The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Auxis]

Argus was probably the biggest cinematic when it comes to impact but e.g. Eternal Palace ending moved the plot so much as well. Meanwhile in TWW we have two raids in a row that feel like complete diversions, we are helping people instead of focusing on the actual plot and the raid itself doesn't advance the plot in any way. It's the definition of filler. With DF out of the three raids, two of them were central to the plot (and while Aberrus was filler, the plot did move in the Megadungeon).

I think the issue is more that TWW's plot is just half-baked. The zones and the stories are solid but the main quest is a mess.

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Oh damn, sorry. But yeah, you have done the prequests I assume? And we saw there how Gallywix is working with the Black Blood.

All good bro.
But yeah, did the ones with Orweyna and Gazlowe and discovered the Black Blood "oil" was driving the machines haywire. Haven't read into anything in 11.1 beyond the promo vids that the WoW social team have been pumping out on YT shorts and some bigger patch showcases.

[Lady Atia]

Argus was probably the biggest cinematic when it comes to impact but e.g. Eternal Palace ending moved the plot so much as well. Meanwhile in TWW we have two raids in a row that feel like complete diversions, we are helping people instead of focusing on the actual plot and the raid itself doesn't advance the plot in any way. It's the definition of filler. With DF out of the three raids, two of them were central to the plot (and while Aberrus was filler, the plot did move in the Megadungeon).

I think the issue is more that TWW's plot is just half-baked. The zones and the stories are solid but the main quest is a mess.

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Oh damn, sorry. But yeah, you have done the prequests I assume? And we saw there how Gallywix is working with the Black Blood.

I wouldn't call "helping people" the definition of filler lol. It's our job as Champions of Azeroth to help people ffs.

[alex wolf]

I have a feeling major cut scenes will be connected to the story mode boss kill quest rather than killing a boss in raid directly in the future but I could be wrong about that

[Dracullus]

Argus was probably the biggest cinematic when it comes to impact but e.g. Eternal Palace ending moved the plot so much as well. Meanwhile in TWW we have two raids in a row that feel like complete diversions, we are helping people instead of focusing on the actual plot and the raid itself doesn't advance the plot in any way. It's the definition of filler. With DF out of the three raids, two of them were central to the plot (and while Aberrus was filler, the plot did move in the Megadungeon).

I think the issue is more that TWW's plot is just half-baked. The zones and the stories are solid but the main quest is a mess.

Campaign was great and it was praised on launch, which is pretty uncommon thing in wow community. But raid is really detached from whole thing, we just come here, kill Ansurek and then story culminates in Hallowfall. Feels like raid should end with Khadgar return and we got it in questline, similar thing to true DF S2 ending coming in dungeon instead raid.

[Hugnomo]

I mean, Amirdrassil ended with a whole new set of empowered aspects, it just wasn't as visually impressive as a new planet in the sky or the destruction of a zone.

Also haveing some world shattering event happen at the end of every raid sets us up for another spiralling out of control in terms of scale. It's fine if a raid or two just ends with a current threat being defeated.
The end of TWW has a high chance to have something big happening, if Midnight is the start of a major Void incursion on Azeroth.

I understand this concern. But personally, I don't think we'd need world shattering events every time. BUT, because of the way WoW delivers story, the pacing of releases, it lends itself to have patches climax in a cinematic that has some sort of reveal or cliffhanger that somewhat advances the plot and leaves open questions for speculation and anticipation for the next patch or expansion, regardless of scale.
As much as I love cinematics, the ones where the bad guy just gets defeated seem ... superfluous, redundant. If a cinematic isn't meaningful, it seems like a waste of resources to me, and something that exists just for the sake of having a cinematic for every raid completion. I still want a cinematic every raid, but I wish they'd structure the story episodicaly so that every patch leaves us with a hook for the next piece of content (while mostly resolving the current story).

[Jaggler]

I understand this concern. But personally, I don't think we'd need world shattering events every time. BUT, because of the way WoW delivers story, the pacing of releases, it lends itself to have patches climax in a cinematic that has some sort of reveal or cliffhanger that somewhat advances the plot and leaves open questions for speculation and anticipation for the next patch or expansion, regardless of scale.
As much as I love cinematics, the ones where the bad guy just gets defeated seem ... superfluous, redundant. If a cinematic isn't meaningful, it seems like a waste of resources to me, and something that exists just for the sake of having a cinematic for every raid completion. I still want a cinematic every raid, but I wish they'd structure the story episodicaly so that every patch leaves us with a hook for the next piece of content (while mostly resolving the current story).

But that's already what they do?
In DF and TWW so far every patch had a hook, a cloffhanger which leads into the next story beat.

[Sondrelk]

I have a feeling major cut scenes will be connected to the story mode boss kill quest rather than killing a boss in raid directly in the future but I could be wrong about that

Probably better for the story as well honestly. The raid opens the second week of the patch, so if we immediately get the big cliffhanger at that point we can only really twiddle our thumbs as the rest of the patch trundles along without much of a point.
Stuff like Argus appearing at the end of the Tomb raid made much more sense back in Legion as the raids opened with the minor patches, rather than the major ones like they do now. So by the time we saw Argus appear we were already halfway to the next major patch.
And from that perspective nothing has really changed. We still get the big cinematic at the end of the major patch narrative, leading into the next major patch. The only difference is that the story continues AFTER the raid, rather than concluding with it like it did in Legion and BfA.

[Lahis]

https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...s_coming_soon/
Blizzcon 2025?

"There will be no Blizzcon in year 202X."

They'll repeat this for few years untill people learn that there indeed will not be a Blizzcon anymore.

[Hugnomo]

But that's already what they do?
In DF and TWW so far every patch had a hook, a cloffhanger which leads into the next story beat.

Did it? Ansurek's cinematic was nothing more than her defeat. All the elements in the cinematic were already established. There were no twist to her defeat, Xalatath being the bigger villain wasn't new information either. The cinematic didn't add anything that wasn't already comunicated previously. Same goes for Aberrus. At least Fyrakk's had the development of the aspects regaining their powers from Azeroth herself, while also leaving a lot to speculate about with regards as to whether Azeroth is or isn't a Titan, I'd just argue it was visually and narratively not as gratifying as one would hope. Raszageth's also got us the release of her siblings which was good.

But comparing Ansurek's or Sarkareth's to the reveal of Argus, and what that meant for the story going forward .... it's worlds apart (pun intended :P).

[Nymrohd]

Probably better for the story as well honestly. The raid opens the second week of the patch, so if we immediately get the big cliffhanger at that point we can only really twiddle our thumbs as the rest of the patch trundles along without much of a point.
Stuff like Argus appearing at the end of the Tomb raid made much more sense back in Legion as the raids opened with the minor patches, rather than the major ones like they do now. So by the time we saw Argus appear we were already halfway to the next major patch.
And from that perspective nothing has really changed. We still get the big cinematic at the end of the major patch narrative, leading into the next major patch. The only difference is that the story continues AFTER the raid, rather than concluding with it like it did in Legion and BfA.

Can I say, I love how Legion did that and I wish they had kept on with it. It better integrated the raid into the story because there was actual build up to it. People will easily clear the raid on the lower difficulties way before they've actually seen the full zone story now.

[Jaggler]

Did it? Ansurek's cinematic was nothing more than her defeat. All the elements in the cinematic were already established. There were no twist to her defeat, Xalatath being the bigger villain wasn't new information either. The cinematic didn't add anything that wasn't already comunicated previously. Same goes for Aberrus. At least Fyrakk's had the development of the aspects regaining their powers from Azeroth herself, while also leaving a lot to speculate about with regards as to whether Azeroth is or isn't a Titan, I'd just argue it was visually and narratively not as gratifying as one would hope. Raszageth's also got us the release of her siblings which was good.

But comparing Ansurek's or Sarkareth's to the reveal of Argus, and what that meant for the story going forward .... it's worlds apart (pun intended :P).

Not in the raid itself, but the max-level-campaign and the content of the smaller content-patches. Sometimes the raid lends itself to be "deliverer" of the hook for the next content, sometimes it doesn't. And that's fine.

[Hugnomo]

Not in the raid itself, but the max-level-campaign and the content of the smaller content-patches. Sometimes the raid lends itself to be "deliverer" of the hook for the next content, sometimes it doesn't. And that's fine.

I respect your point of view! I personaly disagree, but I understand it's a question of preference. I think that, because WoW's story has such large gaps of time between story drops, it'd benefit from creating exciting moments, in its most exciting format (cinematics), with enough staying power to hold people over till the next piece of content. But if you are totally satisfied with the way things work right now, that's great (genuinely) !

[Jaggler]

I respect your point of view! I personaly disagree, but I understand it's a question of preference. I think that, because WoW's story has such large gaps of time between story drops, it'd benefit from creating exciting moments, in its most exciting format (cinematics), with enough staying power to hold people over till the next piece of content. But if you are totally satisfied with the way things work right now, that's great (genuinely) !

Yeah, i see value in both approaches. Yours is probably more "risky" because if the cinematic falls flat, then you basically grind to a halt for half a year, while if you gradually evolve the story it's more safe albeit more gradual and less bombastic i guess.
It's a matter of opinion i guess.

[Sondrelk]

Can I say, I love how Legion did that and I wish they had kept on with it. It better integrated the raid into the story because there was actual build up to it. People will easily clear the raid on the lower difficulties way before they've actually seen the full zone story now.

Definitely agree. It was definitely harder to accept at the beginning of the expansion. But once you got past that the content cadence was much better.
It was easier to have buildup to the raid. And with a new major zone and a new raid both being major features, it felt more natural to have them staggered, rather than both showing up at the same time, which led to more burnout.

Still, I guess I can see why they stopped doing it. Players were definitely not happy having to wait for months after Argus was current content to start actually raiding Antorus.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Vrykul and Ogre allied races for TLT or bust. Call it the "ancestor pack" or some shit.

[Joshuaj]

If there weren't "packs" for the past allied races, why tf would there be one now?

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Ik you don't mean literal DLC or shop packs. My point is that there has never been an Allied Race reveal with a named theme.

[Enteroctopus Magnificus]

Vrykul and Ogre allied races for TLT or bust. Call it the "ancestor pack" or some shit.

Vrykul tinker for TLT or nothing.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

If there weren't "packs" for the past allied races, why tf would there be one now?

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Ik you don't mean literal DLC or shop packs. My point is that there has never been an Allied Race reveal with a named theme.

You are looking way too hard to find a problem with something.

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Vrykul tinker for TLT or nothing.

Do not wish that evil upon us!

[Alanar]

Vrykul and Ogre allied races for TLT or bust. Call it the "ancestor pack" or some shit.

"I'l eat your heart out"!

I sign to this in a heartbeat. All my character or most of them would be Vrykul. And "no" Kul tiran aint fucking it, never was, never will be.

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Vrykul tinker for TLT or nothing.

Such shit combination lol.

[Cheezits]

I think TLT will actually be pretty feature light versus whatever comes after. Midnight will be big and so will the next saga intro that looks likes it may be Kalimdor focused.

Class halls and Vrykul I can see but nothing crazy.