The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Cheezits]

There was in fact a world tree in Ghostlands, I forget the name but it has been discussed here as a way to get Nelves involved in Midnight.

[Holdodlig]

I mean, the geographic proximity of Amirdrassi should be enough to involve Night elves.

[genegerbread]

I mean, the geographic proximity of Amirdrassi should be enough to involve Night elves.

True! Might be a good opportunity to make Bel'ameth an actual fleshed out settlement, rather than "here be a few houses and hidden transmogs."

[Sondrelk]

They are World Tree saplings, not World Trees.

So, world trees. Just not very big ones.

That is what saplings mean after all. Trees that have not fully grown.

[leothar]

No 11.2 news this week methinks. With the story post today it doesn't make sense. But maybe housing update? The cope is strong right now.

Yeah probably next week for 11.2 stuff. Sadge.

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True! Might be a good opportunity to make Bel'ameth an actual fleshed out settlement, rather than "here be a few houses and hidden transmogs."

I think Bel'ameth is 100% going to be a player housing hub. Maybe we get Bel'ameth and Silvermoon in 12.1 and you get a house in each.

[Jolly Roger]

i see rootlands as the same as "zereth vitae"
mentioned but not happening
especially since its a case of
karesh= connected to main story
rootlands= mentioned in missable storyline

[Foolicious]

There was in fact a world tree in Ghostlands, I forget the name but it has been discussed here as a way to get Nelves involved in Midnight.

Not a confirmed world tree, or was it? As far as we know just an old tree that absorbed lots of sunwell juice with the eversong forest. I guess they could easily say it was a worldtree or a sapling, but I personally think we've had enough new worldtrees recently. Especially since we haven't learned anything new about them.

[Dvalin]

There was in fact a world tree in Ghostlands, I forget the name but it has been discussed here as a way to get Nelves involved in Midnight.

Tha'salah. Which according to the RPG was chopped down by the Scourge and turned into the fortress of Deatholme.

[Worldshaper]

I don't think that it makes my argument "worse." I just can't comprehend why people are obsessed over these dates. Moreover, I can't understand YOUR obsession with telling people that you're right and they can all kick sand. At the end of the day, who cares what day 11.2 gets revealed (this week, next week after patch, or the week after)? It's a video game!

TLDR; We are all anxiously waiting for the 11.2 news because we are excited. It would be nice to focus back on the LORE/Speculation rather than arbitrary dates which are just nitpicking and an extension of stroking one's own ego.

You made an argument and I made a counterargument. Not sure I see this as stroking my ego.

It's fine if dates matter little to you, but you do not represent everyone. To me, dates are fun.

[Viridiel]

The curse in the short story is very interesting. It sounds like the Emerald Nightmare or the worgen curse, but it had to have happened a thousand years before either of those things make much sense for the area. The Emerald Nightmare is kind of the opposite of the Sacred Flame, being a combination of Fel and Void magic corrupting Life. Could it be Xavius' first attempt at spreading the Nightmare? Another mage accidentally releasing the worgen curse before Arugal? Some sort of activation of the Curse of Flesh? It could even be related to the Drust -- Kul Tiras was right next to the Arathi Highlands before the Cataclysm.

But the Scion is the most interesting thing. Her title and appearance reminds me of a constellar, but the shifting appearance thing is totally new. She also reminds me of Aegwynn's role in the Tomb of Sargeras, although she likely lived at least a thousand years after the story takes place. The temple must be vrykul or some other kind of titanforged to make sense for the time period, and we already know that there used to be a thriving vrykul civilisation on the continent, so I think a forgotten vrykul temple makes the most sense. As for the location, "where the heart of the world and the eye of heaven met" reminds me of the myth of Elune sleeping in the Well of Eternity, but also sounds like a fanciful description of the West -- where the Sun falls beneath the earth. I think it's probably in Tirisfal Glades, which should by all rights be covered in vrykul and human ruins and is where the Silver Hand comes from.

It really feels like this is setting up the continuation of Tyr's story and will be related to the "forces of Light" we fight alongside in Midnight. It's also definitely foreshadowing something for Faerin. Will she sacrifice herself to use the ember of the First Flame inside her to rekindle the snuffed Sunwell? Or maybe the Sunwell will be fixed some other way, and she'll bathe in it and undergo the same transformation as Craishae.

At any rate, I'm definitely feeling a lot more confident about the idea that Midnight will explore the rest of the continent of Lordaeron.

[Worldshaper]

The curse in the short story is very interesting. It sounds like the Emerald Nightmare or the worgen curse, but it had to have happened a thousand years before either of those things make much sense for the area. The Emerald Nightmare is kind of the opposite of the Sacred Flame, being a combination of Fel and Void magic corrupting Life. Could it be Xavius' first attempt at spreading the Nightmare? Another mage accidentally releasing the worgen curse before Arugal? Some sort of activation of the Curse of Flesh? It could even be related to the Drust -- Kul Tiras was right next to the Arathi Highlands before the Cataclysm.

But the Scion is the most interesting thing. Her title and appearance reminds me of a constellar, but the shifting appearance thing is totally new. She also reminds me of Aegwynn's role in the Tomb of Sargeras, although she likely lived at least a thousand years after the story takes place. The temple must be vrykul or some other kind of titanforged to make sense for the time period, and we already know that there used to be a thriving vrykul civilisation on the continent, so I think a forgotten vrykul temple makes the most sense. As for the location, "where the heart of the world and the eye of heaven met" reminds me of the myth of Elune sleeping in the Well of Eternity, but also sounds like a fanciful description of the West -- where the Sun falls beneath the earth. I think it's probably in Tirisfal Glades, which should by all rights be covered in vrykul and human ruins and is where the Silver Hand comes from.

It really feels like this is setting up the continuation of Tyr's story and will be related to the "forces of Light" we fight alongside in Midnight. It's also definitely foreshadowing something for Faerin. Will she sacrifice herself to use the ember of the First Flame inside her to rekindle the snuffed Sunwell? Or maybe the Sunwell will be fixed some other way, and she'll bathe in it and undergo the same transformation as Craishae.

At any rate, I'm definitely feeling a lot more confident about the idea that Midnight will explore the rest of the continent of Lordaeron.

I guess we have an approximate timeline since Thoradin's wall was mentioned.

[Viridiel]

I guess we have an approximate timeline since Thoradin's wall was mentioned.

Yes, anywhere between 1,000 and 3,000 years ago.

[Worldshaper]

Yes, anywhere between 1,000 and 3,000 years ago.

Hmm, the short story says Thoradin's wall had "stood a stalwart sentinel over the land for generations".

It says Craishae was a "daughter of kings, descended from the line of Thoradin".

If the wall was built during Thoradin's time, around 2800 years ago, I guess that places this story at least a few hundred years later.

[Samin]

The curse in the short story is very interesting. It sounds like the Emerald Nightmare or the worgen curse, but it had to have happened a thousand years before either of those things make much sense for the area. The Emerald Nightmare is kind of the opposite of the Sacred Flame, being a combination of Fel and Void magic corrupting Life. Could it be Xavius' first attempt at spreading the Nightmare? Another mage accidentally releasing the worgen curse before Arugal? Some sort of activation of the Curse of Flesh? It could even be related to the Drust -- Kul Tiras was right next to the Arathi Highlands before the Cataclysm.

But the Scion is the most interesting thing. Her title and appearance reminds me of a constellar, but the shifting appearance thing is totally new. She also reminds me of Aegwynn's role in the Tomb of Sargeras, although she likely lived at least a thousand years after the story takes place. The temple must be vrykul or some other kind of titanforged to make sense for the time period, and we already know that there used to be a thriving vrykul civilisation on the continent, so I think a forgotten vrykul temple makes the most sense. As for the location, "where the heart of the world and the eye of heaven met" reminds me of the myth of Elune sleeping in the Well of Eternity, but also sounds like a fanciful description of the West -- where the Sun falls beneath the earth. I think it's probably in Tirisfal Glades, which should by all rights be covered in vrykul and human ruins and is where the Silver Hand comes from.

It really feels like this is setting up the continuation of Tyr's story and will be related to the "forces of Light" we fight alongside in Midnight. It's also definitely foreshadowing something for Faerin. Will she sacrifice herself to use the ember of the First Flame inside her to rekindle the snuffed Sunwell? Or maybe the Sunwell will be fixed some other way, and she'll bathe in it and undergo the same transformation as Craishae.

At any rate, I'm definitely feeling a lot more confident about the idea that Midnight will explore the rest of the continent of Lordaeron.

I was thinking it could be a much older story that had been adapted for Arathi culture. You'd think if Craishae was such a major legendary figure, the name would have persevered in Arathi and/or High Elven culture as children were named in honor (or ambition) of her. It could go back all the way to the Black Empire or even the original appearance of the Curse of Flesh. It could even be a story native to the new homeland of the Arathi that was appropriated and reframed into ancient Arathi history

It could also be an originally Vrykul story and Craishae fighting the "cursed deformities" wasn't meant to be the hero, but a villain in what would eventually also become Tyr's story. Aside from "magical inspiration/saw it in a dream" that would be the most likely explanation for the "much older story" theory to exist in Arathi folklore.

It's almost certainly going to be something more straight forward, if we ever see it referred to again at all (maybe even more likely we won't), but I like the trope.

[Nymrohd]

Faerin gets done dirty by the artists who do the artwork / CGI cinematics. You'd think she was a hard ass, but in-game she's a sweetheart.

You can look like a hardass and be a sweetheart.

[Viridiel]

I was thinking it could be a much older story that had been adapted for Arathi culture. You'd think if Craishae was such a major legendary figure, the name would have persevered in Arathi and/or High Elven culture as children were named in honor (or ambition) of her. It could go back all the way to the Black Empire or even the original appearance of the Curse of Flesh. It could even be a story native to the new homeland of the Arathi that was appropriated and reframed into ancient Arathi history

I wouldn't be surprised if the reason people don't know the story is because the first Emperor claimed he discovered the Sacred Flame instead. Emperors need mythology to legitimise their rule, and we don't know of any gods who the Arathi worship, so his claim likely had to have been that the Sacred Flame chose him somehow.

Also, I wonder if the Scion isn't an actual Archon/Light Lord. The shifting appearance makes it sound like it's some sort of immortal creature who's using a visage to appear as familiar mortal races, but the titans et al don't seem to feel the need to do that because they already look like humans. It really could be the case that the Scion is an avatar of Belore (Archon or not) or some sort of equivalent of Xal'atath for the Light.

[Worldshaper]

I wouldn't be surprised if the reason people don't know the story is because the first Emperor claimed he discovered the Sacred Flame instead. Emperors need mythology to legitimise their rule, and we don't know of any gods who the Arathi worship, so his claim likely had to have been that the Sacred Flame chose him somehow.

Also, I wonder if the Scion isn't an actual Archon/Light Lord. The shifting appearance makes it sound like it's some sort of immortal creature who's using a visage to appear as familiar mortal races, but the titans et al don't seem to feel the need to do that because they already look like humans. It really could be the case that the Scion is an avatar of Belore (Archon or not) or some sort of equivalent of Xal'atath for the Light.

I got the impression that this was just another example of women being forgotten by history. They made a big deal to point out that she was Faerin's ancestor, making references to dark skin at least once or twice.

They also pointed out that her mother was a noble from Quel'thalas, giving us yet another tangible fact about her physical origins.

So it doesn't sound like a mythological parable or anything like that.

The way the story sort of magically appeared through some Light magic in the book, but then was never to be found again, almost makes me wonder if she really was erased from history but the Light ensured Faerin would find out.

Why? To inspire her to do great deeds. To leave Hallowfall and fulfil her potential elsewhere.

Perhaps even the Scion itself was behind it. It appeared in a vision for the queen, didn't it? Encouraging her to seek it out in the wilderness.

Perhaps this was Faerin's own "vision," setting her on her own path.

[Cheezits]

Faerin gets done dirty by the artists who do the artwork / CGI cinematics. You'd think she was a hard ass, but in-game she's a sweetheart.

I think it's just Cinematic -> Artwork -> Model.

It's hard to make female humans look tough and unique because of model limitations ingame, so the cinematic and artwork is the intended look- and then ingame is about as "special" as the female human model can get, where everyone looks soft and small with big tits (as per 2004 standards)

[milkmustache]

I suppose the release of this short story along with 11.1.7's questline may not be just a coincidence. I've been hesitant on the idea that Midnight would include areas of EK in it, but I'm really starting to turn around on that. Alternatively... as a K'aresh truther, is it really possible we could go back to a new revamped Old World zone for a patch?

I'm really starting to consider the idea that 11.2 is going to be something no one expected.

[Cheezits]

I suppose the release of this short story along with 11.1.7's questline may not be just a coincidence. I've been hesitant on the idea that Midnight would include areas of EK in it, but I'm really starting to turn around on that. Alternatively... as a K'aresh truther, is it really possible we could go back to a new revamped Old World zone for a patch?

I'm really starting to consider the idea that 11.2 is going to be something no one expected.

There has to be a reason for all the Ethereals added to the backend in 11.1 and I really doubt it's just "they are all in a raid/they are all enemies" when they have so many customization variations and seem to have color coded factions.