NPE that covers all the races that live nearby those areas, though I don't like that idea and would much prefer racial starting zones to come back.

City revamps to make them look bigger and cooler,
starting with SW and Orgrimmar (namely to match revamped Silvermoon)? Yes please.