The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Mojo03]

....Orcs have hardly been super relevant along with Humans. What game are you even playing

They had large parts in BC, Cata, MoP, and especially WOD.

That 4 year period of MoP and WOD was like orcs in the spotlight through the whole expansions, while Cata just before had Thrall front and center the whole time.

Honestly, what are you even talking about

[Dancaris]

I sincerely hope next xpac is not an Orc heavy expansion tbh. I am still burnt out from so many xpacs of Orcs and I just don't find them interesting at all anymore.

I don't mind Orcs being involved to some extent, like Thrall for example, just don't make them the main focus again.

Like one, yes?

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They had large parts in BC, Cata, MoP, and especially WOD.

That 4 year period of MoP and WOD was like orcs in the spotlight through the whole expansions, while Cata just before had Thrall front and center the whole time.

Honestly, what are you even talking about

What? In MoP orcs was in last raid and thats all. WoD yes, but draenei had big presence too. And orges, and arrakoa.
Cata? what? where? Aside total human dominance, there is no where near close. And BC was all about Illidan and BE, not about some minor orcs that you kill in questing.

[Mojo03]

Like one, yes?

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What? In MoP orcs was in last raid and thats all. WoD yes, but draenei had big presence too. And orges, and arrakoa.
Cata? what? where? Aside total human dominance, there is no where near close. And BC was all about Illidan and BE, not about some minor orcs that you kill in questing.

HUH

BC - 2 entire zones, 3 dungeons
Cata - 1 zone, 1 dungeon, and thrall front and center
MoP - Main plot was garrosh and horde, culminating in an orc raid
WoD - Do I really need to say it

[Scyth]

Last I recall, orcs haven't been obtrusively relevant since Warlords of Draenor; Saurfang was a prominent character in BfA, but shared the spotlight with a number of night elf and forsaken characters. With Shadowlands and Dragonflight not being exceptionally orc-heavy, I'd say more orcs is plenty fine.

Personally, I'd like to see the more malevolent Mag'har contrasted with the more peaceful orcs of Durotar. It'd be a nice way to resolve that schizophrenic characterization and allow the Horde to have the best of both worlds, orcwise.

Too many of the cinematics we got in BfA featured Saurfang, which wasn't to my liking.
Again, though, just my opinion. Odd as it may be I'm just not a fan of most Orcs in WoW lol

Getting off-topic so won't keep this up.

I'm looking forward to next week's patch and hoping we get some ingame cinematics. I guess it's confirmed we will be getting one from the mega dungeon?
Would love to get one that involves the Dream/Tree but too early perhaps.

[Dancaris]

HUH

BC - 2 entire zones, 3 dungeons
Cata - 1 zone, 1 dungeon, and thrall front and center
MoP - Main plot was garrosh and horde, culminating in an orc raid
WoD - Do I really need to say it

HUH 2.0
BC have like 16 dungeons and only 3 was about orcs. 2 zones - which ones? Hellfire and shadowmoon? Really?
And what zone in Cata you count? Twilight? Its pretty balanced with dwarves, i say. Thrall - agree, he was in 1 zone, was 1 quest chain, and final raid. Thats all? Where is your Tyrande fatigue, if you that selective?
MoP was about pandaren and mad Garrosh in 1.5 patches. Lei shen? Mantids? Yaungols? Sha? Nope, orcsorcsorcsorcsorcsorcs yes?
Its like complaining that in MoP 4/5zones was about pandaren. Its logical that Outland (orc homeworld) in BC (mostly about demons, blood elves and Illidan with his demons) have some orc presence, no? WoD fitts too. But we have also arrakoa in Arak, we have ogres in Talador and Nagrand. Whole draenei zones Talador and Shadowmoon. But you forgot it. And yes, mass killing enemy orcs have 0 value to Durotar orc place in story or characters representation.

And now where is yout troll fatigue, there is always some troll stuff in every expansion (apart DF, but it is not over yet). Where is your human fatigue? or NE and BE?

[Nymrohd]

Many of the major stories of TBC were orc centric. Hellfire Citadel, Nagrand with the Oshu'gun questline ending with Thrall and Garrosh, Shadowmoon Valley and the Cipher of Damnation.

The Cataclysm revamp also gave orcs new and extensive storylines. They got a much more powerful presence in Ashenvale, Stonetalon and Twilight Highlands. Thrall was front and center throughout the expansion; heck even the Firelands patch that was entirely about night elves still featured Thrall in the trailer for some reason instead of Malfurion and/or Hamuul who were the central characters of the storyline. That said, I think Thrall fatigue is entirely separate from Horde fatigue.

MoP had 5.1, 5.3 and 5.4 be all about Garrosh and the Horde with multiple orc characters.

WoD had 4 zones that were mostly about Orcs with a significant orc presence in Shadowmoon Valley.

I will add, as I said earlier that fatigue about Thrall is very different from orc presence fatigue. Thrall's story was often about Thrall himself and not about the orcs (in contrast with Garrosh whose story was deeply tied to his people). I'd say this is often the case with Anduin as well; he has multiple storylines that are very much about him and not the humans of Stormwind.

It also doesn't help that structures that are Horde and Alliance instead of a specific race use Orc and Human architecture instead of Blizzard coming with a more blended style that uses elements from multiple races. Sometimes Horde structures will use a Forsaken tower but that's it.

[Dracullus]

Jesus Christ and I thought we can finally have one rep truly account wide with Loam Niffen. Turns out, when you hit 20, you can buy Barter Boulders for resources on alts, but every single reward is still in Barter Bricks until you grind Renown 12 on every.single.alt.

It's getting really frustrating, especially when account wide reps were one of selling points of this expac. I don't get what's stoping them from going full in.

[Mojo03]

HUH 2.0
BC have like 16 dungeons and only 3 was about orcs. 2 zones - which ones? Hellfire and shadowmoon? Really?
And what zone in Cata you count? Twilight? Its pretty balanced with dwarves, i say. Thrall - agree, he was in 1 zone, was 1 quest chain, and final raid. Thats all? Where is your Tyrande fatigue, if you that selective?
MoP was about pandaren and mad Garrosh in 1.5 patches. Lei shen? Mantids? Yaungols? Sha? Nope, orcsorcsorcsorcsorcsorcs yes?
Its like complaining that in MoP 4/5zones was about pandaren. Its logical that Outland (orc homeworld) in BC (mostly about demons, blood elves and Illidan with his demons) have some orc presence, no? WoD fitts too. But we have also arrakoa in Arak, we have ogres in Talador and Nagrand. Whole draenei zones Talador and Shadowmoon. But you forgot it. And yes, mass killing enemy orcs have 0 value to Durotar orc place in story or characters representation.

And now where is yout troll fatigue, there is always some troll stuff in every expansion (apart DF, but it is not over yet). Where is your human fatigue? or NE and BE?

First off, I'm genuinely not even sure the point you're trying to make.

So maybe you could elaborate the point you're trying to make.

To me, it seems that you're saying, because they weren't the SOLE and only focus and there were other things going on in those expansions, that, that doesn't count as them being relevant to those expansions?

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Many of the major stories of TBC were orc centric. Hellfire Citadel, Nagrand with the Oshu'gun questline ending with Thrall and Garrosh, Shadowmoon Valley and the Cipher of Damnation.

The Cataclysm revamp also gave orcs new and extensive storylines. They got a much more powerful presence in Ashenvale, Stonetalon and Twilight Highlands. Thrall was front and center throughout the expansion; heck even the Firelands patch that was entirely about night elves still featured Thrall in the trailer for some reason instead of Malfurion and/or Hamuul who were the central characters of the storyline. That said, I think Thrall fatigue is entirely separate from Horde fatigue.

MoP had 5.1, 5.3 and 5.4 be all about Garrosh and the Horde with multiple orc characters.

WoD had 4 zones that were mostly about Orcs with a significant orc presence in Shadowmoon Valley.

Yup, exactly

[Santandame]

For a world revamp expansion, if the idea is to keep the zones & stories evergreen with the races overall primary zones having a cohesive villain for the narrative then I’d like to see something like this:

Alliance:

- Humans - Dark Riders of Karazhan/New Defias

- Dwarves - Rogue political faction of various Dwarf clans who oppose Dagran becoming King / Djaradin and Ragnaros Dark Iron fanatics banding together along with Fyrakk.

- Gnomes - see above but also remnants of King Mechagon’s forces

- Draenei - Over zealous Light fanatics who splinter off from main Draenei society after reformed Eredar/Manari are welcomed back into Draenei society

- Worgen - Ivar Bloodfangs pack begin to seek dominance over the Gilneans / Scourge remnants / Scarlets.

- Night Elves - A mish mash of Naga, Night Elf extremists who still want revenge against the Horde and the Primalists.

Horde:

Orcs - tensions with the Mag’har as well forces from Draenor that have moved over such as the Breakers, Botani and Saberon.

Tauren - Wratheye uniting the Gnoll clans, centaurs and quillboar. Effectively creating the mongrel horde and teaching them to harness decay magic. Also, Grimtotem tensions.

Trolls - similar to Orcs but could have Blood Trolls begin to invade an expanded Echo Isles and the coast of eastern Kalimdor.

Undead - Sylvanas loyalists, extremist Night Elves, Scarlets.

Blood Elves - Shadowguard Ethereals begin to invade Quel’Thalas seeking to corrupt the Sunwell. They also corrupt a group of Amani Trolls with avoid; whilst some Amani trolls defect and work together with the Blood Elves to beat back to the Void incursion.

I have nothing for the allied races, Dracthyr and Pandaren. Perhaps some racial questioned that send them back to their homelands every now and then for a campaign but no revamp to their areas as not really needed.

Overarching villains for the expansion in terms of filling out max level zones, raids and mega dungeons:

Nightsquall’s fleet invading zones such as Stranglethorn, Tanaris and coastline hubs such as Ratchet.

The Scarlets having a stranglehold on Lordaeron.

Night Elf extremists making their home in the Ruins of Darnassus.

[Lahis]

Thankfully this will never happen, because Blizzard stated that Infinite Dragonflight plotline is resolved in upcoming megadungeon.

Warcraft is a happy story, Warcraft is a cheerful story, Nozdormu was never going to succumb to his fate. He was always going to be saved eventually.

Infinite plotline is resolved by turning Nozdormu into Murozond. After that we know where, when and how he dies because we have already done it.

[Dancaris]

First off, I'm genuinely not even sure the point you're trying to make.

So maybe you could elaborate the point you're trying to make.

To me, it seems that you're saying, because they weren't the SOLE and only focus and there were other things going on in those expansions, that, that doesn't count as them being relevant to those expansions?

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Yup, exactly

I am trying to say that if once a while we have orcs in game - there should not be some prejustise about that. We have major presence of humans, NE and BE in every expansion, but there is 0 human/NE/BE fatigue, only orc one.
Yes, I agree that in some places presence of orcs was too much (WoD) but call it so many xpacs about orcs is wrong. I wish there will be more orc content, but not about killing evil orcs, but akin heritage armor quest chain.

[Nymrohd]

Honestly if the next expac is a world revamp, I would hope a lot of the zone storylines would very much be about Peacecraft. Imagine a Southern Barrens storyline in which the tauren are reconstructing Tauraho, using garrison tech. You obviously have combat elements in the storyline but it would be more about securing resources and slowly building the village back. Same thing could be available for so many different zones (from cities like Silvermoon and Undercity to large towns like Brill and Sentinel Hill). I know its Warcraft and that the RTS was all about creating bases for war; Warcraft was never Age of Empires and you'd never win by building a Wonder. But World of Warcraft could have storylines that work like that.

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And now where is yout troll fatigue, there is always some troll stuff in every expansion (apart DF, but it is not over yet). Where is your human fatigue? or NE and BE?

See here is the thing; humans are not used as a race that much. Rather a very small roster of human characters are used constantly. Jaina and Anduin fatigue are as fair a complaint as Thrall fatigue was. Their stories are not about the humans as a race like Garrosh' story affected the orc race. Most of their presence is entirely because they are the face of the Alliance to an overwhelming degree because of dev incompetence with the only non-human getting a constant presence being a worgen who is almost always in human form (Genn) and occasionally Tyrande/Malfurion. The Horde roster is more varied beyond just orcs.
Night Elves absolutely have gotten too much screen time; the issue of course is that they have yet to get a satisfying resolution for what happened to them which means there will constantly be demand for more Night Elf story until that resolution does happen (very likely in 10.2, possibly even in 10.1.7)

[Dancaris]

Honestly if the next expac is a world revamp, I would hope a lot of the zone storylines would very much be about Peacecraft. Imagine a Southern Barrens storyline in which the tauren are reconstructing Tauraho, using garrison tech. You obviously have combat elements in the storyline but it would be more about securing resources and slowly building the village back. Same thing could be available for so many different zones (from cities like Silvermoon and Undercity to large towns like Brill and Sentinel Hill). I know its Warcraft and that the RTS was all about creating bases for war; Warcraft was never Age of Empires and you'd never win by building a Wonder. But World of Warcraft could have storylines that work like that.

Remember old Barrens, where was some rituals of growing up for young hordies, Harpies, quillboars and centaurs? Why there must be BIGGER THREAT like EVIL DRAGONS OF VOID WITH SOME HEAD ISSUES? Remember wc3 founding of Durotar part 1? Just collect some mooshrooms for Drek'Thar, kill evil Harpy, clean water for quillboars and make fine beer for Chen. Perfect, if you ask me.

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See here is the thing; humans are not used as a race that much. Rather a very small roster of human characters are used constantly. Jaina and Anduin fatigue are as fair a complaint as Thrall fatigue was. Their stories are not about the humans as a race like Garrosh' story affected the orc race. Most of their presence is entirely because they are the face of the Alliance to an overwhelming degree because of dev incompetence with the only non-human getting a constant presence being a worgen who is almost always in human form (Genn) and occasionally Tyrande/Malfurion. The Horde roster is more varied beyond just orcs.
Night Elves absolutely have gotten too much screen time; the issue of course is that they have yet to get a satisfying resolution for what happened to them which means there will constantly be demand for more Night Elf story until that resolution does happen (very likely in 10.2, possibly even in 10.1.7)

Wish that be true. We dont need another 2-3 patches about NE. Let them plant a tree in Darnassus place/revive it/empower Nordrasil and let them afk for 1-2 expansions, rebuilding and licking wounds. We need NE, but not Tyrande and Malfurion (heh) again.

[Hitei]

Infinite plotline is resolved by turning Nozdormu into Murozond. After that we know where, when and how he dies because we have already done it.

It doesn't resolve because he's an ageless time traveler so there's an infinite amount of space for events between those two points. Knowing when he turns and having killed him means nothing.

[Xilurm]

What would an Orc central expansion even be now? Light Orcs from AU Draenor? Otherwise it doesn't make sense.

[Dancaris]

What would an Orc central expansion even be now? Light Orcs from AU Draenor? Otherwise it doesn't make sense.

Why there will be Orc central expansion? Its Thrall, so its peace expansion with one and only orc character that have HD model and not dead.

[Makabreska]

I just hope that next expansion stays in a more traditional fantasy region, and not go cosmic/interdimensional. Current setting does wonders for the general enjoyment coming from the game.

[Xilurm]

Why there will be Orc central expansion? Its Thrall, so its peace expansion with one and only orc character that have HD model and not dead.

I don't know. That's what I'm asking since people in the previous page seem to want an Orc expansion again.

[Nymrohd]

I just hope that next expansion stays in a more traditional fantasy region, and no go cosmic/interdimensional. Current setting does wonders for the general enjoyment coming from the game.

I wouldn't mind an expansion where the final patch takes place in a cosmic zone.

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I don't know. That's what I'm asking since people in the previous page seem to want an Orc expansion again.

A world revamp should be an orc expansion. And a human, elf, draenei, worgen, troll, tauren, dwarf, goblin, gnome and forsaken one.

[Varodoc]

Infinite plotline is resolved by turning Nozdormu into Murozond. After that we know where, when and how he dies because we have already done it.

Main Nozdormu will NEVER turn into Murozond because Warcraft is not some tragic 18+ dark story. Warcraft is cheerful story where good guys win. So Chromie will find a way to heal Nozdormu, save him from his fate, and as such she will NEVER be Aspect.

The entire point of that storyline is that fate isn't set in stone and Nozdormu can be saved. He will be saved and Chromie will never be in spotlight.

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Why there will be Orc central expansion? Its Thrall, so its peace expansion with one and only orc character that have HD model and not dead.

An expansion of "peace"? An expansion without conflict? Impossible, it will never happen. Expansions are driven by central world war and this will never change.