The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Joshuaj]

Alleria isn't just wielding the void, she consumes a void entity and takes its energy inside of her exactly how a demon hunter does to finish their training, she doesn't just mirror traits of demon hunters her progression into her void powers clearly mirrors Vandel's into becoming a full demon hunter

"Thereafter, Vandel constantly heard the whispered thoughts of the demon whose soul had been bound to his, tempting him not only to violence but to join the Legion" Alleria literally had a plot thread this expansion about how shes worried she's going to give into the whispers of the void at the climax of the level up campaign


Never mind the fact the only way to even kinda of look like Alleria in game is being a blood elf demon hunter with the purple tattoos, and also how void purple is the demon hunter class color, and one of the primary colors in their class color pallet for tier sets and their artifact weapons

Are Riftblades similar to Alleria in that sense? Or is it just Alleria who has the essence of a Void entity inside her? Also, the Demon Hunters are a bit different, as I'm unsure Alleria's tattoos exist to keep the Void energies within her in-check.

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the quote from her about being torn apart by her brothers convinced me she was an old god but of course they killed that...kinda

I think she called them brothers because they're likely both children of the Void Lords (more specifically Dimensius). I don't think the statement was meant to be taken literally.

[Hitei]

Alleria isn't just wielding the void, she consumes a void entity and takes its energy inside of her exactly how a demon hunter does to finish their training, she doesn't just mirror traits of demon hunters her progression into her void powers clearly mirrors Vandel's into becoming a full demon hunter

"Thereafter, Vandel constantly heard the whispered thoughts of the demon whose soul had been bound to his, tempting him not only to violence but to join the Legion" Alleria literally had a plot thread this expansion about how shes worried she's going to give into the whispers of the void at the climax of the level up campaign

But it isn't "exactly how a demon hunter does". A demon hunter harbors a demon's soul in themselves and then has to wrestle with it to not be consumed the rest of existence. Alleria just sucked all the void magic out of a fallen naaru, which is what all Blood Elves were doing to feed their magic addiction prior to the Sunwell's reignition. Is Liadrin also a demon hunter because she and every other blood knight were all also siphoning magic from a naaru? Is Xal'atath a demon hunter because she was capable of consuming the dying essence of things for power in Legion?

Alleria is closer to a bow-wielding shadow priest (who all also have to content with Void whispers threatening insanity) than she is a demon hunter.

Never mind the fact the only way to even kinda of look like Alleria in game is being a blood elf demon hunter with the purple tattoos, and also how void purple is the demon hunter class color, and one of the primary colors in their class color pallet for tier sets and their artifact weapons

This has nothing to do with the void. Purple is the demon hunter class color because there were already two other classes that used green and with the relatively small area afforded by font, the originally planned felfire green looked too close to hunters, especially when darkened by the out-of-range effect. Their class sets get purple versions because lots of demons (Pit Lords, Eredar, Dreadlords, Darkglares, Satyr, Succubi, Shivarra, etc.) are purple, so it matches the demonic aesthetic.

Alleria's defining characteristic is not "she has tattoos", and demon hunters having tattoos doesn't somehow make her any more of a demon hunter than wildhammer dwarves are.

[Polybius]

They should invest more into hero talents rather than making a new class. That means making them more dramatic, starting with reskinning more of your abilities. And Riftblade would definitely work better as a hero talent for warrior or maybe even paladin. The NPC Riftblades we see are wearing plate and wielding swords / shields.

As much as I'd like to see them fleshed out I doubt they'll continue to be built upon. Main reason is GCD delay/input that is plaguing some specs. Other issues include broken effects and glyphs due to interaction requirements, and how limited they are in building up the fantasy for some Hero specs.

Slightly OT: For the next classes I hope they focus on what we already have for this Saga (Void, Titan Artifice, Radiant Song) with options for all races (not bound to a troll/elven lovechild).

[Wyrt]

As much as I'd like to see them fleshed out I doubt they'll continue to be built upon. Main reason is GCD delay/input that is plaguing some specs. Other issues include broken effects and glyphs due to interaction requirements, and how limited they are in building up the fantasy for some Hero specs.

Some are so vague it's impossible to actually care about the fantasy like Archon or Fatebound and then others are so incredibly specific it feels off to play with it as a different race like Sunfury or Sentinel.

Hero talents are overall a big miss for me. Even ones I enjoy like Stormbringer or Voidweaver could really just be boiled down to 1 talent choice and are just full of fluff otherwise. Tempest and Entropic Rift are the entire fantasy of those hero talents and could easily just be made into regular talents.

[Limayria]

As much as I'd like to see them fleshed out I doubt they'll continue to be built upon. Main reason is GCD delay/input that is plaguing some specs. Other issues include broken effects and glyphs due to interaction requirements, and how limited they are in building up the fantasy for some Hero specs.

Slightly OT: For the next classes I hope they focus on what we already have for this Saga (Void, Titan Artifice, Radiant Song) with options for all races (not bound to a troll/elven lovechild).

I would love a tinker or artifacer or bard open to every race

[Melorandor]

I will say this, after been playing since 2008, if I was in charge of WoW I would cut down the raid difficulties to just Story Mode(RF), Normal and Mythic and the recolors of the tier sets should be unlocked by outdoor activities/quests/achievements. I am thinking like the recolor of the Night Elf heritage set, but say, you want what is the current Heroic tint of the Mage Undermine set, you could unlock by doing Skyriding races while having already acquired the original full appearance set.

[Merryck]

I want An'she to be characterized at least.

[Joshuaj]

Hmm...

Elune (Musha)

Belore (An'she).

Two sides of the same coin. Embodiments of the Light.

One watches over the Night, the other over the Day.

Beledar is Belore's way to protect the worldsoul.
Elun'ahir is Elune's way to protect the worldsoul.

Both have been taken advantage of by the Void.

In Midnight, both will work with us to return the Light to Azeroth.

Some of her favoured children are Night Elves, Haranir, Green Dragons, Dryads, and Wild Gods.

Some of his favoured children are Tauren, High Elves who (left the night in favour of the sun), Trolls, etc.

She could take physical form in the Well of Eternity.
He might in the Sunwell?

"She could take physical form in the Well of Eternity"

Was this ever actually stated btw? Or are we just making stuff up to fit a narrative?

Also, it's entirely possible Mu'sha is an entirely separate entity from Elune. I personally like to believe Mu'sha is a Naaru. Similar naming conventions, afterall.

[Joshuaj]

I interpreted it that way, anyhow. Chronicles Vol. 1 says she "slumbered within the fount's depths during daylight hours". In my view you need a physical form if you "slumber" in a physical place. But I suppose they also frequently describe the worldsoul as being asleep and dreaming, so maybe I am reading too much into it.

Beyond that, the Tauren legend about the Earth Mother says both An'she and Musha walked Azeroth when the Earth Mother had plucked them from her eyes, and before they took to the heavens to watch over the world.

Mu'sha can be separate but I'm not sure why we would assume so.

Because I see nothing that implies Mu'sha and Elune are the same outside of "Oh, they're both Moon-based entities".

Cause unless that's just the Tauren's way of naming Elune, then their faith is wrong, no? As Mu'sha is NOT Elune's official name? Heck, they wouldn't even be the favored children of their moon deity.

Also, wasn't what Chronicle 1 stated what the Night Elves believed? Seems like that belief changed in due time, as I don't see the Night Elves making mention of it today.

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It's entirely possible Elune communed with the Elves through the Well of Eternity, but that's it. Dunno how she would have easier physical access to Azeroth, when Sargeras himself needed a fuck ton of help just to A. Establish a connection there. And B. Bring a small physical avatar there.

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I'm imagining something like this.

Lord of Fire and Stone.
Gifter of A'lar.
The Dawnbringer.
Patron of the Midsummer Fire Festival.
Bearer of the Eternal Fire.
The Radiant.
The Eternal Sun.
Brother of Elune.
Belore, Watcher of Quel'thalas.
Right eye of the Earth Mother.

Wields dual blades in battle. Once gave Dath'Remar Sunstrider a vision that led him to forging Felo'melorn, a similar blade.

Was once gravely injured in battle with the Old Gods, but survived thanks to his sister and was ultimately able to push the Shadow back.

Sent the Beledar to watch over the worldsoul and fend off the Old Gods and their minions. Helped bless the Sunwell and called the most worthy among the Arathi to Hallowfall.

Taught the Tauren and Trolls to hunt and to wield the Light.

Along with Elune, will clash against Dimensius in the skies during the final cinematic of Midnight.

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As for the sentient primordial races of Azeroth, they closely align with An'she (Belore) or Musha (Elune) a bit more

Elune

Haranir
Night Elves / Nightborne / Etc.

Belore

High Elves
Tauren
Trolls

Titans

Dragons
Humans
Dwarves
Gnomes
Etc.

Non-native

Orcs
Ogres

Unknown

Goblins

You're getting the name "Belore" based off the Thalassian term for "the Sun", correct? Cause that is interesting ngl.

IF Belore is an entity akin to Elune, would it be Light based? Or would it be Life based? Cause I feel like if you have a Lunar based Life deity, you'd also need a Solar based Life deity as well, no?

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Sorry, I just don't like the idea of Elune being a Light deity. I do NOT want Blizzard to retcon lore from their past expansions whilst giving a middle finger to the Night Elves.

Why would it be giving a middle finger to them? Cause it implies Velen was probably closer to getting Elune right than Tyrande. Yes, Velen assumed Elune was a Naaru, but he still associated her with Light. Meanwhile, Tyrande and the Night Elves associate Elune with Life.

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I don't want Velen to be more right than the Night Elves.

[Monkal]

We've been told by Primus in Shadowlands that Elune ia from the Pantheon of Life, so no Light there.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

We've been told by Primus in Shadowlands that Elune ia from the Pantheon of Life, so no Light there.

There’s a decent chance that just gets retconned now that Metzens back as Elune was consistently light themed until he left.

[Scyth]

I’m starting to worry we might end TWW without finding out anything about the Beledar or it ever doing anything of significance. Thought 11.1.7 will include it somehow but nothing points to it thus far.

[johnnyd2]

It is possible that they are literally treating the entire trilogy as one expansion now.

If I were a developer at Blizzard, this would probably make a lot of sense to me. More time to build (stories and content). Hopefully a greater pay-off for the audience once it gets there.

But as a player I feel a little concerned that TWW has been effectively canned as a result. It doesn't feel like we're playing the expansion that the cinematic with the sword in Silithus teased.

same mood here
i hope Midnight gets the loreball rolling again .

[Joshuaj]

Nothing is ever set in stone with Blizzard. They frequently change key facts about the lore between expansions. Especially with an expansion like Shadowlands, which was under somebody else's creative direction (not Metzen) and was universally hated.

Sure, nothing is fully set in stone so long as the lore itself is left ambiguous. If something is talked about, and on a consistent level, Blizzard usually tries to stay consistent with it.

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Otherwise, Warcraft would not be the way it currently is.

[huth]

It is possible that they are literally treating the entire trilogy as one expansion now.

From a story perspective, that's kinda the point of a trilogy.

Technically, they're still seperate expansions of course.

[Joshuaj]

There’s a decent chance that just gets retconned now that Metzens back as Elune was consistently light themed until he left.

Elune was consistently a lot of things to keep her mysterious. But even when Metzen was working with Blizzard on Legion, the Tears of Elune, Ysera's death, Elune's theme in Classic, Cenarius, etc screamed "Life entity" regarding Elune.

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Or are we just cherry picking stuff to ignore?

[Joshuaj]

I'm thinking of the Hero's Journey and Star Wars Episode 4 - 6.

I suppose Anduin is our Luke, Faerin Lothar was his Obi-wan, the Dark Heart pre-repairs was the Death Star, and Xal'atath is Darth Vader.

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Nah, it was definitely mostly Light around that era. With Khadgar speculating that she might be a naaru, the Tears being able to unlock Light's Heart, etc.

I mean, it's still confirmed Elune and Xe'ra have a possible light connection. This just means Elune has worked with other powers before, which is true, as we know she worked with the Titans, specifically Eonar.

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Also, funny how the ones that speculate Elune is a light entity are ones that aren't Elune's Chosen...

Like, literally, why should I take Velen and Khadgar's assumptions over the Winter Queen's word, the Primus' word, what we saw in the actual story, and Tyrande (who is Elune's champion essentially)?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Elune was consistently a lot of things to keep her mysterious. But even when Metzen was working with Blizzard on Legion, the Tears of Elune, Ysera's death, Elune's theme in Classic, Cenarius, etc screamed "Life entity" regarding Elune.

Prior to SL Elune was really only ever light and arcane (star) based.

Tear of Elune was light aligned.

Ysera turned into stars.

Cenarius is half wild god which is where his animal bits and nature ties come from while the elf bits come from The supposed elf looking star based Elune.

Even in general night elf society Druids make next to no mention of Elune while the light/star based priestess of the moon are all about her.

[Dracullus]

I’m starting to worry we might end TWW without finding out anything about the Beledar or it ever doing anything of significance. Thought 11.1.7 will include it somehow but nothing points to it thus far.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/the-cor...poilers-347720

"Then began construction of the Coreway, a direct channel to the heart of Azeroth, that would allow the titans to study the Worldsoul without harming it."

"However, as we delved deeper, we encountered certain obstacles--colossal crystals which we came to realize were calcified chunks of the Worldsoul's essence."

We have all the answers. It's chunk of world soul, and we should encounter more when we go to Worldcore through Coreway.

[Joshuaj]

Prior to SL Elune was really only ever light and arcane (star) based.

Tear of Elune was light aligned.

Ysera turned into stars.

Cenarius is half wild god which is where his animal bits and nature ties come from while the elf bits come from The supposed elf looking star based Elune.

Even in general night elf society Druids make next to no mention of Elune while the light/star based priestess of the moon are all about her.

The Tears of Elune had light connections, yes. But I'd also argue it's nature based, as Aegwynn mentioned the Tears represented the dream of what Azeroth could be. And considering Elune's supposed connections to the Dream, that's saying something.

Ysera turned to a constellation, yes. But reminder that the Titans can become constellations as well. Are they light entities as a result? No? Okay then lol. Being related to the stars doesn't automatically make you a light entity. As I've said before, Elune can represent the lunar and astral aspects of Life.

Also, SLIGHTLY fair regarding the Priestesses of Elune, but counterpoint: I don't think the Night Elves would be nearly as feral or as nature themed as they are if Elune was a Light entity.

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https://www.wowhead.com/news/the-cor...poilers-347720

"Then began construction of the Coreway, a direct channel to the heart of Azeroth, that would allow the titans to study the Worldsoul without harming it."

"However, as we delved deeper, we encountered certain obstacles--colossal crystals which we came to realize were calcified chunks of the Worldsoul's essence."

We have all the answers. It's chunk of world soul, and we should encounter more when we go to Worldcore through Coreway.

How would one explain the Light and Shadow cycle it goes through then? I don't think I've seen anything related to Azeroth thus-far that implied it made crystals which can go through a Naaru-esc cycle.